The Steel Guitar Forum

I'm having a little trouble rocking on the A and B pedals.

My A pedal is significantly higher than my B pedal - is there an optimum height difference, or is this just an "experiment till you get it right" thing?

Because I have a modern MSA Studio Pro, changing pedal height is easy, so I'm fine with experimenting - I'm just hoping for some pointers.

Thanks!

I have my A pedal lower than B.

I can roll my foot to the left way further than to the right, so if A was higher than B I would have to take my foot right off the A pedal to press B by itself.

Not sure if this is normal or not!!

Trevor's post is pretty much exactly where I'm at. With age & decreasing joint flexibility, the #1 imperative is that the A pedal is 100% up and clear when I've rolled off it so I've got it lower than B. Not a lot. Just as much as my ankle requires.

Christopher, mine is much like yours - I have to have a definite angle to my foot to apply A+B together, but it makes rocking on and off the A pedal much easier, particularly when I only want A. I think there is no rule, except set it where you feel most comfortable making the moves. I think, on average, most people have the A-pedal slightly higher.

I addressed this to another post a new player had started. Make your pedal steel your own. Sometimes it will take multiple times of adjustments, but eventually, you'll get it exactly right, and it will even improve your playing (and your confidence!).

Depending on where your left knee levers are located, your lower leg may be addressing the A+B more or less vertically, or at a significant angle. If at an angle, the A pedal may need to be higher than the B pedal in order for the pedals to be "level" relative to your foot.

As you experiment with pedal heights one consideration is the ability to hit A and LKR , and B and LKL cleanly. Pedal travel can also be a factor. And things can feel different if you play in another pair of shoes.

I play S-12 Bb6, almost exactly Reece's last setup. LKL and A affect the same string, so no problem there

There is a big stretch over to those pedals, so I'm at an angle.

I tried the A and B at the same height - I'm pretty sure I will raise it slightly, but less than it was

Thank you, everyone - I appreciate you taking the time to respond!

I never used these pedals much, until recently, when I started playing some country tunes with a band I play guitar and steel for here in Portland.

Pete Burak enjoyed saying I was the only pedal steel player that never used his AB pedals!

I make sure both pedals bottom out in the same spot.

Whatever works for you, works for you. I kinda like 'em level with each other.
Just make sure that when you're holding down A & you rock off B, B comes all the way up.

And things can feel different if you play in another pair of shoes.

100% agreed!

My A pedal is slightly higher than the B pedal. But like Bob Hoffnar notes, they both bottom out at about the same level - the main point that I've found after 30 plus years with pedal steel.

Although I primarily play in boots, I can do equally well with other types of shoes. Shoe types should not an issue.

Chris, No problem. I don't mind giving advice to my betters... the opportunity arises so infrequently! I figured that was the issue - after playing all that easy extended-chord jazz you felt ready to tackle some difficult three-chord country!

Douglas -

I have to admit - the tradition of country steel guitar is so deep, and so beautiful, that it's oddly daunting to learn!

I can, and do, happily and comfortably play country music on six string. Playing jazz on the pedal steel is hard for me, but I am getting somewhere, at least. "E9" style country pedal steel seems much more unforgiving, and I suck, right now! Working on it, getting better....

There are a couple of factors to consider, Chris:

First, the timing issues due to the difference in pull length between the whole-step A and half-step B pedals, and how (or IF!) this is addressed depends on the mechanics of the instrument. The P/P is fairly limited in timing options, whereas some of the more modern guitars have multiple holes on the bell-cranks to facilitate precision timing of every pull.

I personally like to have the two pedals bottom out at close to the same height; on a D10 particularly the B pedal will be just a tad bit lower due to the angle of the left leg, the point being to find a natural resting place for the foot when the pedals are pressed together.

Then there are the ergonomics of the leg and ankle, and the need to be able to rock completely off of either pedal without lifting the other, and of course pressing either without moving the changer finger on the other. This may bring up slack issues, again depending on your instrument - a push-pull guitar requires some slop in the raises that an all-pull does not. Having tightened up the action and timing as much as possible, I set up the C pedal to be the same as the A pedal, then it usually takes some trial and error for me to get the B pedal rod length just right - for me the unpressed B pedal usually ends up a bit lower than the unpressed A when I'm done.

Nobody seems to have mentioned that it matters whether you have the Emmons or Day setup. This is because we tend to find our ankle rolls better to one side than the other.

I started on Emmons, and had trouble actuating B only without fouling the A. Now it's easier with the Day setup. A without B is easy either way, I think.

Will

My thanks to Dave.

I read his post and never really thought about the timing issue for A&B. Dang, after all these years ya' still learn something new. Then again, he is right about the limited timing adjustment for the A&B pedals on a push, pull, which is what my main gigging steel is.

Then again, I think I'm going to take another look at the slack in my guitars.

What about having your pedals set for playing on carpet, then you have to play on a hardwood floor
of some kind. I've had to lower my B pedal down further because of not being able to rock off the B on to the A far enough, when switching to a hard wood floor. Has anybody had this problem? It don't take but a minute to do the adjustment, but it's kind of agravating.
terry

Terry Sneed wrote:What about having your pedals set for playing on carpet, then you have to play on a hardwood floor
of some kind. I've had to lower my B pedal down further because of not being able to rock off the B on to the A far enough, when switching to a hard wood floor. Has anybody had this problem? It don't take but a minute to do the adjustment, but it's kind of agravating.
terry

Terry, have had this problem, especially on deep pile carpet. What I did was cut sheet of plywood just large enough to sit my steel and seat on it and then painted it so it wouldn't look bad. Didn't have to make anymore adjustments. Never played anywhere that had carpet that I had to worry about making adjustments.

If you are switching back and forth from carpet to wood a lot, I think I would opt for a piece of plywood to set the steel on.

I use large medicine bottle caps , are the things you put under coffee cups, to keep from marking your finished tables. These were good on carpet so that you don't have to readjust your pedals. It beats carrying a round a sheet of plywood. And you can put them in your pack seats after playing.

Thanks Mike, Scott, and Willie. Hmmm, Well it would be kind of hard to be carrying around a large piece of plywood, and since I play at different Churches, I'm not sure the Pastors would like me laying a piece of plywood down on their fancy flooring.
Willie, are you talkin about coasters? I might give that a try. Thanks again fellers.
terry

What Bob H. said. The A pedal has a longer throw to raise a whole step than the B pedal raising a half. Also, the A pedal is frequently half pedaled so a longer throw helps. It is usually set slightly higher than B so that they bottom out at the same height. Ultimately its all a matter of preference, so set the height however you like!

These are how mine are adjusted. I play the Day setup. P1 is a special pedal. P2 is my C pedal. P3 is my B pedal. P4 is my A pedal. P5 lowers string 5 to Bb with a split tuner to be used along with pedal 4 to get the C note. I never subscribed to the thought that the pedals should start or end at all the same level. They are adjusted for the ability to let of adjacent pedals while still holding down a pedal. With my leg at an angle, I don't find it advantageous to have the pedals be all level when pressed. That's not how my foot works. I imagine this same setup would be what I would have if I used the Emmons setup (starting with P2). My foot works with the same rocking motions.