The Steel Guitar Forum

Hi fellas. I'm looking for some recommendations for upgrading my Rondo SX. This thing buzzes like I've never heard anything buzz before, even with the tone control all the way down. Is this mostly the pick-up or do the potentiometers have anything to do with it? Are there any decent pick-ups out there in the $50 dollar range that would not require re-routing the pick-up cavity?

Also, the wood is super soft and lightweight and the Les Paul Jr bridge is sinking into it. I like some of the bridge replacements I've seen on this forum made from steel angles but I'm not too confident on slotting the bridge myself. Is there anywhere I can get a bridge like that that's already slotted? I'd want to do a string-through thing too if I used a bridge like that. Do I need to consider how far back from the bridge the holes need to be drilled?

I'm a complete newb on working on my own stuff and want to use the Rondo as a way to learn so any advice is greatly appreciated! Thanks!

James

Is the buzz you're experiencing hum from the pickups, or unwanted vibrations from a string? Does it happen only when plugged in?
More information please.
There are a number of discussions of pickups and other upgrades to the Rondo SX lap steels. Do a search and you'll find plenty to keep you busy.

Sorry, I thought about hopping onto one of the many Rondo threads with my questions, I just didn't want to hi-jack someone else's thread. Anyway, It's definitely that single coil hum(buzz was a poor choice of words probably)--it's just more extreme then I've ever heard on any guitar. I'm wondering if just replacing the pick-up will help that(with a stacked humbucker maybe?) or do I need to replace the potentiometers as well? Or is it just a grounding issue? I know nothing about electronics and some of the discussions on the forum in regards to electronics quite frankly go right over my head. As soon as the word ohm is mentioned I'm lost!

If the hum goes away when the volume is down then you're good to go with a replacement pickup... I favor the Seymour Duncan, I'm going to put a Hot Rails into one of my Champs and see what it does.

Of course, this pickup costs as much as your entire guitar... you'll always be facing that. Perhaps you can find a cheaper single-space HB... good luck. Or maybe, like me, you've got lots of extra guitar junk laying around to play with.

If you hear more hum than on any other guitar, the problem might be a grounding problem. Maybe there is a loose connection somewhere inside the guitar causing that extra hum.

When the hum occurs and you touch the strings, is there a change in the hum? If so, the strings might not be grounded.
One way to test this is to use a short piece of electrical wire with both ends bare. Hold one bare end firmly to the metal outside of the jack plug and touch several other metal parts of the guitar with the other bare end. Include the backs or the metal shafts of the potentiometers. If there is no change, it is not a grounding problem.

Another thing to try is to replace the cable. Does that make a difference?

When you hear the hum and you rotate the direction of the guitar, if it makes a lot of difference, it might be the pickup.

You could also try a different amp if you have one.

Which Rondo SX do you have ... the one with the Strat size single coil or the one with a P90?

Tom, it's got the strat style pick-up in it. Peter, I've tried the steel through many amps and have used different cables and it has the same hum, although I've never tried rotating the guitar. I'll usually sit or stand fairly close to the amp so I can make any adjustments I need to make. Thanks for the tips! Maybe I'm just annoyed by the single coil sound. I've always preferred/played Gibson guitars and the Rondo is the first axe I've ever owned with a single coil, though I've played my share of Teles and Strats and never noticed a hum this bad. I'm thinking I'll replace the pick up with a humbucker and go from there. Thanks!

James

The Wallace TruTone is a nice pickup and reasonably priced.

John Limbach wrote:The Wallace TruTone is a nice pickup and reasonably priced.

Jerry does a great job on those TrueTones, reasonably priced and very nice tone. The problem would be though that its also a single coil and still prone to the 60 cycle hum. That and it would take some routing to fit.

For a drop in replacement you could try one of the many Strat sized dual blade humbuckers. Being a rail design also means that you don't have to worry about pole spacing matching your new bridge.
Maybe something like this Bill Lawrence rail http://wildepickups.com/Wilde_Bill_s_Twin_Blades.html

For a bridge, any of the hard tail string through styles will work. Bezdez on Ebay has several different hardtail styles. Measure the old post holes, but something like this might cover them
http://www.ebay.com/itm/CHROME-TRAPEZOI ... 2eb3e747d7

As far as pots, I'd first try what you got and if its too dark, then swap in some 500K audio tapers with a .022 cap. Alternatively, if its too bright, go with 250k audio and a .047 cap.

Tom, thank you so much! That's exactly the info I was hoping to get. I do love those Bill Lawrence pick-ups, I have one in my Melbert pro 8.

BTW, I'm a huge fan of your work!

James

Always glad to help if I can James. One thing I forgot to mention is to make sure you ground the new bridge. The Gibson style bridge it came with typically has a wire run from the bushing post hole to the control cavity. Depending on how the new bridge works out, you may be able to re-use the existing route and just add a longer wire, if not, you will need to drill a new path. Depending on how it lays out, you can either go direct to the control cavity or if easier, go to the pickup cavity and route through there to the control cavity.

BTW, I'm a huge fan of your work!

Thanks, they are a labor of love and I consider myself lucky to have the opportunity to create them.

Here is a sneak peek of a cool dual pickup 8 stringer I'm finishing up.


. .

Speaking of rotating the guitar, I had put a terrific sounding pickup in my old Melobar (Vintage Vibe Guitars blade -- vaguely like a Strat-size Charlie Christian). Loved the tone, but in many rooms, it hummed like crazy but ONLY when I played lap style. If I flipped up the instrument like a Spanish guitar, the hum went away.

Eventually, I went back to the Bill Lawrence twin blade that came with the Melobar -- it's voice like a high-output humbucker, so it doesn't have the single coil tone, but it also doesn't have the hum.

Some day I'll put the Vintage Vibe p'up in a standard guitar. Pete Biltoft makes amazing pickups.

Another choice to consider is one of the Fender 'Noiseless' Strat pickups. While I haven't used one in a steel yet, I have successfully replaced generic noisy single coils in a couple of electric guitars with these, and am delighted with the results.

I've bought all mine used (either here, or on eBay). One of the biggest challenges you'll face is that Fender has changed the specs of these multiple times over the years, so it's almost impossible to figure out what pot and cap values you should use. Just let your ears be the judge - those bits are inexpensive, and easy to swap in and out.

James Weigel wrote:Hi fellas. I'm looking for some recommendations for upgrading my Rondo SX. Are there any decent pick-ups out there in the $50 dollar range that would not require re-routing the pick-up cavity?

I bought two of these in 2010 and wanted to put in humcancelling replacements for the stock strat-style pickups. I put an old Seymour Duncan Hot Rails strat pickup I had around in the first one. I bought a new SD JB Jr pickup for the second one but it did not mount as easily because the bottom plate was actually a printed circuit board (made in China as I learned later.) The strat-style pickup screws into the bottom of the pickup cavity so the mounting screws need to go through the bottom of the pickup. With the old style SD pickups it was easy to enlarge the holes in the bottom plate- in the new style JB Jr there was a threaded metal bushing on the bottom plate which could not be enlarged.

So make sure that the bottom plate is not a printed circuit board with a threaded metal bushing. The SD strat-sized humbuckers usually cost around $80. I would recommend the Hot Rails. You can probably find a used one for much less than that on eBay but make sure that it has a traditional bottom plate.

Also, the wood is super soft and lightweight and the Les Paul Jr bridge is sinking into it.

I arranged the saddles in a straight line as far back as they would go and then lowered the mounting bolts until the front of the bridge was resting solidly against the wood body (otherwise it would rock back and forth which sucks tone.) Doing that worked for me. (I didn't feel like drilling holes through the body to mount a replacement bridge made from angle stock.) BTW make sure that the bridge is grounded- run a wire to it if necessary.

Steve Ahola

P.S. The Fender Noiseless strat pickups are usually sold in sets of 3 but you might be able to get a good deal on a single pickup on eBay.