Bandmaster Reverb Head ?

Paul Sutherland · Post by **Paul Sutherland** » 22 Feb 2012 11:02 am

What are your thoughts on an early 70s Bandmaster Reverb head? Non master volume; probably TFL5005D. Assume it's in good condition and all systems work properly.

Would it have enough power for low volume gigs, particularly where the amp is miked into a large house system? Would it actually do a better job for low volume situations than a Twin Reverb/Dual Showman that had to be turned down to keep the volume under control?

Would it be a good amp for recording?

Mike Schwartzman · Post by **Mike Schwartzman** » 22 Feb 2012 1:37 pm

I was asking myself the very same questions a couple of years ago. I had an early 70's BMR head that I had put into a into a combo cab with a 15" Weber speaker.

I would not hesitate to (and I did) record with it as. It recorded beautifully.
At that time, I felt that it was fine for a small quiet gig, but not enough clean power for anything larger. So I made the following changes to clean it up a bit:
1. Put a lower gain preamp tube in the V2 position.
2.Swapped the Bandmaster Rev. output transformer with a beefier Bassman output transformer.
Even given those changes, I would probably feel more comfortable with a Twin Reverb for steel in a gigging situation. It's a winner in the studio though. That's my take. One of these days I'd like to stick a JBL or similar in there.

Asa Brosius · Post by **Asa Brosius** » 23 Feb 2012 9:49 am

I used a '69 BMR with a 15 cab on the road for a few months. Low volume it is- great for miked gigs. I absolutely love it as a guitar amp, but needed more headroom for steel. Ultimately I moved to a twin, which admittedly offers too much volume for most gigs I play now, but why not have it in reserve, since we're already in a similar amp weight class-
Never had the chance to use it in the studio, but I can't imagine it would be lacking.

Asa

Bill Hatcher · Post by **Bill Hatcher** » 23 Feb 2012 1:49 pm

for e9 pedal steel no.

for underarm guitar..yes!

lap steel yes.

Clete Ritta · Post by **Clete Ritta** » 24 Feb 2012 1:08 am

Ive got two Bandmaster heads (non reverb). A blackface 66 and a silverface 71. They both sound good for steel at lower volume and awesome for guitar when turned up. The silverface is a bit cleaner overall. Speakers and cabs make a difference as well. I like an open back single 15" JBL K-130 4 ohm cab for steel, and the stock 2X12" (2 Jensen P12N 8 ohms ea. = 4 ohm) closed back cab for guitar.

Clete

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 24 Feb 2012 3:00 am

Below is just my opinion...

I wonder why so many think that a Twin or DS is too loud and can't be controlled ? The issue for Steel players is not the low volume but rather the clean tone as we get up near 4 or 5 on the BMaster amps, it's not there...it will drive you crazy. For a 6 string, different deal, if you desire a little bit of edge, these are fine amps..

I am personally not a big fan of Bandmaster Reverbs, don't get me wrong, I like them but they are my least favorite Fender amps, including the BF 64 thru 67 Bm heads, They just don't have enough "gas pedal"...

Not sure what" controlling the volume" on a Twin or DS reverb means as each of these amps has the same volume going up the knob, the difference is at 4 or 5 ,the TWIN and DS keep going while the BM stalls and is no longer clean.The main difference is that the Twin chassis (4x6L6) will stay clean all the way up to 5 and beyond while the 2x6L6 chassis will break up before it gets to 5... A Twin ( DS) on 2 or 3 is not twice as loud as a Bandmaster on 2 or 3 ...A Twin on 2 or 3 does not offer less sonic tone because it is on 2 or 3 ...( TWIN ='s Dual Showman reverb also )

For Steel Guitars the DShowman Reverb is the better choice in my opinion...plus it weighs just about the same .

I have several of these Fender amps in my small collection and thus this is how I arrived at my opinion...which I understand only matters to me !

t

Paul Sutherland · Post by **Paul Sutherland** » 24 Feb 2012 10:08 am

Thanks to all for your replies. I've been trying to work a trade with a couple guys in the Sacramento; one has a Dual Showman Reverb with a dead reverb and one has a Bandmaster Reverb. I'm thinking I should hold out for a properly functioning DSR (or Twin), as the Bandmaster would be too limited in when it could be used to full advantage.

Steve Hinson · Post by **Steve Hinson** » 24 Feb 2012 10:35 am

I have owned two Bandmasters...a silver face drip edge regular Bandmaster in high school and a Bandmaster Reverb a few years ago...I didn't even like them for electric guitar...I found them to be gutless...I like an amp to be loud and clean-there are plenty of overdrive pedals if you need an overdriven sound...I guess it depends on what size places you are playing in,but I never could use anything smaller than a Twin,and preferred two Twins with JBL speakers(for electric guitar)...I guess that would probably work for steel,too.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 24 Feb 2012 2:37 pm

Steve Hinson wrote: I never could use anything smaller than a Twin,and preferred two Twins with JBL speakers(for electric guitar)

Holy Moly Steve ! The last person I saw use two Twins was Brent at 3rd and Lindsley, I have to admit, I caved..I hid in the corner behind the bar..!

I'm weak...I admit it.. but it did sound great !

I asked Brent at break, how do you do that ..

he replied , laughing..." What did you say " ?

I also totally agree with the BM analysis, I am looking across my room at a full fledged 64 BM head and cab, an original set that I acquired and restored, I love to look at it, but it sounds like crud ! There is nothing it offers that remotely resembles a Twin, a Super Reverb or a Deluxe Reverb...or even the 64 Tremolux set I have( that's a bad boy) It's like something went astray with the Band Masters...the bad child I guess...

Dual Showman Reverb...excellent choice for Steelers...lopsided weight though. If I didn't have a Twin I would be using the DSR as the primary amp either with a 2x12 cab or 2 single 12 cabs.

t

Bob Carlucci · Post by **Bob Carlucci** » 24 Feb 2012 3:18 pm

I have had 2 of them.. IMHO, you won't like it for pedal steel.. Something about the comination of the small transformer and the tube rectifier perhaps.. The small transformer works fine with a standard bandmaster, and the tube rectifier works great with the Super reverb, but this is a hybrid of those two amps.. I loved my Supers for steel and my non reverb bandmasters for steel, but hated both my Bandmaster Reverbs.. No headroom and just not that good sounding. Just not enough power either.
thats just me, maybe someone else likes them, but I was disappointed ... twice... bob

Clete Ritta · Post by **Clete Ritta** » 24 Feb 2012 3:38 pm

Tony Prior wrote:...64 BM head and cab, an original set that I acquired and restored...

What kind of speakers are in your cab? I know that they used a few different brands through the years, Oxford, Jensen, Utah, Celestion etc. maybe even JBL in a custom.
Just curious.

Clete

Pete Burak · Post by **Pete Burak** » 24 Feb 2012 3:45 pm

Dual Showman Reverb...excellent choice for Steelers...lopsided weight though. If I didn't have a Twin I would be using the DSR as the primary amp either with a 2x12 cab or 2 single 12 cabs.

With regard to the DSR being lopsided...
I have one, and have been thinking I might put it on end with the heavy end down, then putting a handle on top, and some nice rubber feet on the bottom.
I use mine with a verticle 2x12" cab, so this would also conserve stage space.
I would leave the original handle and feet on there also.
Not sure if the BMR is as heavy/lopsided.

Steve Hinson · Post by **Steve Hinson** » 24 Feb 2012 3:51 pm

I started using two Twins in 1986 when I went to work playing guitar with George Jones...we were playing big places and I wanted to get a big,clean sound...both the amps were blackface and had JBL D120F speakers in 'em...George loved that sound and tried to buy my guitar and amps so that"the next'un'll sound like that too"...I still got 'em...

We did several tours with Merle Haggard and he had a blackface Twin too(one)...his FOH guy said after the first night"Merle wants to know why his amp don't sound like yours"...of course I told him he needed two,and they needed those speakers in them...seems like they got him the speakers but still only one amp...he still didn't have
a guitar like mine(old)...actually he did but seems like he was in the Tuff-Dogs by this time.

Bandmasters,Supers,Pros are all great amps,but they will NOT be clean in a big place...voltage has much to do with this too...a Variac used to be the ticket because the amp got what it was looking for...I really don't know if today's tubes will hold up to that or not...it's impossible to get modern tubes to equal what we used to get...NOS are cost-prohibitive...

I am using the Mesa Boogie Studio Pre and Mosvalve 962 discovered for us by Paul Franklin...I LOVE it...it is TROUBLE FREE and he played 'em on about a million hits...and you heard it...it sounds GREAT.Sorry for the long post...SH

Steve Hinson · Post by **Steve Hinson** » 24 Feb 2012 4:08 pm

Oh yeah,I almost forgot...I still use Peaveys in big places for steel...

John Hanusch · Post by **John Hanusch** » 28 Feb 2012 11:11 am

This makes a package to push a little more nice, clean air. Essentially, a Dual Showman head now. Though as Peter mentioned, it wants to tip you over.

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Bandmaster Reverb Head ?

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