The Steel Guitar Forum

Hello,

I want to try to lower 6th string G# two step to E.at one of my knee levers.
Has anyone experience with this. Wich combination, licks, clips, records, etc..

Regards,

Marcel Parijs

I've never heard of anyone doing that. I kinda doubt that you will get the changer to move that far. I sometimes have problems reaching F#. From G# down to E is a HUGE move.
I hope you use a .020 because I doubt a .022 stands a chance.

Marcel,

Paul Franklin uses this drop on one of his steels.

http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... b7af295faf

steelguitarforum.com/Forum5/HTML/002508.html

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YOZ0BY_V ... re=related

I've been playing around with it, and while fun, I'm not convinced there isn't something more useful.

Tim

The change definitely has a "wow" factor upon hearing it and displays the mechanical capabilities of our instrument. I just have never found a musical use for it. I worked with a singer who had a song that had that change on the record, but I never added it though.

I'm actually wondering if anyone has managed to put a successful feel stop at the F# - I think that would make the difference in practicality. Anybody do that?

How about if you raise 1 a whole tone, 2 a half and lower 6 2 full tones, plus the pull on the C neck....doesn't that make the lever really stiff?

My MSA Legend handles this change (2 whole tone lower, G# to E)) and I had it on there for a few months. I ditched it and the popular G# to F# in favor of raising the 7th string a whole tone which I believe has far more uses. I also have kept the G# to B change on the 6th string and use it a lot.

http://gregcutshaw.com/Msa/Copedant.html



Greg

Tim Miller wrote:I'm actually wondering if anyone has managed to put a successful feel stop at the F# - I think that would make the difference in practicality. Anybody do that?

Tim, I don't think the old-school half-stop like Michael Yahl (and probably lotsa other folks too) sells would have a lick of problem with that.
I even bet it'd install on that push-pull of yours

Marcel, I tried exactly that by making an extra long bellcrank.
You can hear a rough test-recording here.
I took it off because the bellcrank was too long for the case and I did not have the time to make a gear-down set-up.

Peter, you could use a second bellcrank/shaft to provide extra travel.
Use longest hole on the one on the knee lever, going to the shortest hole on a second crank, and the longest hole on the second crank pulls the finger.
Easiest on round-shafted guitars, where you could leave the slave crank loose on an uninvolved axle, but you could do it on about any guitar

I use a .022PL string and it goes 4 frets down just fine. If your using a .022 wound it might be a lot harder to do.

Greg

My Mullen g 2 will do it but i can cheat with a little practice it can be done very close to what Paul did .i do the 6th whole lower from the raised b pedal and just as the 6th starts to fade out, i pick the 8 then 6th and raise it back up to raised 6th with b pedal,play with it and you get what i did.

Yes Lane, that is what I meant with a "gear-down".
That particular guitar had hex-shafts unfortunately.
But thanks for the explanation. That will definately help others if they want to try it.

If you have hex shafts, you can still do it, but you'll need another shaft dedicated for the gear-up. Knee lever shaft, highest hole (if you use comb-style bellcranks, one end will have to face backwards) to gear-up shaft, lowest hole. Another pullrod (possibly on the same bellcrank, or you could offset the master/primary rod to keep it out of the way of the B pedal, but slave/secondary will have to line up with 6th string, of course) from highest hole, secondary/gear-up shaft to the lower finger.

Personally, the change doesn't sound that dang useful, but I have to admit I've never played it

I have G#'s to G's on a lever, and sometimes I tune it to do the 6th string G#>E.
That is a fun change that just happens to work easily on my Sierra S12U.
I sounds cool.
I first learned it from Jonathan Cullifer, who was playing a new Franklin at a Convention a few years back.
I think I heard it was originaly used on a specific hit song by PF.

You can get a similar effect if you have your 7th string F# raised to G# and lowered to E. I had a guitar set up like that once.

b0b, that sounds like a good alternative. May give that a try (as soon as I can get another steel).

Thanks Guys for the reactions.

I change this yesterday on my LKL2. Sounds great. I must get used it a little bit. Only I hope I don´t break this string earlyer. It´s also raised 1.5 tone.
Did anyone now if Tommy White use this string to lower 2 tones?

Marcel

Pete Burak wrote:I think I heard it was originaly used on a specific hit song by PF.

This one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_-QQk6WC2p4

I may be wrong, but I was told that Paul has his LKV set up with rods for both the G# to E lower and G# to B raise, so he can switch between these two changes without flipping the guitar over or changing any rods.

With a plain string, it's not nearly as long a pull as you'd expect, especially with a .020p, like Paul's uses. I've tried the change on my Emmons and Excel guitars with a .022p...both can handle it just fine and I never broke a string. I set it up on my LKV, and split it with the B pedal to get an F#.

b0b wrote:You can get a similar effect if you have your 7th string F# raised to G# and lowered to E. I had a guitar set up like that once.

With the 6th string G# to E lower, you can move seamlessly from the E (with the LKV) to A (with the B pedal). You also get a pretty different sound because it's a plain string. Though having both changes separately on the 7th string is probably a lot more useful.

As fun as it is, it's not particularly useful to me, so I put the B to Bb lowers back on the LKV after about a month.