The Steel Guitar Forum

I just switched from a tube amp to a NV 1000. The clean tone, especially with a good EQ or Sonic Maximizer, is just amazing and what I'm looking for.

However, I play a handful of songs with a tube screamer on, and while in the past it's given me excellent tone, with the NV 1000 I get that harsh transistor-y ugliness solid state amps are known for. Especially out the XLR direct out.

Any suggestions on a good way around this?

Thanks gang!

I'll be interested in this, too. I haven't found a solution, an equalizer pedal helps a little, add some mids in, but still sounds pretty crappy to my ears.

I've been wondering why some of these guys use tube preamps with their Peaveys, maybe that would help?

I like the Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Classic tube pedal. It's got two channels and an EQ section too.

You might want to give a try for Brad Sarno's EarthDrive instead of the tube screamer. Its an overdrive designed for steel with no harshness and can handle the hot pickups of a steel. Can be used for lots of different sounds and amounts of overdrive and distortion. I luv mine.

It seems like Brad is out of Earth Drive pedals for now, but either that or an overdrive pedal that uses a tube as Bryan suggested would be good options to warm up your overdriven sound.

Justin, I have a similar problem with my NV-112. It seems it has built in compression to clean the sound up. It's hard to get that dirty sound I'm looking for, but I love the clean sound. Don't know if a NV-1000 has a compressor or not. You might also try the post loop.

Doug

Guess it all depends on how you define "good" sound..For me there's no good distorted sound with ss..JMHO..

I agree with Papa Joe. With a SS amp I usually skip overdrive and go for Fuzz instead.

You people need to contact Chuck Back @ Desert Rose Steel Guitars.

He gets the best overdriven guitar sound I've ever heard out of his MB200 and MB500 amps. Don't know what pedals he uses (I don't play guitar) but sure smokes any other rig I've ever heard!

Ask anyone who's ever heard him play........

Steel pickups are so powerful that a lot of guitar effects, designed for a 10K output maximum, just can't deal with it. I use an SS bass amp most of the time (SWR SM500) and the best drive-in-a-box I've found has been using some of the amp models on a Digitech RP250. I have some good overdrive pedals, Tubeworks Real Tube, Arion Stereo Overdrive, a few Tube Screamer-derivatives, but they all need to have the steel's output attenuated first = an extra box, extra stage of drive, extra space.... I find pedalboard bling to be tiresome. If there's a box you just have to use, re-EQ'ing both the signal going in and coming out will do it.

IMO, a tubescreamer type is best used pushing a tube amp, hitting the pre-amp with a strong signal. A better choice for a N-1000 could be found with a device that has a sound of its own and can be used without overdriving the N-1000's circuits; that is, an output level control.

OK, I prefer a tube amp also. But with that said, I manage to get a decent pushed-tube-amp type of sound using a Seymour Duncan Twin Tube Classic into a Pod 2 set on a pretty clean Deluxe Reverb emulation into a Peavey amp like the NV 112 or NV 1000. It's a little easier with the NV 112 because the NV 1000 really is a complete clean-machine, and the Blue Marvel speaker gives more than the Black Widow - probably best to use the power amp in. But I always need to experiment to see what's best.

The Duncan straight into the Peavey works OK, but it's better with the Pod (I also have Digitech RP350 that works pretty well also). Just take out all the Pod effects except maybe reverb or delay (if you want them), and be willing to play with it till you get what something reasonable. I messed around with my old Pod 2 for a long time to get it close to my real 65 Deluxe Reverb. I used a Celestion Vintage 30 in my DR back then, and thus use the AC-15 speaker emulation in the Pod - it covers up some of the inaccuracies in the DR model, to my ears, and gives just a bit of extra midrange breakup when pushed - both with the real speaker and the emulation.

These days I generally just bring my Princeton Reverb for guitar, so if I want a tubey sound, I just plug into that. But this works if I really only have room for my pedal steel amp. YMMV, it depends on your personal tastes, and all that.

Just noticed Bobby Snell's post - I couldn't agree more - never try to overdrive an uber-clean pedal steel amp. The effects end has to have its own sound, and use the steel amp to simply amplify it.

I would be inclined to agree that SS distortion sucks. However, the Webb Galaxy amp I have, as I understand it's basically a 614e with a distortion section that to me, sounds better than any of my tube amps and/or any pedal I have tried for a variety of types of distortion. It's on the bright side, no doubt, but great compression, grit, and clarity. I especially like how well it handles lower notes. I love it for guitar and steel.
Tom Bradshaw mentioned he might start making these again, mine is most likely from the 90's? Dunno.

I've been real happy with both the Earth Drive and the SD Twin Tube Classic running into a PV or Gk Mb200.

My favorite lap steel sound is a Ricky Bakelite thru a late 50's tweed deluxe, but for regular working gigs, the Earth Drive and the MB200 is good enough.
The lap is an old Kay with a Lollar Chicago pickup in it. A sample can be heard at about 1:45 min in this video clip.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZH0OXnEk-Es

I could turn up the ED more and get it dirtier, but this was the tone I was looking for that night. Speaker is a single Peavey BW 12". Is this the level of dirt you wanted?

I'll look into the Earth Drive - seems pretty cool.

I previously used a vintage tube screamer with a Peavey Deuce (ss preamp, tube power amp) and it sounded great.

This is really to get that lofi, midrangy dirty lap steel sound rather than some sort of full range overdrive. So the tube screamer does that perfectly, but not with the big-bottom bright-top hi-fi NV 1000 sound I've got going.

Maybe I'll look into designing something myself - sounds like a fun little project!

We voiced (voicing being the overall EQ shape) the Earth Drive to be steel friendly. So many great overdrive pedals have an issue with steel in that they remove TOO MUCH of the low end, the mid-bass, the fat fullness. A tube screamer for example, is a big giant midrange booster. Sounds great for many things, but for steel, it seems to make it sound small and too guitar-like. The Earth Drive is much more neutral and natural sounding. Also, the high end and the overdrive harmonic character is warm and pretty friendly with transistor amps. We'll have them to demo at the ISGC this weekend, but we're down to our last 4 units until late September when our new batch of chassis is scheduled to be finished.

Brad

www.sarnomusicsolutions.com

I have a Twin Tube for sale. J Craft, call me let's talk.

Larry Behm
971-219-8533

Could someone post a you tube example of a good distortion sound, and then an example of a bad distortion sound? Opinions on this subject seem as different as night and day. I don't think I have ever heard a distortion device used on a steel guitar show in the last 38 years. I was going to use one on a steel show this Spring, and several people threatened to not attend the show. I guess they wanted to hear repeats of old Ray Price songs like "Way To Servive". Almost all the music young people listen to has distortion. I ask some young people about this and they said: "Guitar without distortion is old fashioned". I would love to play in a situation where I could use distortion. In the two bands I play in presently, if I attempted to use any type of distortion it would vacate the building. Audiences of today are as divided as night and day. I personal love distortion as much as I do clean and clear.

Robert Randolph gets a nice fat distortion tone in this clip, only problem is he uses tube amps. I can't recall ever hearing him use a classic clean steel tone.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nw9xvy1DWsk

This is me playing around with a NV-112 and an old Boss-Tone. My break is around the 1:00 mark.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zq2ig1xWARU

To me, it all depends on what kind of music you want to play and what kind of distorted sound you're looking for. An raunchy overdriven sound? A buzzy sound like a fuzzbox? A smooth singing distortion? Preamp tone circuits, speakers, and cabinets factor into the tone too.

If I were using a steel amp, I'd set the tone controls so they 'color' the sound as little as possible and I'd use a stompbox that simulates the distortion and tone of an overdriven tube amp. There are stompboxes out there that are 'voiced' to sound like old tube amps and add their own 'color' to the tone.

Wish I had a bass player like Robert Randolph has.

The best distortion I've ever heard from a SS amp is the sound it makes when it hits the ground after being dropped from a tall building

Keith Hilton wrote:Wish I had a bass player like Robert Randolph has.

That guy can get the groove on, can't he?

I hate to be a snot, but I find myself wishing I had a bass player like me. I mean, I'd be so responsive....