Playing without set-lists or rehersals.............

S.M. Johnson · Post by **S.M. Johnson** » 29 May 2011 8:58 am

A recent comment was made here on the Forum a couple of weeks back wherein the poster remarked that he was unfamiliar with many of the songs that were played on a recent gig and was somewhat overwhelmed that he was expected to more or less back-up most of the tunes and play solo's in nearly every tune as he was the primary lead instrument.

My question is: How many of you would find a one night stand with a working band of good, sober musicians, playing classic old country, pop, early day rock, to be a major mental, stress filled event if a rehersal or chord charts weren't provided?

I understand in days of old, these things weren't provided
as a standard item. Just curious...........

Dave Hopping · Post by **Dave Hopping** » 29 May 2011 9:25 am

A situation like this is usually what you get when a band has to have a sub for one night.It's up to the band to vet the substitute player for competence to do the job,and it's up to the substitute player to vet the setlist to make sure he's up to the job-and if he's being professional about it,maybe woodshed a few things.Especially if he's interested in the position.Every sub gig is an audition.

If we are talking about a garden-variety bar/private function kind of gig,then the band is likely to leave out the complicated stuff and go with simpler material everybody can wing.Everyone just grits their teeth and plows through the performance.If either the band or the sub is going to start freaking out about it then it's time either to get another sub or cancel the gig.

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 29 May 2011 9:35 am

Easy answer for me, I request a song list ahead of the gig., mandatory. I don't need charts or a rehearsal for a fill in situation, but the set list ahead of time is a mandatory thing for me. Generally speaking , the fill in gigs that I take which are for Steel or Guitar, I am pretty familiar with the set lists which have been sent. The songs I do not know I run up to Rhapsody and chart them.

Now, if someone says they don't use a set list I tell them that I am probably the wrong player for them as I really like to be prepared ahead of time, and quite frankly, If I am the lead player they want me to be !

If they still tell me they are not sending a list , that pretty much defines the nest I would be going into and I most likely would decline the gig. Going in totally blind would end up a reflection on my abilities, right or wrong.

Ok, if they tell me they are playing stock traditional country, Haggard, Waylon, Jackson, Jones , Buck etc...I'll go but I do advise them that although I am very familiar with traditional material there may be a few that stump me and I may have to fake them......If they are ok with that then all is a go.

Historically I have over prepared for fill in gigs, the gigs were way less demanding than I anticipated and from that I get repeat calls for gigs and they also pass my name on to others. At the end of the day, nothing beats being prepared...I have also never been denied a set list either...

If we are hired to play LEAD guitar or Steel, if we don't know the song how do we play the signature or turn around lines ? How do we kick it off without being wrong ? What do the people who may be listening think about our playing ?

t

Bob Vantine · Post by **Bob Vantine** » 29 May 2011 11:26 am

Back in the 80s/90s I thrived on fill in work. Got to be that I payed more attention when not knowing what was next. I was lucky to be extremely busy back then.I'd even take holiday gigs that other players would cancel out on . At one point I packed a Bass & 6 stringer cuz I never bothered to ask what I'd be playin ...didn't care , cuz I WAS playin . Only thing that bothered me at times was within a few songs they were trying to follow my lead playing instead of sticking to there regular sound .It helped that none of us were strangers & were all good friends ....doesn't seam that easy going anymore . Of coarse most are gone now also .

My regular band during this time did a lot of TRUE VALUE SHOWDOWN type gigs both as contestants & staff bands thru the years ,also opening for Nashville acts and we would practice a certain set to death ,timing everything down to the second .... and I hated it !

Also after first marriage went down the tubes ... it was better to stay home during the week,and not doing rehersal & be able to play weekends VS losing everything & not playing at all .

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 29 May 2011 11:48 am

I did a lot of "fill in" jobs in the late 80's and never had a play list. It was all go on the job cold. Fortunately there were very few songs that I didn't know or could follow. These were all bar and club jobs. If it had been a show type gig that is different and you need to know what's happening ahead of time on those.

Except for the road jobs I've done with "Nashville" singers and recording sessions, I haven't done any rehersals for years. The jobs I'm doing now are all traditional (old) country that I've played a thousand times so no rehersal is needed.

Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 29 May 2011 12:14 pm

If I'm filling in for a classic country,old rock,or Southern rock,all I ask is just clue me in on the keys.

YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.

Les Anderson · Post by **Les Anderson** » 29 May 2011 12:41 pm

I cannot recall a time when I was invited to sit in for a one night fill in and not be supplied with, or I requested, a set list and with the chords or get a tape or CD to give me a day or two rehearsal time; even if it was a home bound rehearsal. Not too many reputable bands play spontaneously as the night wears on. If they do, you can expect some God awful screw ups throughout the evening.

I can think of too many other ways to embarrass myself on a stage.

Papa Joe Pollick · Post by **Papa Joe Pollick** » 29 May 2011 12:43 pm

I've played hundreds of fill ins with Traditioal country R&R R&B and pop..All I ask is the name of the song and key..If It's something that I'm not familar with I'll depend on the bass to lead me through.If he fails, I'll fall on my ass..

Lee Baucum · Post by **Lee Baucum** » 29 May 2011 12:45 pm

I prefer to have a set list. A rehearsal would be nice, too. I'm the kind of guy that likes to wear both a belt and suspenders, though!

Looking at it from a different perspective, I believe we owe the people hiring us the duty to play well. The group may be made up of good musicians, but if they don't perform well as an ensemble, it isn't fair to the people paying the group.

I don't play in bar bands. The band I currently play with performs at a lot of fund raisers for non-profits. We also play for wedding receptions and corporate events. We try to have a polished show with well-rehearsed sets. We play well and usually get paid well, too. Over the years, I have witnessed several other groups in the area that were obviously thrown together at the last minute, with pickup musicians. Lots of "dead air" between songs, as they discussed each song prior to the kick-off, and then the usual train wrecks along the way. Not very professional.

Richard Sinkler · Post by **Richard Sinkler** » 29 May 2011 1:00 pm

I used to gig with a band about once a month, it was the newer country that is on the charts at the time, and I would get the set lists ahead of time to work on my parts. Then I get to the gig and find out there is no lead guitar player and I have to cover his parts. Fortunately, I heard the song enough that I could fake the parts. Now THAT is stress.

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 29 May 2011 1:21 pm

I would never do a gig without a set list and keys given prior to the job. There is an amateur mentality out there amongst some bands. You show up unrehearsed, dress like a bum, with lousy equipment and sing off key. Also, no one tunes up to a common source. I gladly developed a reputation of turning these gigs down. To the point where I was accused of having a big head. I was in a premier country rock show band for six years. It's just been nominated for the Buffalo Music Hall Of Fame. We always went in dressed and prepared, to the point where if one of us was not available most of the time we just wouldn't take the job. The harmony arrangements alone were not something a sub could easily accomplish. There were rare exceptions where we would take a sub. But the sub had sets, keys, and tape two weeks before, AND we reheased the sets once.

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 29 May 2011 1:30 pm

i prefer to fake it and shirk responsibility.

Billy Tonnesen · Post by **Billy Tonnesen** » 29 May 2011 3:20 pm

If you are filling in with a Band that plays Classic or Classic Style Music and they play a Song you have never learned or played before, then: you need to use your "Ear" and be able to imrovise with something that will fit the Chord Pattern of the Song. Don't try to be fancy, just go along with the melody as close as you can. For the last 40 years of my playing career it was mostly for the Fraternal Lodges and you had to play a lot of requests which you had maybe heard over the years but never actually played. There was no charts or rehearsals to play these tunes. Once again you had to use your "Ear" and play as close as you could to the melody and follow the Chord Pattern.

Tom Quinn · Post by **Tom Quinn** » 29 May 2011 3:36 pm

What little C said...

Ernest Cawby · Post by **Ernest Cawby** » 29 May 2011 3:47 pm

when I first started they just gave you the nome of the song and what key it was in.

ernie

Cal Sharp · Post by **Cal Sharp** » 29 May 2011 4:30 pm

When you're working a lot of fill-in and sub gigs around Nashville, like on Broadway, it's a given that you know the songs; you wouldn't have been called otherwise. The trick is to remember the various arrangements when three different bands you're working with do the same songs different ways. You learn to hear around corners.

Bob Vantine · Post by **Bob Vantine** » 29 May 2011 4:47 pm

Cal & Billy T .... I agree with you two , altho Chris Ivey I'm startin to move in your direction

Ben Lawson · Post by **Ben Lawson** » 29 May 2011 4:55 pm

I feel like Cal does about this. I filled in with a band last night that I work with about once a year. They play old & new country and some oldie rock stuff. Sometimes I'm not informed of the song title or the key but after 40 years of playing music I can usually figure it out pretty quickly. They are good musicians and I enjoy working with them and it gives me a chance to step out of the box. I work in two bands that are pretty well rehearsed with set lists and charts so I like being able to ad lib with other groups on occassion.

Tracy Sheehan · Post by **Tracy Sheehan** » 29 May 2011 4:56 pm

Back in the old days when i played the musicians worked off each other and if new in the band and didn't know the song the guitar player, fiddles or what ever would do it and after hearing it once or twice you could play it or you were gone. And the bands i worked with as others did back then could play any style music and no band wanted to sound like another so you did your own thing.
Now i know many are not going to believe this but we had no monitors in an 8 piece band or any other and no sound men as Curly Chalker used to say to screw up the sound. All one had to do was listen to the singer. Even the drummers played drums ,not beat them.
We worked out our arrangments on the band stand. All it took was to listen to each other. I really don't know how to explain this. Maybe Seymour will in one of his news letters. Tracy

Charles Davidson · Post by **Charles Davidson** » 29 May 2011 6:11 pm

Tracy,I have been doing this since around 55,I know what you mean.

YOU BETCHA,DYK?BC.

Clyde Mattocks · Post by **Clyde Mattocks** » 29 May 2011 9:07 pm

If you're a gigging musician, you get it all kinds of ways. It doesn't just apply to steelers, it's bass players(especially), drummers and lead players. If you can grab it on the fly, you'll get called. If not, not so much.

Steve English · Post by **Steve English** » 29 May 2011 11:53 pm

C# described my entire music "career".

I wouldn't have had it any other way.

Biggest problem I've been having in my old age is hearing the difference between "C", "D", "B", etc.....

Now I tend need "1 sharp", "2 sharps", etc....

Tony Prior · Post by **Tony Prior** » 30 May 2011 1:52 am

I think the initial post is referring to a "one night stand" with a totally unfamiliar band...

Jack Stoner · Post by **Jack Stoner** » 30 May 2011 2:07 am

Its still the same. You go do it and make the best of it. As Cal# mentioned, if you can't do that you don't get called.

Bob Simons · Post by **Bob Simons** » 30 May 2011 4:50 am

Why do these responses not surprise me?

When I visited the Country Music Hall of Fame they even had an elaborate exhibit dedicated proudly to the condescending traditional Nashville concept of recording without rehearsal or other preparation.

Ever wonder why everything sounds so dismally the same?

The Steel Guitar Forum

Playing without set-lists or rehersals.............

Playing without set-lists or rehersals.............

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