The Steel Guitar Forum

I don't play what is on the original recordings when playing covers in my band. I just play what comes to me. Sometime it is close. Now the standards like steel guitar rag or Milk cow blues and such you have to play the Melody on the intro or first ride but Crazy Arms,
Fraulein and dance tunes I just free wheel it.
Do you try to stick to the original note for note?

If I'm backing the artist who was on the record I learn the parts note per note,Otherwise I try to play something close so people will recognize the song.

This has always been a bit of a dilemma for players of any instrument. If you stick faithfully to the recording, then you can be accused of not being innovative by musicians and if you do your own thing, then audiences will ask why it's not like the recording they know and love.

The band I work most with solved the problem by calling themselves "Nothing Like The Original" - that way we can do whatever we like and if anyone complains we just remind them of the name of the band they came to see .

For me, it depends on the situation and requires making a judgment about what works best. Different players and ensembles make different judgment calls on this, that's fine with me.

If I feel a certain head or melody is de rigeur - or if that is the consensus of the ensemble - I just learn it. If it isn't, I do whatever I want.

For a lot of 'standards' in many genres, there is no absolute 'set version'. For a lot of blues and jazz, there is often a generally agreed upon head, but everything else is purely improvised. But frequently there are many different well-known approaches to a particular tune.

I'm with Stu on this one, particularly if I am backing the original artist, as their audience is generally going to be listening for the sound they have heard on record or radio. It has done my playing vocabulary a world of good to learn to reproduce the parts created by the great session players and there is no shame to be found in playing something in such a way that it "sounds just like the record" to an attentive audience.

That being said, if I am playing with a a cover band I am most likely to simply cover the intro and/or signature thematic figures of a well-known song and free-wheel over the remainder. Either way I am not concerned by whether or not others think I am "not being innovative" because I know there will be a call for my own voice to be heard when the time is right for it. Most bass players and drummers don't get to play one ego-centric "innovative" stroke all month, and if a great bass player can be satisfied to stick to the bass part all night long I figure I can handle playing the "real" steel part well enough.

Remember that one smokin' ride per show is all it ever takes to establish one's creative ability, no matter how many songs are played "true to the original" before and after, and in the best cases even that is likely to begin with the melody.

To put it even more simply I will repeat a bit of advice from one of the most "innovative" jazz musicians of all time: "Straight ahead and strive for tone." 'Nuff sed!

I'm with Stu on this one, particularly if I am backing the original artist, as their audience is generally going to be listening for the sound they have heard on record or radio. It has done my playing vocabulary a world of good to learn to reproduce the parts created by the great session players and there is no shame to be found in playing something in such a way that it "sounds just like the record" to an attentive audience.

Goin' with Dave & Stu on this one …...

I had this discussion with Justin Trevino one day, and in fact will be the topic of one of my columns in the TSGA Newsletter.

There is a spectrum of philosophical approaches to soloing and signature licks that all players fall within to differing degrees and at different times, but at all times regardless. On one end resides the Recreationists, those players who slavishly adhere note-for-note to the original recording in question. The opposite side of the spectrum is inhabited by the Interpreters, players who chose to do their own thing with the song, creating a new composition per se.

Most of us fall somewhere within the middle, leaning to a greater or lesser degree to either side depending on our preferences, but occasionally becoming a Recreationista or a Doin'-My-Own-Thanger when the situation calls for it.

I just wrote a whole thing when I could have just said "it depends."

I like Herb's answer... 'it depends'

Some bands play the standards close enough to the record that you need to learn the signature steel intro or whatever, because they expect it, it's what they do, and they actually 'need it' to make the arrangement as they know it work. These guys call something like "Big City" and you better be ready to play Norm's part when the fiddles are done.

Sidebar: Norm's part on that intro is way too cool NOT to play anyway, that would just be wrong.. LOL.

On the other end of the spectrum, you work with bands where the leader might call Big City and say "Intro is 1511 in E". To me that says, do your own thing.

I work in a weekend band and did not think about original acts. There are those songs that do require "signature licks".

I don't have to worry about this one. I can't play the same tune twice the same way...

The most exacting rule might be that if whoever's singing changes the words,then it's OK to change the licks.What I like about doing licks and solos as recorded is that the learning process is like a lesson from the guy who recorded them,and often as not I then get to read their posts on the SGF.No names,but thanks,guys.
What I also like about playing something as recorded is that it puts some polish on the performance and makes the band sound better.Musicians may carp about it,but most gigging is for the benefit of people who are there to be entertained rather than educated.They pay the piper,so they get to call the tune.

I have made the effort to learn to play what the audience wants and expects for most songs when it calls for steel work. When our soloist does a well known hit from the past, I try to do the best I can to duplicate what was on the original hit record.

Gordon Borland wrote:I work in a weekend band and did not think about original acts. There are those songs that do require "signature licks".

Sure - and yet another take on 'original act' is playing original music - working with singer/songwriters or original bands. I don't necessarily even feel the need to copy something I put on a CD with someone, but sometimes I do.

There's no set answer for this - the ethos of the people involved and the situation set the tone. If you walk into a situation where a very set pattern is expected and go free-form, it will probably not be appreciated. On the other hand, if you walk into a situation where people expect improvisation and your MO is to play a rigidly set pattern, that is also likely to raise eyebrows. I think the bigger issue is the ability to detect what is expected and react appropriately.

Ray Minich wrote: I can't play the same tune twice the same way...

Just the way I feel too (and I'm proud of it)

I think the bigger issue is the ability to detect what is expected and react appropriately.

Dave, exactly what I was trying to say, but you stated it much more eloquently.

For me, it depends on the song. I generally stick to the melody, regardless.

A good example is Buck Owens "Above and Beyond". It would be silly for me to freewheel the intro....it's such a big 'hook' in the song, and really makes it instantly recognizable. I may not do it note for note, but the melody will be intact. Same with something like The Bottle Let Me Down.

I'll let loose on solos though.

"Signature licks" aside,,,,,I believe we would all be amazed at the difference between what we actually play,,,and what people hear!!!,,,or even to a degree the person playing actually "believes" they are playing. Once the melody is established in ones mind, i.e. a familiar song, and the player stays somewhere within the chord structure of the song, a huge percent of the listening audience will "hear" the melody (and you can not convince them otherwise),,,"I KNOW that was the exact melody",,,,,(Remember,,,this is qualified by saying "Signature licks aside")

Now that Brad's wife Abby is coming to the gigs and taking lots of video it surprises me to hear what I played. Brad (the singer)said he liked fat chords to lay underneath his singing and guitar leads instead of just laying out. These new video cameras are really something.

With the band I am in, we learn it almost identical to the recording..Lick by lick. This is how I have been able to keep my job with them. This is what they require. Now on some of the older type country we play, I have a little more freedom to kinda do what I want.

Brandon

John D. McDonald, in one of his Travis McGee novels, made a point that sticks with me.

The question was whether a "pop art" painter was a skilled artist. The point was made that Picasso could draw a horse with perfect proportions and always had the skill and training to depict objects accurately. He chose to "venture out" after he mastered the ability to copy what was in front of him.

The masters such as Paul Franklin can mimmic the style of others. I saw Buddy Guy in concert and he would do a deal where he said "BB King would say it like this" and do a BB King lick. He then would say "Jimmy Reed would say it like this" same thing in Reed style, etc.

Easier said than done. Most of the time I can't get to what is done on the recording, but sometimes I try. I think it's worth the effort.

Most players don't play it like the record because they can't

Bingo Kyle. I don't think that some can hear it either.

I think it depends on who's singing the tune and the key they do it in!!! I work in three bands in this area and in two of them the lead singers do "Together Again" in the key of G.... Now when you go to the IV chord where that "walkdown" on string 5 starts you have to go up the neck instead of down like on the record and it sounds "different" to say the least. I do however have a pedal that raises my 7th sring a whole tone and another that lowers it a half so it can be done at the 3rd fret with the E's lowered and it sounds similar but much lower and I don't think it's near as effective as if you could do it in C or D......

Also back when I played with Billy Mize in SoCal, he did Nightlife in the key of Bb which was OK for the intro, some fills, and such but one thing I always liked about that song was the "BooWah" lick that Buddy Emmons put in the break, you just can't do it in Bb, you can do something similar in a higher register but it just doesn't have the punch like Buddy's lick did............JH in Va.

Dave Mudgett wrote:For me, it depends on the situation and requires making a judgment about what works best. Different players and ensembles make different judgment calls on this, that's fine with me.

If I feel a certain head or melody is de rigeur - or if that is the consensus of the ensemble - I just learn it. If it isn't, I do whatever I want.

For a lot of 'standards' in many genres, there is no absolute 'set version'. For a lot of blues and jazz, there is often a generally agreed upon head, but everything else is purely improvised. But frequently there are many different well-known approaches to a particular tune.

I am for all intents and purposes NOT a working player. In my biggest year to date, I got a half dozen gigs, all of them in traditional jazz styles. But I try to do what the people who hire me want. But I prefer to take my own approach to every song when I have the freedom to do so, which so far has been most of the time.

kyle reid wrote:Most players don't play it like the record because they can't

I think the above is closer to the truth than those who say "I always do my own thing"

I have worked with hundreds of musicians who make make this statement. These are usually those who make a sloppy, half hearted attempt to sound like the original with the intro, bridges, chops and all else and fail. They then fall back on the age old excuse that they just like doing their own thing.

I am not saying that the musician must "duplicate" the original intro or licks note for note ; however, he or she should at least put a little effort into learning how the original formatted the piece and put some practice time into it.