The Steel Guitar Forum

It's a thread that i can't find anything about. Educate me please?

Brandon, why do you want to do this? Are you seeking a lower timbre?

It's the same tuning and pedal setup, just 1 1/2 tones lower than the C-6. Just put on larger strings, tune it up and reset the pedals, if that is what you are asking. Hope this helps.

If you are going to be playing "Western Swing" the A6th tuning will give you a much more solid "Attack". Also if start playing twin parts with a Lead Guitar your tone wiil be much closer together. A6th has been one of my tunings including pedal steel for over 60 years.

Brandon,
Here's a link to copedant info here on the Forum...This A6th tuning is from Herb Remington:
http://b0b.com/tunings/stars.html#A6hr

Carl

Pedal or non-pedal?

Jim Bob Sedgwick wrote:Brandon, why do you want to do this? Are you seeking a lower timbre?

It's the same tuning and pedal setup, just 1 1/2 tones lower than the C-6. Just put on larger strings, tune it up and reset the pedals, if that is what you are asking. Hope this helps.

Two of the most popular lapsteel tunings that evolved when Joseph Kekuku (according to legend) invented the Hawaiian guitar in the late 1800's was:

E7th and A (either Hi or Lo Bass), in their evolutionary order.

[tab]

E7th A A

Lo Hi

E E E
B C# C#
G# A A
E E E
D A C#
B E A


[/tab]

Many a double neck had these tunings for many decades; with either HI bass or Lo bass on one of the necks. Notice, these tunings was a natural progression from:

[tab]

Standard Spanish Guitar tuning

E
B
G
D
A
E

[/tab]

Then a young man came along by the name of Jerry Byrd. He felt that A often sounded too bassy and E was often too trebly, for the way he wanted to play most of his songs.

Since A is 7 half tones below E, he decided to get a tuning half way in between. He could have chosen C or C#; since there is NO half way point exactly. He chose C.

This compromise led to one of THE most awesome tunings in history. AKA: C6th.

[tab]

C6th

E
C
A
G
E
C

[/tab]

So if you owned a 3 neck lapsteel, you would most likely have some version of A C and E, because it gave you the flexibility to sit IN with the band in most genre's; and be right at home. IE: you could cover the gamut. It soon led to the 8 string double or triple, OR even 4 neck guitar.

Which was the forerunner to the PSG. IE:

[tab]

(Lapsteel)

E9 C6 A6

E E E
B C C#
G# A A
F# G F#
E E E
D C C#
B A A
E F F#

(Pedal Steel)

E9 C6 (OR)

F# G D
D# E E
G# C C
E A A
B G G
G# E E
F# C C
E A A
D F F
B C C

[/tab]


Since the E9th neck has BOTH the A and the E tunings, It doth not take a rocket scientist to know what is on the bottom neck on the standard D-10 PSG.

c.

Mars Case tuned his back neck down 3 frets to A6, and kept the same changes. Big, powerful sound. I think he used standard C6 strings, but it didn't sound "loose."

Hey Brandon. I did the same thing, convert C6 pedal to A6. I mostly play a D-8 console with A6 and E13 for my rockabilly/west swing trio and got tired of having to recalibrate my brain when I had to do a pedal gig. I really dig the old Herb Remmington sound and stayed with A6. C6 is probably more versatile sonic wise, but I just got too confused going back and forth. As my main interest is old western swing I commited to A6. The only thing I am having trouble with is the bass strings on the pedal A6 feel mushy. I tried going up a couple of gauges on them and its a little better but still not tight like I would like. Any suggestions would be appreciated. Kinda cool to see A6 making a comeback of sorts, or has it always been a standard. Seems like C6 is the big dog. I love the bassier sound. More of a contrast to E9. Just seems natural to me.

Since I started playing a Universal, I tune my D-10 back neck to B6.... to avoid the confusion. B6 sounds works with a C6 string set and has a direct relation to the E9 neck.....

I prefer D6th for its brighter timbre.

Back in the early 80's when I lived in Houston, TX, I took steel lessons from a great steel player-Jimmy Powell. When I showed-up for my first lesson, I realized that he had A6 & E9, where as I had C6 & E9. He taught me a lot of E9 stuff, as well as C6 stuff--playing my lesson on his A6 for my C6. I remember telling him I wanted to stick to the what I thought was the NORM--playing C6, because I was well aware that all of my HEROS were playing C6. He understood this & never tried to convert me to A6. I remember when he'd show me C6 stuff on his A6, he had to constantly talk in terms of say--"On my 12th fret it would be so & so fret on your neck". It never seemed to bother him about constantly converting back & forth. Also, I don't think I ever asked him why he had A6 & he never offered to explain why, either. I do remember the obvious lower range he got. I'd like to point out that when he'd demonstrate some fantastic licks on the A6, my jaw would drop in amazement! At the moment it didn't matter what tuning he was playing! Also, when I would set-up across from him, I remember seeing his 10th string on the A6 looking a little slack, but maybe it was an illusion. I know that it would depend on what gauge of strings you would use to make it work. One other thing, Herb Remington was a big promoter of the A6 & he lived there in Houston with his music store, too. I was at his store a lot--what a great player & person he was! He didn't try to profess that one tuning was any better than the other, either. It really boils-down to what YOU want to do or play.

Hey Butch. I live in Orlando also. Would love to see you play some time as I am a student/intermediate steel player trying to learn. I agree. A6 for me just made sense considering I play D8 A6 and E13. BTW, I'll be playing the D8 at the Orlando Brewery this fri around 9:30 or so in a trio that I front. Thanks for the insight. Great thoughts. Use what is right for you. TC

When I went fo a double 10, I incorporated an A6 into one of the necks; I used an Ab on top which gives me a range of more than 3 octaves on any given fret. As I've said before, the "commonly used" C6 tuning is NOT C6, but F maj 9th.

Dr. Hugh Jeffreys wrote:As I've said before, the "commonly used" C6 tuning is NOT C6, but F maj 9th.

Or Fmaj13th with a D on top. But I prefer to think of it as C13 without the 7th.

IMHO, if you are using an E13th as one of your tunings, then use A6th rather than C6th for the second neck. These tunings are very relative in tone, chord, and key positioning. If you leave both necks on at the same time you can jump back and forth for fuller chords up and down the necks.

I used A6th on my back neck for a few months. Same intervals and changes as I had on C6th, but tuned down. I used heavier strings and had to adjust the bellcrank positions to balance the pulls, but it was easy to do.

It had a much bigger sound and I liked having the extra range (with the boo-wah, nearly as much low range as a bass), but it didn't cut through the band very well so I ended up going back to C6th.