E9 Tone Question

Richard Alderson · From: Illinois, USA

Dear Forum Members - I am not a newbie, but I qualify as a beginner. I finally got a standard amp last month - Peavey Nashville 112. I have question about tone (don't we all?). So far using the factory recommended settings I can get a real nice c6 sound,nice fat base, good chunky pick blocks. However I cannot find a setting that gives me a nice full e9th sound for single notes in the upper registers. Think of the steel in Garth Brooks, Much Too Young to Feel this Damn Old, the notes from strings phrasing at about the 8th fret are warm and full, They sound almost like an organ, they ring after the pedal bends. Occasionally there is double note phrasing, but mainly it is single note phrasing, during the break. Buddy Emmons also has this type of full single note phrasing, in solos, or playing instrumentals with no vocals, where one string by itself on the upper registers, has a sound that is as full as an orchestra. The notes are held, there is some vibrato, so partially there is technique involved but what about the amp? What might be a place to begin for some of the basic amp settings for this "full" "warm" single note sound, especially on the far upper registers ?

Thanks
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Derby SD-10 5x6; GFI S-10 5x5; GFI S-10 5x5; Zum D-10 8x7; Zum D-10 9x9; Fender 400; Fender Rumble 200; Nashville 400; Telonics TCA-500.

Bud Angelotti · From: Larryville, NJ, USA

Rich -
I recall seeing a small photo of Buddy's NV 112 settings somewhere. Maybe you can dig it up cause I remember seeing it in the past.

Paul Sutherland · From: Placerville, California

Are you playing a Fender 400? If that is the steel you are using, you may be trying to get a tone the Fender will never deliver. The pickup on the Fender is probably wound considerably lighter than most modern steels, which produces a thinner tone. There are undoubtedly more reasons Fenders sound the way they do.

I am not meaning to disparage the tone of vintage Fenders steels. They are great for certain applications, but the tone you describe may not be one of those applications.

I have never used a NV 112 so can't help you there. You've already addressed the strings issue so the only things left are the bar, the picks (if any), the left hand, and the right hand. Good luck. Smile

Bob Kagy · From: Lafayette, CO USA

Richard, here's a few things you might try.

First, Paul's got a good point. And I do wonder why you don't get the same thing on the C6th treble strings; might be something worth thinking about. Also I think there might be a forum member that used to have a 400 and a 112; maybe he'll see this and chime in.

There's a lot of options with the 112. A lot. I think the user's manual is a good start but it has to give you what you want, and it may be somewhere in there.

First, make sure the speaker isn't pointed directly at your ear; the treble beam is pretty focused coming out the center of the speaker, so angle it a little off axis.

Try turning the presence control all the way down. If that helps a lot, bring it back up to the point where the harshness kicks in and back off a little.

Same thing with the mid control.

Try turning the bass control down to about -3 (this will allow cutting the treble to rebalance)

Whichever input plug you're using, try the other one. If you're using high gain, the low gain input will sometimes cut the treble harshness (while also cutting the volume which you can readjust).

Sometimes things get a little loose on pedal steels; it's possible something's vibrating at the frequencies that are getting your attention.

There's a lot of stuff that affects your sound, maybe you already know all that but cables, volume pedal, fx boxes, picks, steel, your hands, and on and on.

These are just a few things to try, and I hope they can get you started. Others will probably have some good ideas.

bk

Kevin Hatton · From: Buffalo, N.Y.

What guitar are you playing?

Richard Alderson · From: Illinois, USA

Thanks to Paul Sutherland, he hit the nail on the head, I am playing the Fender. So it is true that I am due for an upgrade in the guitar department, I have out grown this model no doubt. The tone is quite thin. I appreciate Bob Kagy's suggestions regarding the Presence setting, and the physical placement of the speaker. I will be expermenting and I will let him know how it goes. You guys are awesome. My experience with speakers and electronics issues is limited. Without the Forum I might not know the difference between pick her up and pucker up. Thanks guys, this is great support.
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Derby SD-10 5x6; GFI S-10 5x5; GFI S-10 5x5; Zum D-10 8x7; Zum D-10 9x9; Fender 400; Fender Rumble 200; Nashville 400; Telonics TCA-500.

Paul Sutherland · From: Placerville, California

Don't sell that Fender on account of me!! I have many times regretted selling my old yellow double 8 Fender PSG. They have a tone unlike any other steel. Sneakie Pete made a lot of great sounding recordings (and a lot of money) with one. You have to appreciate them for what they are.

Richard Alderson · From: Illinois, USA

I need a new guitar, but I would never sell the Fender. It's still almost in showroom condition. It is shiny and showy, and it looks great in a smokey bar. It had been played so little before I bought it that the black paint still was shiny on the pedals. I don't need to get rid of anything, I just need to add a new member to the collection.
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Derby SD-10 5x6; GFI S-10 5x5; GFI S-10 5x5; Zum D-10 8x7; Zum D-10 9x9; Fender 400; Fender Rumble 200; Nashville 400; Telonics TCA-500.

Ken Metcalf · From: San Antonio Texas USA

A lot of it can be where and how you are picking.
Moving your pick hand to the left and right a hair can make a big difference.
Some of the real nice tones have a hint of harmonic in them.
Practice picking one note on a offending string alternating thumb and fingers, back and forth up and down the neck. (From Scotty's E9th Anthology)
Try and get the whining or offending tone, find out where it is.
Soon you will see if you are very careful you can get the tone you want.
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MSA 12 String E9th/B6th Universal.
Little Walter PF-89.
Bunch of stomp boxes

Bob Kagy · From: Lafayette, CO USA

Also, a little delay can "thicken" the high notes some.

And Ken's suggestion about where you pick can have a big effect. Try picking 12 frets up from where the bar is - it gives you a rounder tone. The downside is it gives you a lot to coordinate.

You play a Washburn and listen to Buddy Emmons? They set the bar real high. Like the rest of us you're going to be futzing with tone for a looong time Wink

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

Earnest Bovine · From: Los Angeles CA USA

It can be hard to get a good single string sound if the changer is worn where the string rests on it. Push the string to the side a mm or 2 (easier if you loosen it first), and look at the changer where the string was. Retune the string while it is pushed to the side on an unworn part of the changer, and listen to the tone.

(or maybe not... do these Fenders have a roller bridge that is separate from the changer?)

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