The Steel Guitar Forum

This is a 1968 Sho-BUD prototype steel done for Bobbe Seymour which I purchased from B Hamilton. A double 10 C6 E9. There is pickup switching and coil tap at belly button placement between the two necks, A lot of non-shielded wire Going on along with single coil P/U means that in certain spaces this axe hums --a lot. Even though its tight space wise I have thought about doing some copper foil shielding to reduce the hum. I've done this with varying success on a half dozen guitars.

Any thoughts on what benefits or detriments of this procedure. Should I look at a replacement PU Or a different wiring scenario?

Many thanks

PS if you want to see this 42 yo baby just search my early posts.

Blessings

B

I had a 69 Sho-Bud X-over with those same pickups and always had a lot of hum. Tried evrything I could: sheilded leads from p/u to switch; wrapping Mu metal around outside both CW and CCW grounded and ungrounded (the Mu metal made the p/u's a lot hotter!) - all of which NEVER made the hum go away. So, I put the BL-705's on it, NO HUM and sounded great!

If you find a solution, please let us know.

Thanx,
Jim

I installed a tone knob on my steel, just like the one on regular 6-string guitars. Turning the tone down a bit reduces the hum. Turn down the tone enough and it will eliminate the hum, but your tone will not be as bright and clear. There is a trade-off.

I'd put a GeorgeL E-66 or a TW in there if it was mine.

As much as I love single coils, I have had to go to humbuckers in all of the gig guitars. New York City clubs are so bad that I can't use any tuners with a single coil.... the tuner sees more hum than signal. And I have tried multiple high end tuners.

A 705 in a Sho~Bud is a beautiful thing. I have an Alumitone in the Williams S-12U that I just acquired... I really like it in that guitar, so much so that I am going to get one for my Willy S-10.

I had the same problem as Mike. Hum with the single coil on my old MSA made the tuner go nuts and made the music often sound ugly. I got a George L E-66 on my new Williams and both problems are solved. And the tone is gorgeous -- I don't miss the single coil sound at all.

I had to bite the bullet with my Marlen, and put a humbucking pickup on it, because of the serious hum of the original single-coil pickup.

I'm a single-coil addict, and wasn't expecting to be very happy with the 'muddiness' of a humbucker, but the George L E66 that I put in is far better than I anticipated.

Almost single-coil-like tone, and absolutely no hum

Brian McGibney wrote:Any thoughts on what benefits or detriments of this procedure. Should I look at a replacement PU Or a different wiring scenario?

There are benefits, if done correctly. I try to use shielding paint, but, if I have to use tape, I solder all of the joints.

Use shielded wire and/or shield the wires.

Also, make sure your strings are grounded. A 0.68uF/300V capacitor, in the ground circuit, will keep you alive when you get shocked.

Brian, Assuming you have the original shobud pickup, you might see if your pickup is getting micrphonic. Send it off to Jerry Wallace for a rewind, and your good for another 40 years. Jerry rewinds all of mine, and they are all quiet as a dead church mouse. make sure your ground wire has a bare spot that goes under your spring bracket, and your coil tap switch is not failing, and you should be good to go.

Have you considered an Alumitone pickup? I've seen them on Sho~Bud style guitars. So far people have been saying mostly all positive things about the Alumitones. You'd probably retain more of your single coil sound while totally eliminating the hum.

James Morehead wrote:Brian, Assuming you have the original shobud pickup, you might see if your pickup is getting micrphonic. Send it off to Jerry Wallace for a rewind, and your good for another 40 years. Jerry rewinds all of mine, and they are all quiet as a dead church mouse. make sure your ground wire has a bare spot that goes under your spring bracket, and your coil tap switch is not failing, and you should be good to go.

I agree with James, you may want to explore the possibility of a microphonic pickup. I had my Fender/Sho-Bud pickup potted recently and it quieted it down significantly - however, the electricity in my house is very noisy, so in my apartment it sounds not so hot. At rehearsal where there is proper grounding, it's much quieter. Just my .02.

Under the FWIW Catagory....

I recently replaced the single coils in my Zum with an Alumitone. Since I was more than a little worried about loss of my traditional tone, I did a head to head test. I recorded my old P/P Emmons as a standard, my Zum with the single coil, and the Zum with the Alumitone. All were dry tracks DI to the board. To my ear, the Alumitone had the same tone as the P/P with more string seperation, a hotter signal, (could easily overdrive some of my old settings), and absolutely no detectable noise. With allowances made for signal level differences, the only way I could tell an A/B test between any two recordings was the string seperation of the Alumitone.

As always, YMMV

Brian McGibney wrote:T copper foil shielding to reduce the hum. I've done this with varying success on a half dozen guitars.

Any thoughts on what benefits or detriments of this procedure.

It is so easy that you might as well try. Any conductor will do, such as aluminum foil from the kitchen.
Twisting the pair of wires will help about as much. Are they twisted already?

Nevertheless I think your single coil pickup is picking up more hum than the bare wires pick up, so it won't solve your problem.

Your double neck guitar has two pickups. If they are wired in opposite polarity, you can get a significant hum reduction by switching both pickups on.

you can fight this 'till the cows come home or you can get a pair of Humbuckers and let the cows live out in the field.

E66's and 10:1's didn't get popular because of the Billboards or TV commercials.
.

I went from a E-66 to a Truetone on my GFI U-12. Never had any real problems with hum, but was curious about the Alumitone pickups. So I got one and installed it. It was dead quiet, and sounded slightly better than the Truetone, definitely better string separation on the lower strings. I'm very happy with the Alumitone sound, and will likely install one in my Carter as well. I would highly recommend one.

-Chuck

Electroharmonix makes a pedal called a "hum debugger" that works pretty well without too much impact on tone. Don't ask me how, I think it may be some kind of smart notch filtre.

Also, if you're leaving a Strobo-flip tuner plugged in while you play -- try unplugging it. Mine sometimes seems to act as an antenna for ambient crud.

Tony Prior wrote:you can fight this 'till the cows come home of you can get a pair of Humbuckers and let the cows live out in the field.

E66's and 10:1's didn't get popular because of the Billboards or TV commercials.
.

Whats to fight. If your pickup is not microphonic and is grounded right there should be no problem---or do I just have exceptional luck with all the 'buds I do?

No body has mentioned good chords from guitar to amp yet, either. Lack of acceptable chords will generate hum. Poor single coils get a bad rap.

Whats to fight. If your pickup is not microphonic and is grounded right there should be no problem---or do I just have exceptional luck with all the 'buds I do?

No body has mentioned good chords from guitar to amp yet, either. Lack of acceptable chords will generate hum. Poor single coils get a bad rap.

In NYC I had hum problems with every single coil equipped guitar that I took out. 2 Different Emmons, 3 Different Sho~Buds, Williams, Lamar. Some with original pickups, some with Wallace rewinds, etc. I use really good cables, high end amps, pot and potless pedals. Always the same problems. I have no problems at all in my studio, but all of the wiring was done by a pro electrical contractor who does recording facilities for a living...... so it ain't my gear. There are places in this country where you can't use a single coil.

The last straw was at an annual Christmas benefit show that I have played for several years, Glen Burtnik's Christmas Extravaganza. The venue is always the Count Basie Theater in Red Bank NJ, which is a pro venue with real electricity. There are a lot of world famous guys playing the gig, so you want to be your best. That night my `Bud was humming so badly that the tuner would only see 60 cycle hum, so I took it down to the green room and tuned using the microphone on the tuner. I tried different amps, cables, etc.... nothing helped. I made it through the night by only playing on really big loud numbers.... and believe me the other band members noticed. One year later I took the exact same rig, guitar, cables, volume pedal, amp, etc to the gig. Only difference was that there was a 705 in the 'Bud. Dead quiet. End of story.

I went to BL-705's/710's and never looked back. There's no guessing or fighting. It's simple as that. I know many are hung on single coils but so was I (and still am if you are talking telecasters) but as for steel, the humbuckers are the way to go.

When you finally get on that ONE stage , you will know what I ( we) are talking about. When the HUM is louder than the audio coming out of the amp..

After you have had a 45 minute conversation with Jerry Wallace on the subject at hand it will be time to call it a night.

Maybe some of you will get very lucky and never play on the stage from Hell but once you have been there with a steady high paying gig it will be time to cave.

I caved. I love quality single coils as much as the next guy but the gig and playing music is more important than my personal opinion of tone.

Two different Steels Emmons Legrande and my Carter with Wallace Tru Tones , neither could satisfy the gig under any conditions.

The next week after a lengthy educational discussion with Jerry Wallace, I put the HBuckers on the Carter.

never looked back. I would say however, that this was probably one of 2 or 3 stages over 3 or 4 decades that could not be handled. Most were tolerable. But, you just never know. Also called 2other local players, we all had the exact same experience.

PS..

Wallace True Tones and George L cables . Not cheap pups or cheap cables. Cheap cables will cause an issue even in a good room.

I think some may not understand the magnitude of a very bad room, not an average bad room or a pretty bad room but a room that cannot be conquered, not just for the Steel but ANY single coil guitar.

I went to BL-710s on my Legrande and PP years ago. Best move I ever made.

Brian

I had a problem like you describe and really dreaded all the
hassle -- Now ! this may sound stupid , but ,

I put a set of George L’s cables on the guitar and hum disappeared .

(The cables that were on the guitar were new) so i did not suspect them

The pickups were fender/Sho-Bud --

Certain rooms and clubs will just not do anything to fix their wiring, not what they want to spend their money on I guess. Guitar players can orient themselves to where the hum is minimized but us steel players can't do that. It is interesting to think that Day, Emmons and the rest somehow made it thru with single coils back then. I have put a Tonealigner in my Emmons though which sounds great with no grief.

I guess, like James, I've been lucky. I've played nothing but single coil guitars since High School, back in '62. I've heard some humbuckers that sound pretty good. But not as good as a single coil. Something about the "sweetness" in the higher end.
Never had a problem until Wright's Ballroom! Nasty hum. What a total dive! I just turned my guitar about 20 degrees, and the hum was gone. No problemo!