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Topic: Richard Choy 'The Banjo King' (and steeler) |
Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 5 Jun 2006 3:36 pm |
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After doing an engine and SGF search for Mr. Choy and coming up with goose eggs (except for my own posts) let's see if we can generate any more info on him.
Keoki asked about Choy and fry pans.
He was employed/associated with Rickenbacker at some post WW2 point and it seems there was what some old timers called 'The Choy Fry Pan'.
The open back models may be what they are talking about as this is what he had in his Piikoi St. shop and showed to me. Mint condition short scale solid necks with the bakelite cover for the open back for $1000 in 1980!, no student discount for me...
We know that long scale models of this same type were also produced during this time but he chose the short scale for himself and his students.
That's about all that I have heard of concerning these particular steels.
It's a shame that he and his wife are long gone now to answer any questions, and few know of him and his long history with the guitar industry in America during it's pre and post war glory days.
As a Korean American it's astounding that he sought to be and did become a very valued employee at most of the great guitar companies of the time, especially Gibson.
With massive desire and talents he plowed thru the tough times of rampant bigotry and such to advance high up the shop ladders and become well respected by his various bosses.
But that had to have been a rough road.
He knew ALL the guitar/banjo/steel giants and they were glad to know him.
The years did take a toll on his personallity however and in his latter years he had no desire to be nice to those who dared cross his shop threshold unless you passed the acid test.
I was one of the lucky few.
If he liked you, he REALLY liked you.
He'd stop everything and spend the whole day with me if he could.
As Byrd sed years later when I asked what he knew of Choy, "YOU KNEW HIM? Gees, he didn't like..., he didn't like..., HE DIDN'T LIKE ANYONE!"
An incredible book/movie could and should have been had covering his musical exploits, but like most, his story may now never be fully known.
One of the treasured pix I have of him thruout his years is a 1936 Honolulu Star Bulletin clipping that shows Choy w/banjo jamming with 2 other Asian men on guitar AND the enigmatic MK Moke on accoustic steel at Choy's 1191 Bethel St. studio.
In spite of the many pitfalls of the day, the guy deffinitly got around. |
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George Keoki Lake
From:
Edmonton, AB., Canada
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Posted 5 Jun 2006 4:23 pm
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Holy Toledo Ron ! You should be in CIA or FBI. Wow, I had no idea who CHOY was, just heard the name bantered about some 25 years ago and it suddenly came to mind the other day. The guitar you describe is exactly what I have...it's an open back frypan except the back is closed by the brown plastic circle plate with a screw in the center. It has the Rickenbacher name on it and I sure wish you could delve into THAT history a little further. Mine is the short scale solid neck model. How was it that CHOY had permission to build these critters in the first place ? I had no idea it was made in Hawaii, but that's where I found this one. Well, you've solved one mystery and opened another...
Mahalo 
http://www3.telus.net/public/lake_r/ [This message was edited by George Keoki Lake on 05 June 2006 at 05:26 PM.] |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 5 Jun 2006 5:22 pm
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Keoki, I'm 99.9% sure they weren't made in Hawaii but at the Rick factory were Choy was at the time.
He spent many of his years in the mainland trying to make a name for himself in various musical ways and succeeded to a degree on many levels, but as much as he had to offer, those almond eyes no doubt kept him from reaching his full potential every step of the way.
Our loss.
You mentioned that your pancake had the translucent gold wash (or is it the gold paint?) which may make it an early version of this particular style, but the last few he had in store were clean of that and instead were factory pristine polished aluminum with the classic colored fret dots and the latter issue white decal on the headstock instead of the gold badge. It also had only 1 knob, typically on the starboard side of the face, and the old 2nd version PU w/strings thru.
Sure was cute.
He also made mention that some of the earliest pans had tungsten wiring.
His steel teaching style was to play a 78 of Dick McIntire for the sweet stuff and then Sol for the fast stuff and work you thru it as he accompanied on standard.
[This message was edited by Ron Whitfield on 05 June 2006 at 06:27 PM.] |
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Bill Creller
From:
Saginaw, Michigan, USA (deceased)
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Posted 5 Jun 2006 5:37 pm
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Some people assume that all post-war frypans with the bottom cover are Choy types.
The fact that he only used the short scale model kind of kills that theory.
Bobby ingano's post-war solid neck came from the Tommy Castro family, so who really knows any real factual history of them. In 1956 Rickenbacker catalog shows a frypan with a plastic fret board, so who knows ?? |
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George Keoki Lake
From:
Edmonton, AB., Canada
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Posted 5 Jun 2006 7:10 pm
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There are only traces of the gold "paint", very little left. From all appearances it now appears to be a dull "silver". Frets are black dots and it has a string through body. You don't have to remove the plastic back to replace a string...there are 6 holes in the plastic round back. The name "plate" is actually a very worn out gold decal with some traces of a red trim. When I got it, the gears were rusted out terribly to the point whereby it could hardly be tuned, so I replaced all the tuning gears. The vol and tone knobs didn't match and were cracked. I replaced them with Radio Shack knobs. (As mentioned, I think it was only equipped with a vol control originally). Otherwise the old beast is about as original as an outrigger paddle can get. I'm inclined to think it is a CHOY guitar from the way you described them.
http://www3.telus.net/public/lake_r/ [This message was edited by George Keoki Lake on 05 June 2006 at 08:11 PM.] |
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Michael Lee Allen
From:
Portage Park / Irving Park, Chicago, Illinois
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 3:39 pm
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REMOVED
Last edited by Michael Lee Allen on 28 Feb 2011 1:48 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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George Rout
From:
St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 3:52 pm
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Man, that's a very interesting article.
I think Keoki plays his frypan with choyp sticks!!
Geo |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 4:38 pm
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Shweet Michael!
Those were walls to remember, eh?
I lucked out and got about 1/4 of those great pix from Dantz (who has no real info to offer) years later for free and I treasure each of them, including the one of Sol and his indian ink autograph where he wrote "Aloha Pumehana, Sol Hoopii"
On the two different and very cool 3X5 business cards I have of his, he spells it with the Y, which I imagine was to make the pronounciation easier on us white folk and less hassle for himself.
I only got to hang at his shop for about a year in 1980 before I retired to the country side of Oahu. But I'd catch him strolling thru Ala Moana Center now and then and he'd bust out that cool smile that few ever saw.
He'd usually try and give me half the shop when I'd stop in and would be disappointed each time I'd decline out of respect. Now I wish I hadn't been so prudish.
He used to have a bunch of instruments in his front window until some ---- busted it and stole them all.
Glad to hear someone else on the forum met him, and that you did him well, he deserved every bit of it.
I miss that old guy. He was one of a kind.
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George Keoki Lake
From:
Edmonton, AB., Canada
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Posted 6 Jun 2006 8:58 pm
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Wow! When I opened this thread with "CHOY" I never dreamed so much information would come along. Michael, I mentioned , "I haven't a clue"...I only guessed at the spelling of his name and indeed knew absolutely nothing of the man until now. Mahalo to both you and Ron for supplying so much info. My question now to both of you: Is my "Choi" guitar an authentic Rickenbacher or not ?
It has the Rickenbacher name on it, (with the "H") and has "the" tone. But what exactly do I have ? .... and I guess I have to ask, when was it made and where ?
http://www3.telus.net/public/lake_r/ [This message was edited by George Keoki Lake on 06 June 2006 at 09:59 PM.] |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 8:58 am
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Keoki, I feel safe in saying you have an authentic post war Ricky made in the LA factory. Having the black dot markers, decal and gold paint may help assuming the time of manufacture.
The decal was originally with a white background that typically ages to a yellow/gold.
A couple of years ago Rick Aiello's friend made up a small batch of repro Ricky decals and I gave one to Bobby Ingano for one of his pans from that era which had worn off. He then 'antiqued' it by using a yellow marker, a little flame and some grub making it look very age appropriate, no doubt much like yours Keoki!
A non-SGF member e'd me saying that Frank Miller might have some info on ol' Choi. He's been coming to HI for decades and may have visited Choi with Barney and/or Byrd.[This message was edited by Ron Whitfield on 07 June 2006 at 10:00 AM.] |
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Michael Lee Allen
From:
Portage Park / Irving Park, Chicago, Illinois
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 9:02 am
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REMOVED
Last edited by Michael Lee Allen on 28 Feb 2011 1:50 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 12:31 pm
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Just got an e from an HSGA member (Hal) who visited Choi in the early 80s and sez Richard actually bought out the remaining stock of Rick castings and had a bunch under his house that got ripped off. Not sure if they'd been set up completely for sale at that point.
He was trying to sell them for 5 grand apiece!
So maybe I did get a break in the price...
Hal had the fine foresight to tape his conversations with him and it includes some banjo playing as well.
I'll happily be recieving a copy and will post any info gleaned from it.
This keeps getting more interesting.[This message was edited by Ron Whitfield on 07 June 2006 at 04:39 PM.] |
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George Keoki Lake
From:
Edmonton, AB., Canada
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Posted 7 Jun 2006 4:54 pm
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Michael, my web site does NOT show the pic of the Choi at all. No matter....as Ron says, this is a very interesting thread.
http://www3.telus.net/public/lake_r/ |
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Michael Lee Allen
From:
Portage Park / Irving Park, Chicago, Illinois
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Posted 8 Jun 2006 9:21 am
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REMOVED
Last edited by Michael Lee Allen on 28 Feb 2011 1:52 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 8 Jun 2006 1:36 pm
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There will probably be a lot of info hits and misses concerning Choi as there just aren't many folks around now that can contribute the facts. But at least were getting somewhere. The trail seems to be warming up.
Got another message about at least 1 more cassette tape made at his shop, this one made while Barney Isaacs and JB were there, and that had to be a crazy day!
I'll be trying to track it down.
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Michael Lee Allen
From:
Portage Park / Irving Park, Chicago, Illinois
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Posted 11 Jun 2006 3:03 pm
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REMOVED
Last edited by Michael Lee Allen on 28 Feb 2011 1:54 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 11 Jun 2006 5:44 pm
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That'd be great, Michael. I hope it happens.
Per the 'second' tape mentioned above, which unfortunately does not exist, I just got this:
Jerry and his very good pal Al went to Choi's shop one day. Al did all the talking with Jerry never saying a word, and Choi had no idea it was Jerry Byrd standing there. When Byrd's name came up in conversation, Choi said he had years earlier sent some Hawaiian music charts to Jerry in Nashville because Jerry didn't know how to read music!
Jerry kept quiet and when they left the shop, obviously, had quite the laugh between the two of them.
As I mentioned to my friend Wally who sleuthed this info out,
'now I really wish that tape existed!'
As much as Choi was the real thing, I also knew he was a primo BSer.
But that has to take the cake! |
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Bill Creller
From:
Saginaw, Michigan, USA (deceased)
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Posted 12 Jun 2006 5:27 am
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| I refurbished three of the post-war frypans, one for Derrick Mau (long scale), and two short scale for Bobby Ingano. They had black plastic or bakelite nuts, and bridge inserts. The decal type logos were all but worn off, and they all had the brown bakelite bottom covers. I replaced the bridges and nuts with chromed brass parts that I make. |
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George Keoki Lake
From:
Edmonton, AB., Canada
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Posted 12 Jun 2006 6:20 am
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Bill ... do you happen to have spare any Rickenbacher (head) labels around ? Mine is almost 70% gone and I'd like to replace it if possible. Gladly pay.
http://www3.telus.net/public/lake_r/
[This message was edited by George Keoki Lake on 12 June 2006 at 07:20 AM.] |
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Bill Creller
From:
Saginaw, Michigan, USA (deceased)
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Posted 12 Jun 2006 9:06 am
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Keoki I don't have any logo decals, but heard somebody had some made. I'll see what I can find out about it.
Bill |
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Ron Whitfield
From:
Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA
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Posted 12 Jun 2006 11:10 am
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| Gentlemen, your investigation concerning repro Ricky headstock decals may be expidited a bit by merely scrolling back up a few replys ON THIS VERY THREAD. |
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