Minor keys and progressions

Phil Halton · From: Holyoke, Massachusetts, USA

I've noticed something kind of quirky regarding minor keys and progressions that I'd like to get clarified if I can. I couldn't find my answer in the archives, so here goes:

First, I understand that the major and minor scale are drawn from the same set of notes, and that the melodic minor scale is simply the relative major scale played from the 6th degree etc. To keep it short, this means that the diatonic chords derived by harmonizing the scale tones are also the same set of chords for both major and minor scales--Its just their ordering that differs.

So, in C major, the diatonic triads are:
C, Dm, Em, F, G, Am, BmFlat5(I know this last one is probably not named correctly, but it has both a flat 3rd and 5th)

And, in A minor, the same chords would be ordered:
Am, Bmb5, C, Dm, Em, F, G

Now to the point--I often see minor progressions(key of A minor for this example) where the B (2 chord) is voiced as a B minor instead of the diminished triad, and the 5 chord (Em is voiced as a dominant (E 7th).

It appears they're "fudging" the chord types a bit. That's OK with me--I'm willing to go along with it--I just want to understand why this happens. Is it because the B chord, if voiced as a diminished triad would give a dominant quality in the II chord where you don't want one, and conversely, the Em would fail to produce a dominant quality in the V chord where it would be desireable to have one? So, they sharp the fifth in the B chord to get a minor quality in the II , and drop the 3rd in the Em to get a dominant quality in the V?

Also, I recall something weird about the melodic minor scale wherein the notes differ slightly depending upon whether you're ascending or descending. That is, the scale has a flatted 3rd, 6th and 7th when ascending, and only a flatted 3rd when descending, or something like that. If that's the case, then you'd have an F# and G# in the A melodic minor scale which would let you get that Bm (b, d, f#) and an E 7th (e, g#,b, d)--which would account for the "fudge factor" I mentioned.

Just trying to understand this whole Major/Minor business, and this doesn't compute. Please keep it simple--I'm not nearly as clever as I think I am Smile

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

The Bmb5 chord is actually called Bdim (B dimininshed).

Phil Halton · From: Holyoke, Massachusetts, USA

B0b writes... "It's not actually whether you're ascending or descending. The notes change when you're on the V chord. In Am, think of the V chord as E7 instead of Em and you see how the G# note enters the mix."

Thanks B0b, would that also apply to when you're on the II chord--with the f# note changing the Bdim to a Bm? Don't ever recall seeing a Bdim in a Aminor progression, but the Bm I do.

What a weird scale--sounds like it came about to suit the harmonies rather than the other way round.

b0b · From: Cloverdale, CA, USA

There's a great little book that unravels all of this called "Lies My Music Teacher Told Me" by Gerald Eskelin.

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