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Topic: Where the blues came from: Spirituals |
Darryl Hattenhauer
From:
Phoenix, Arizona, USA
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Posted 7 Nov 2007 4:49 pm |
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Alston and Friends: spiritual “Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=goj5DiA8Fhk
Anonymous: spiritual “Sometimes I Feel Like a Motherless Child”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3ENKDDZwp40
Marian Anderson: spiritual “ Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=p7IG3CgW914
Aufführung Quartett: spiritual “Roll Jordan Roll”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=7RnTYcvIf9g
Kathleen Battle: spiritual “Swing Low Sweet Chariot”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=UVyBjqY3r0k
Eva Cassidy: spiritual “Wade in the Water”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Logw58qUw-U
Chanson d'Aube: spiritual “Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=IcXPlhXAu_4
Sam Cooke: spiritual “Steal Away”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=GBfqM72XN8Y
Coro Gospel of Grand Canary: spiritual “Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=zF-3M3Al8jo
Coral da UFRGS: Spiritual “Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ljTC8EbYoiw
Fisk Jubilee Singers:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HBLIZ4wc9Rw
Fitiavana Gospel Choir: spiritual “Swing Low”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Ko2xRR
Bulent Guneralp: spiritual “Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=XIqYSdTTNvw
Pete Huttlinger: guitar--acoustic
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWCKL_MHRoU
International Youth Choir: spiritual “Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=mrpaY8oywxY
Japanese School Children: spiritual: “Swing Low “
http://youtube.com/watch?v=1YodeuneXPU
Jessye Norman: spiritual “Great Day”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5L1T1dbJHQU
Orpheus Choir of Bangkok and the Siam Philharmonic
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_K64s6Lp8ZU
Pilgrim Jubilee Singers: spiritual “Old Ship Of Zion”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPOn5n6dhnw&NR=1
Bryant Ray: Spiritual “Sometimes I Feel Like a Motherless Child”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hOki0p8M02c
Dr. Bernice Johnson Reagon: spiritual “Steal Away”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=aIrj6FqD4wg
Rebertone: spiritual “Swing Low Sweet Chariot” (Caution: Banjo)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=ECjZh3OHdSI
Paul Robeson: spiritual
http://youtube.com/watch?v=W76QjLsQADQ
Rochester College a Capella Choir: spiritual “Wade in the Water”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LNmYXUXPyVk
Sybil Smoot & Florence Gospel Choir: spiritual “Deep River”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=T7TdcGDb1dM
supervalentijn : spiritual “Wade In The Water”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FJKl44VxQJc
Taipei Chamber Singers: spiritual “Swing Low”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=swtjgcKgf8Q
Take 6 LIVE: spiritual “Wade In The Water”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CkKyeGSiscQ
Sir Michael Tippit: “Go Down Moses” (Hong Kong)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=51f3r3yz8cY
UB40: spiritual “Swing Low Sweet Chariot”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=Xb25pqs-OEA
Voces8: spiritual “Steal Away”
http://youtube.com/watch?v=sLXbUKoumsM
VoCollision: spiritual--“Go Down Moses” (Singapore)
http://youtube.com/watch?v=jH9iGneB-aE
Rev KM Williams: spiritual “Wade in The Water“
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwvZyoLnKSs
_________________
Steel crazy after all these years.
$100 reward for info leading to the purchase of a fender D8 white, yellow, or butterscotch. |
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David Doggett
From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
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Posted 7 Nov 2007 6:05 pm
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| And the juke joints were full on Saturday night. |
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Steinar Gregertsen
From:
Arendal, Norway, R.I.P.
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Posted 7 Nov 2007 6:56 pm
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| Where the blues came from: Spirituals |
Correct me if I'm wrong, I won't pretend to be an expert on the timeline of American music, but I've always believed the spirituals came from the blues, as a more sophisticated musical form and with a spiritual content?
_________________
"Play to express, not to impress"
Website - YouTube |
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David Doggett
From:
Bawl'mer, MD (formerly of MS, Nawluns, Gnashville, Knocksville, Lost Angeles, Bahsten. and Philly)
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Posted 7 Nov 2007 9:40 pm
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Well, it depends on what you mean by "blues." There is a good bit written in the historical record about spirituals, going back into the time of slavery. I'm not sure if much was written about secular slave music. What we usually think of as blues is first written about later, by people like Handy and Allen Lomax, who began to record it. But that seems to have derived from field hollers and secular music that would seem to go back into slavery times in parallel with spirituals. Both spirituals and blues are influenced by European traditions, both in lyrics and music. European chauvinism would call those influences “more sophisticated,” but modern cultural relativism wouldn’t.
One then has to ask what existed in West Africa before colonial slavery. What was there in terms of religious music and secular music? While the precursors and influences are there in Africa, it wouldn't seem right to label those according to the terminology of the later American genres. This is complicated by the question if there was a religious/secular dichotomization in Africa that was in any way analogous to the dichotomization in America. Whites were quite tolerant of Christian spirituals, but not as tolerant of non-Christian black music. The latter was not entirely secular, but was a mixture of secular and African pagan religious themes. This non-Christian music was what was heard in Congo Square in New Orleans, out on the shores of Lake Pontchartrain with Marie Laveaux, and other places in the South. This mixture of African religious and secular themes was carried forward into recorded blues with concepts like mojo, John the Conqueroo, seventh son, etc.
In the times of the Delta blues and its electrification in Chicago, there was a very intense struggle between the European derived Christianity of the black churches, and the “Devil’s music” in the juke joints and Saturday-night clubs. But the “Devil” in that music was not necessarily the European Christian Devil, associated with the secular
”evils” of sex, alcohol, drugs and violence, but was also the remnants of African paganism. Some black musicians were understood as having chosen the “Devil’s music,” maybe even to have sold their souls. But in a sense they may have seen themselves as choosing something more pure and African, and less white. In one of John Lee Hooker’s last songs he said, “Ain’t no heaven, ain’t no hell, where I go when I die, cain’t no one tell.” This is not worship of the Christian Devil, but is a repudiation of the simplistic old-fashioned Christianity of the rural South (white and black), and the recognition of a more universal spiritualism that encompasses aspects of Christianity as well as other religions. This strain of universal spirituality goes from blues through jazz, for example in John Coltrane’s “A Love Supreme.” This universal spirituality is very consciously felt and nurtured by black jazz and blues musicians I play with every week. It is very much part of the magic of this music.
So to get back to the original topic, neither Christian spirituals nor blues derived from each other (although they influenced each other), but rather both derived from things much further back.
(Didn’t exactly know where I was going with this, but it turned out to get pretty deep. Not trying to get off into arguing about religion, but you can’t talk about religious music without mentioning religion. Please, don’t anyone take this as meant to offend anyone’s religion, and please don’t anyone go off on a non-musical tangent and get this thread closed.) |
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Darryl Hattenhauer
From:
Phoenix, Arizona, USA
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Posted 7 Nov 2007 11:06 pm
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David,
I wish I knew all of this history. But from what I do know, I agree absolutely. For example, the whole idea of sacred and secular. And the fact that a lot of these styles are running parallel to each other and are always borrowing from each other.
I don't think anybody will think we're trying to say anything negative about religion. I just like all of this stuff as music, and I'd like it even if it were in a language I don't know well. I suspect some of the people singing this don't understand some of the lyrics, and it's the music they like.
Steinar,
Do you know that Swedish comedy song "Norge, Norge"? It came out in about 1970, and it was sung by Moltas Erikson in a group with an English name, "Hjelmer Bryd and His Eminent Five Quartet."
_________________
Steel crazy after all these years.
$100 reward for info leading to the purchase of a fender D8 white, yellow, or butterscotch. |
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Dave Mudgett
From:
Central Pennsylvania and Gallatin, Tennessee
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Posted 8 Nov 2007 1:38 am
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It's my sense that the unique mixing of African and Western styles that ultimately turned into what a lot of people now term spiritual and blues music came from amalgamation of Protestant hymns with African tonalities, so I pretty much view that type of blues as a sprituals descendant.
But I guess it depends on what you call "the blues". There are different lines, and some of this is more Western-influenced than others. David's example of John Lee Hooker is a good one. To me, he definitely always sounded more purely African in influence than many other well-known blues stylists, and there are many others not so well known. Similarly with gospel music. Some sounds more Western-influenced to me, some not so much. I like it all, no judgements here.
I guess this is one of the difficulties with trying to rank-order anything humans do, including influences. I agree that everything borrows from anything around that it wants to - I view human endeavor as basically opportunistic, and I don't mean that in a bad way. It's just the way life seems to be, to me. |
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