The Steel Guitar Forum

Classic Freddie
http://youtube.com/watch?v=72OASdHYN0Y

With a head-cold I can't even begin to hear the tuning. Does anyone know, recognize or can analyze the tuning he's using?

Thank You,

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Dang, I wanna learn the bluesy stuff he starts doing at 2:15. That is too .

That's a jarringly different interpretation of that tune. He manages to make it his own while taking out into new territory.

Freddie was here playing his NATIONAL a few years ago. He did a 2 hour single at the now defunct SIDETRACK nite club. An amazing guy with a very unique style all of his own!

That's the song that got him to stop calling me to play bass with him back in the day.

Thank You, Michael.

That inspires me to go take another / better look at mostly triad tunings' inversions and different root voicings, ....and try to fish out some larnin' 'bout them side-by side same notes in the tunin'.

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Thanks again MLA.

Anyone got some ideas about using the tuning's same-2-notes side-by-side?

I take notice of his style on that Sleepwalk video going all over the neck, ...and that his voicings are particularly of Partials and even single notes accentuating certain chords; Which makes me wonder if his tuning is specific to a broad fretboard pattern that that might not be very mobile to all keys (ie would get too high on the fretboard in some keys, or not lend to open strings in some keys, etc). Are an abnormal number of his recorded songs in the same key ...or in keys within 2 or 3 half steps of a central tonic? I'm fishing to see if his specific tuning establishes an inherent and wide fretboard layout that lends itself best to keys within a couple of half steps horizontally on the fretboard. And even if he does play some songs over a full gambit of keys; If his broader creativity / style expresses better in a tight key range, then it suggests that the tuning is used for a particular broad fretboard pattern; But if his broader creativity spans the full gambit of keys, then I would know to look at / study the tuning's different root inversions rather than looking for a particular fretboard pattern the tuning lends itself better-to for his style / thinking.

His jazzy / funky style in that tuning captures my interest that the tuning's heavy triad structure might afford some root inversion voicings that I might not have noticed in a 6th tuning's 6th voice "hiding" / camouflaging such inversions, ...or in the 6th voice string misaligning such inversions for slants.

I sure hope I can find some time to map out a slide rule in his tuning. It sure could shed some light comparing the utility of his tuning vs a 6th tuning; And I've wanted to map out stacked triads for such a comparison for awhile anyway.

Any theory ideas insights from other Fo'Bros about this tuning would be much appreciated.

Thank You.

Denny Turner wrote: I sure hope I can find some time to map out a slide rule in his tuning. It sure could shed some light comparing the utility of his tuning vs a 6th tuning; And I've wanted to map out stacked triads for such a comparison for awhile anyway.

Any theory ideas insights from other Fo'Bros about this tuning would be much appreciated.

Thank You.

The top 6 strings of his tuning is the same 135135 tuning (low to high) that most dobro players use, except they're (usually) tuned to G, not A. So you should be able to find much info from most dobro books - like for example Stacy Phillips' "The Complete Dobro Player". Or maybe I misunderstood your question...

Steinar

i can't imagine doing a video by the golden gate in leather pants........

and he can smoke a pipe at the same time!!!!!!

Here's another one:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=S6e3aogig_4

Thank You, Steiner.

No, I was trying to be lazy ...hoping someone might have done some mode sliderule fretboard charting on triad or 7th tunings and useing it, ...and thus might have some immediate insight / contributions for why Fred chose and uses his tuning; (Like / hoping there might be some magic fretboard boxes and pockets scattered about in a triad tuning without the 6th note included; My familiarity with the congruent squared boxes of a 6th tuning gets pretty squashed / smashed up without the 6th note ...and another world entirely for slants).

No problem, ...I'm almost finished with charting it and will post when (if ?) I get it done.

First, I hope no-one feels I am hi-jacking their or this discussion. If so, I apologize and will be glad to move my interests to a new discussion posting.

OK, ...I got the fretboard mapping done. I just had to take a look because I've wanted to chart triads for some time now but kept putting it off. No doubt that triads "alone" would squash the nice, square, straight-bar, scale / chord / mode boxes of 6th tunings, and therefore skew the mental picture of voicings, particularly with slants. Hearing Freddie's voicings on the Sleepwalk video, I further wanted some insight into whether he had such charting and navigation up his sleeve in addition to a long history of rote experience / discovery / etc.

After doing the chart work, I think what Freddie does IS more rote experience than a specific full mental picture of scale / modal sliderule navigation; The charts seem to reveal an enormous abstract to memorize ...although some interesting congruency in patterns across a modal sliderule; Virtually ALL of the in-mode / in-scale partials, voicings and slants remain right in place (with different step voicings), automatically corrected for the scale / mode "package" (the only word I could think of since they're sure not boxes like the 6th tuning) as the slide-rule template is moved along the neck. Although, I think the chances are very good that Freddie has a good understading of what he is voicing. I've been amazed and joyed over the many years how much theory the black Musicians' circles have and share (even if it's "archaic" to academia); Most of those Guys that were taking their Music serious, had a passion for understanding the broadest aspects of what they were playing and learning; "No better" illustrated than "New York" Jazz that influenced much of what came out of "Detroit", "Philidelphia", etc, in the 1960's, ...and the interactions during that period that taught and produced such great music out of Muscle Shoals, ...Duane Allman and the ABB a good example of being taught theories that were filtering through the black Musician communities; And even the Beatles who learned it from Phil's exposure to "Motown" (or was it Mofo-town ). BUT, since the vast majority of fine Pickers play by rote experience built around whatever "theories" they've studied or picked-up along the way, it speaks worlds for the character / treasure of rote playing. Although it certainly doesn't hurt to have a chart in searching / analyzing / exploring new things.

I would be delighted to learn any insights or suggestions anyone might see or have to add to the charting work's evolution; ....or about the "foolishness" of such analyzations; ....etc.

Here's the initial work on the chart.

Thank You.

THANK YOU Colin. THAT sure sheds bright light on where allot of Freddie's voicing positions are coming from, ...especially being able to reference the chart in reinforcing an inquisitive ear; Maybe even in getting an insight into how he thinks / views / manages patterns in his mind. It's even got some pretty clear shots of those jazz frills that Jeff liked.

I sure hope some Fo'Bros can pick some stuff outa that video and share them here.

Denny, thanks for taking an interest in decoding Freddie's playing. You can see his hands and therefore his bar positions much more clearly--characteristic trills and frills are more visible if not for transcription, then at least for groking and inspiration. This transparency (yeah, right)is part of what I was trying to achieve with the still unfinished video from Lapstravaganza. Mike Johnstone is working long and hard--nights after his money gigs to edit the video. If ya see Mike, buy him a beer and tell him how much we appreciate his work.
My Goal:
Access for other players to the magic that is Mr. Fred Roulette.

Freddie Roulette live concert with Harvey Mandel, Steve Kimock & Henry Kaiser (ten songs on Disc 2):

http://www.archive.org/details/pgc1993-08-01.flac16