The Steel Guitar Forum

Just in from watching Bobby Ingano on stage with one of the new Fender lap steels that hasn't gotten much good press.
He's quite impressed with it, saying he's been enjoying it for day's. And that's saying something, as Bobby is a quick and harsh critic.
The down side - it came with the old style K & F headstock/nut plate at a severe angle (hello! Fender quality control!) for which Bobby had installed a vintage replacement for, and the mirrored chrome fretboard would be blinding in many circumstances. I understand the newer issues have corrected this with a black fretboard. He'd removed the PU cover to allow muting at the bridge, which exposed a dorky looking Strat style PU. But other than that, and the high price ($800!) being charged, it seems to be better than what's being said.
This example was a translucent light gray, that showed what looked like an ash body, with the strings hooked into the chromed bridge plate at the tail, and sporting knurled Tele style V&T control knobs.
Not a bad looking guitar.

Shame on Fender however, for getting these made so cheap and retailing so high.

How did it sound with him playing it?

Are you kidding? He can make a pile of mud sound like you need to rush out and get a new pile of mud!

Which is why I valued his excited input on this particular guitar, as I'd been hearing nothing but bad news about it.
I thot it sounded rather sweet and full in tone. And Bobby is all about tone.
I was quite suprised to see him with it, and assumed he was just test running it for the moment, but he dug it.

Doesn't it make more sense that Bobby's ability to make mud sound great would devalue his excitement?

I'm having some difficulty interpreting the critique. (Par for my handicap). And I'm interested because those new Fenders will start showing up more and more in used instrument sales. So since the subject is critique, then here's my 2 cents for the sake of folks that might come along seeking critique:

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Is it even in Bobby to offer a negative critique of anything ...especially in "public"? (Complimentary jest).

I'll bet he could make this other Steel being discussed sound good; ...and probably get a big grinnin' kick out of it (although probably shaking his head)! ....Maybe even take a liking to it; Who knows.

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It's not unusual for just about any playable instrument to suit someone's particular likings; But I think a larger majority's opinions might be more telling, ...which you seem to suggest (?). Voila, ...one of the first-run Vxxxxxxxx "Steels" affectionately displayed on my shop wall (brand censored to not insult a now-succesful local Musician); So crude that it's just a few steps above Bubba's in the other abovesaid SGF discussion; Yet I've heard from several "studio-guys" that some of those in "V's" first-run have specificly been used & liked on local recordings for their tone (probably requiring corrected / accurate fretboard markings to be playable). But I bet most folks would be hard pressed to pay even $50 for one. (Yea I know, I made a much more expensive trade for that "V", ...but that's another story of different values).

Did / would Bobby go out and spend $800 for the new Fender he was playing?

Doesn't it make more sense that Bobby's ability to make mud sound great would devalue his excitement?

Sounds like a line from the documentary movie "Woodstock"!

If he didn't like the headstock, the fret board, and the pickup, what DID he like?

...but I tried one, and thought it might - MIGHT be worth $150, or possibly even $199 retail, but that would be it. I think they were retailing it for $449 or something ridiculous when I tried it, but now they want $800!!???? I think Elderly still sells 'em for $449 though.

Maybe Bobby was playing the 'custom shop' model?

Those of us who know Bobby personally know he will try anything at least once.
He played the proto-type Harmos on stage at Joliet without a fret board!! It wasn't quite finished for the convention, but the designer brought anyway, which didn't matter to Bobby.
On his first CD he used a Fender Champ for one or two tunes, so if it sounds right to him , he will use it.

Hey Jeff, are you just making 'selective' appearances these day's?

EB, where did I state that he didn't like any of the things you mentioned?
Of what he did like, maybe..., the playability and sound(?).

Bill, I knew you'd understand!

TW, the one you tried may have had 'issues' as well that inhibited it's potential.

DT, the local shop Bobby picked it up at (Easy), gave it to him at $500, because he's a long time patron/friend/player. But, that's still too high, and if the quality control is so poor, thier not worth more than what TW stated.

He purchased the guitar for a friend, and was testing it out before handing it over.

Bottom line, at those prices and poor set up, pass.

Does anyone have a photo ?

Alan, if you google - new fender lap steel, you'll find pix from sellers.

I got mine at a local music shop for $400, with a decent case. That's still way over-priced, but I didn't even know this board existed when I got it. The fender is an overpriced starter for guys (like me) who never had seen a lap before.

Here's one on eBay Click Here

...it only has six strings. I wouldn't buy a lap steel with fewer than eight.

It has always seemed to me that the reason there are and have been so many 6-string lap steels around is to allow the manufacturer to economize by using regular electric guitar parts.

Fender and other makers of only six stringers are generally not that serious about steel guitar, and the steels they make often show it. But it took Leo quite a while to make an 8. It's also a way of testing the waters for those tentative to jump in with both feet, but shows lack of conviction.

Lot's of great music has been made on steels with less than 8 strings, so it's hard to knock them.

It's always nice to get more chord possiblities, but how many times during a single arrangment does one really get down to playing on the 7th and 8th string??

I agree with Ron that a lot of music can be obtained with the use of only 6 strings. Here are just a list (off the top of my head) of Hawaiian steel players who have used 6 stringers for many of their recordings.

Tau Moe - Tri-Cone
Ken Emerson - Tri-Cone
Sol Ho'opi'i - Tri-Cone
Bobby Nichols - Tri-Cone
Billy Hew Len - Rickenbacker Fry Pan
Andy Iona - Rickenbacker Fry Pan
Dick McIntire - Rickenbacker Fry Pan
David "Feet" Rogers - Rickenbacker Bakelite
David Kelii - Epiphone
Pua Almeida - Rickenbacker Frypan
Tommy Castro - Vega
Joe Custino - Rickenbacker Frypan
David Nalu - National New Yorker

Sometimes 6 strings even seems like too much! Seriously, I could probably survive on the top 4 strings (min/maj/min thirds low to high). There is just so much available on those 4 what with slants and all, I haven't really thought about those 5th and 6th strings "way down there"!

I need 5 ... the sixth is when I get fancy

Six strings are plenty enough.

Yeah, every so often you reach down and hit that .72 gauged eighth string for a F A T sound, but you pay for that once in a while sound with a narrower string spacing.

Why haven't the new steel builders of today make a wider fret board so the string spacing of an 8 stringer will be the same as a 6? or do most of you out there prefer that close string spacing?

Derrick, I had two custom made lap steel guitars built by Ryan Rukavina and he did as you said. He made the 8 string fret board wider to attain the same string spacing as the 6 string, both being about 3/8 inch.

Derrick Mau wrote:...how many times during a single arrangment does one really get down to playing on the 7th and 8th string??

That all depends on what tuning you're using. Some tunings have a greater range than others. The 8th string on an 8-string instrument need not be lower than the 6th string on a 6-string instrument.

On the C6 neck of a 10-string D10 Sho-Bud I find myself using the 7th and 8th strings a lot. I like to tune an 8-string lap steel to the same tuning as the top 8 strings of a C6 10-string neck.

I played 6-string lap steels for years, but in those days I usually tuned to open E.

Derrick Mau wrote:Why haven't the new steel builders of today make a wider fret board so the string spacing of an 8 stringer will be the same as a 6? or do most of you out there prefer that close string spacing?

When I build 8-string lap steels I use the same spacing as on 6-strings, and so the neck is wider. I find the string spacing on modern pedal steels to be too close with my big fingers.
I have the same complaint about regular guitars. Why do they build steel-strung guitars with narrower spacing than classical guitars ? Are non-classical guitarists supposed to have narrower fingers ?

Derrick Mau wrote:Why haven't the new steel builders of today make a wider fret board so the string spacing of an 8 stringer will be the same as a 6? or do most of you out there prefer that close string spacing?

I do ... 7/16" at bridge ... 3/8" at nut ...



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