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Topic: Can a speaker just die of old age? |
George Kimery
From:
Limestone, TN, USA
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 5:33 am |
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| My BW 1501 speaker took a turn for the worse. It came in my 1984 Evans, but I have been using it in my Steel King. I played a small room gig on Friday night at a very low volume. Amp worked fine. I got it out on Sunday to play it, and the bass strings sounded like a fuzz tone. Moving up to strings 5 & 6, the distortion was there, but slightly. On strings 3 and 5, I can't really hear it. I always thought you had to drive an amp hard to blow a speaker. This is not the case. I tried changing cords and running straight from the guitar, no improvement. I then used a jumper wire to connect it to another amp, just to eliminate the amp as the culprit. Still, the same result. It is definately the speaker. The paper cone looks perfect. It did not get hit with anything or turn over in the van. Would it be worth repairing? How much would it cost to just replace the basket? I have had it 23 years, so maybe it is just it's time. |
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Don Sulesky
From:
Citrus County, FL, Orig. from MA & NH
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 5:52 am
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When I built my speaker cabs about 2+ years ago I paid $105 each for my BW's, but then I got a discount from the dealer.
Don |
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Andy Zynda
From:
Wisconsin
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 6:12 am Old Age
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Speakers usually dont fail from age.
But age combined with moisture, shocks, or very low humidity can cause problems.
The moisture can cause the spider, and cone to expand and/or contract, and if the moisture content is not uniform for some reason, the voice coil can become off-center or skewed in the gap.
Low humidity can cause the glue joint to become brittle and develop tiny cracks. Also, the cone folds in the surround and become brittle and also crack.
Finally, shocks. Dropping or setting an amp down hard, riding in a very bumpy trailer, etc. can cause the magnet to shift very slightly, sometimes causing a rub.
One last thing. If any kind of dust or foreign material finds it's way into the gap, the fuzz and buzz will drive you crazy. If it's ferrous (magnetic) at all, you cant get it out. (without de-magging / re-magging)
A new basket assembly should fix the problem.
-andy z- |
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Jon Light (deceased)
From:
Saugerties, NY
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 6:47 am
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LINK
Within the link, above, is a link to a sound file with an example of coil rub. I found it useful to finally understand just what rub sounds like. Doesn't address your question but.... |
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Mike Brown
From:
Meridian, Mississippi USA
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 6:55 am BW speaker
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Andy has just about covered all of the reasons for failure. But, if your BW is "post" Peavey Spider/BW(with the spider decal), you may be able to swap out the speaker basket only unless the problem lies within the magnet structure. The replacement basket number is 00027020 and it can be ordered through the factory parts department or from your local Peavey dealer. The toll free factory consumer number is 1-877-732-8391, ext. 1180.
Mike Brown
Peavey USA |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 7:55 am
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Everyone forgot about "cleaning the gap". I had one that was buzzing - cleaned the gap and no more problems.
Take the magnet off of the basket, check for anything on the inside of the magnet or the basket (clean them off). Also check inside the coil for any dust/dirt etc and blow that out (but not with an air gun). Put the magnet back on and tighten all the bolts approximately the same (I've never seen a torque figure for the bolts). |
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George Kimery
From:
Limestone, TN, USA
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 10:46 am Can a speaker just die of old age?
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| I took the magnet off as Jack suggested and found some pieces of dry rotted foam inside the silver cup that is attached to the diaphram. Also, there was some black, stickys stuff on one side of the silver cup. I cleaned it all up real nice and cleaned the magnet where it touches the basket. I connected the speaker and it works just fine now. You guys on the forum are wonderful. How did we live without it. Thanks to all who responded. |
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David Mason
From:
Cambridge, MD, USA
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 11:38 am
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| I have heard of people with EV and JBL speakers who have had the same speakers for 20 years, they claim they just get better. For "stylistic" reasons, some rock guitarists use very low-wattage speakers like Celestion 25 and 30 watt models, pushed to the limits. They claim to like the sound of speaker distortion, never mind that "Jimi used them" because that's what Jim Marshall gave him, free. A Black Widow ought to last like a JBL, I would think - your eardrums will go first, unless something's wrong with it (like crud in it). |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 12:18 pm
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Robert Leaman
From:
Murphy, North Carolina, USA
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 1:09 pm Old Age
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| Human speakers die of old age. |
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Michael Douchette
From:
Gallatin, TN (deceased)
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Colby Tipton
From:
Crosby, Texas, USA
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Posted 10 Jul 2007 1:55 pm
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| Jack to the rescue. |
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Jim Sliff
From:
Lawndale California, USA
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Posted 11 Jul 2007 5:02 am
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| Quote: |
Speakers usually dont fail from age.
But age combined with moisture, shocks, or very low humidity can cause problems. |
You don't need any of those conditions. Some speakers will have glue harden and fail over time; some VC's are insulated with material that simply hardens and breaks down with age. And some spiders simply rot no matter what the conditions.
It would not be unusual for a 23 year old speaker to also lose some power-handling capability. Ted Weber at WeberVST has posted about this on other forums.
_________________
No chops, but great tone
1930's/40's Rickenbacher/Rickenbacker 6&8 string lap steels
1921 Weissenborn Style 2; Hilo&Schireson hollownecks
Appalachian, Regal & Dobro squarenecks
1959 Fender 400 9+2 B6;1960's Fender 800 3+3+2; 1948 Fender Dual-8 Professional |
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Mike Brown
From:
Meridian, Mississippi USA
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Posted 11 Jul 2007 9:46 am Peavey BW Speakers
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| Thanks for using Peavey products. |
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George Kimery
From:
Limestone, TN, USA
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Posted 12 Jul 2007 7:17 am Can a speaker just die of old age?
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| Well, the speaker is officially gone.It worked fine after I took the magnet off and cleaned it up inside, but when I installed it back into the amp, it had a loud hum, like a 60 cycle hum. Just like a bad cord where the ground and the hot wire are touching. Tried different cords on another amp, so it is not the cord. The speaker sounds a bit odd before you plug the cord in. Once the cord goes in, it sounds a lot better, but then when you plug the cord into a guitar, the hum hits big time. I jumped the speaker off from another amp with the same result. I am going to pull a black widow speaker with the spider web design on it, out of an old Session 500. At this point, I don't know if replacing the basket would fix it or if it is in the magnet. I checked the speaker terminals and they seem just fine. I can't see anything that doesn't look right anywhere. So I guess I will just consider it old and dead unless somebody has a better idea. I don't want to throw good money after bad trying to revive an old, dead horse. |
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Mike Wheeler
From:
Delaware, Ohio, USA
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Posted 12 Jul 2007 10:38 am
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George, speakers don't cause hum. They only make audible what the amp puts out. It sounds like an internal problem in the amp. You say you hooked up a different speaker and still had the hum, so that should prove to you the speaker isn't the problem.
Or did I misunderstand your description?
_________________
Best regards,
Mike |
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Mike Brown
From:
Meridian, Mississippi USA
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Posted 13 Jul 2007 5:25 am speaker
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| I agree. |
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George Kimery
From:
Limestone, TN, USA
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Posted 13 Jul 2007 6:51 am Can a speaker just die of old age?
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| I am sorry for not being clear. I unhooked the speaker wires on my brand new Steel King and ran a jumper wire from it to the BW speaker. It hummed just like it did from the Evans Amp. I ran the wire then from the Evans to the speaker in the Steel King, no hum. So, I have went both ways with two amps into two different speakers. The one speaker in the Steel King does not hum with either amp connected. The BW speaker hums when either amp is hooked to it. It has to be the speaker. |
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Jack Stoner
From:
Kansas City, MO
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Posted 13 Jul 2007 9:17 am
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| Is there anything else connected to the BW speaker? Make sure nothing else is connected except, for example, the wires from the Steel King. And, if you are running separate wires from the Steel King amp, make sure you are using twisted pair wires so that there is no AC hum picked up by the wires. |
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Mike Wheeler
From:
Delaware, Ohio, USA
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Posted 13 Jul 2007 10:03 am
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Are both speakers the same impedance, George? Check them with an ohm meter...don't rely on just the markings on the speakers.
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Best regards,
Mike |
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George Kimery
From:
Limestone, TN, USA
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Posted 16 Jul 2007 6:58 am Can a speaker just die of old age?
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Well, the latest is that the speaker is working but there is a grounding problem. If I turn the amp up very much, I get a pretty loud 60 cycle hum. If I just touch either end of the guitar cord metal casing with my finger, the hum is gone. I have tried different cords and different guitars but nothing helps. I squirted some Big Bath into the jacks and tried to use a cue tip to clean them up. Did not help.
It is not cords or guitars, it is in the amp. I thought it was the wiring in my old house, so I took it to work with me and tried it there, still the same hum. I am such a novice at this sort of stuff I don't know what to do. It seems like a minor problem that can be solved quite easily if I just knew what to try. The only ideas I have now are to pull the chasis and try cleaning or replacing the jacks. I could do the same in the guitar, too, but since both guitars that I tried have the same problem, I doubt if it is the guitar.
The pickup on the steel is a Jerry Wallace, single coil. The acoustic guitar I am using is a Takamine with the built in factory pickup. Maybe it is pickup hum, but the amp never did it before now. This is a desperate idea, but if I take a jumper wire and solder it to the guitar cord casing, then to a screw in the amp chasis, that would probably work. Or, should I pull the chasis and solder a wire from the grounding part on the jack, then solder it to the chasis body? These two solutions seem far fetched. There has got to be an easier way to ground this thing.
I need to use the amp this coming Saturday and I sure could use some help. Thanks. |
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Mike Wheeler
From:
Delaware, Ohio, USA
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Posted 16 Jul 2007 10:07 am
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George, I agree the problem is in the amp, and seems like a bad ground. But, without any experience in electronics, I'd advise against you doing anything inside...you're liable to make things worse, or get injured (possibly seriously). The cause of the hum could be many different things, one of which could be a bad ground.
You need to take it to a good amp tech. This job requires a pro. There are too many factors to deal with for this to be handled as a home remedy.
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Best regards,
Mike |
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