The Steel Guitar Forum

I have been playing E9 for a year and a half and feel very good about my progress. I have taken a few private lessons from a very good instructor as well as followed some of the beginning and intermediate Jeff Newman courses. I have a very good feel for my scales and fills involving the AB pedals and D and F levers (I'm still weak on my BC pedal combo). I would like to work on being able to take a simple solo once in a while; I have not yet made the connection between the scales and fills which I have been learning and putting them to practical use in a song solo context. Any advice on how to get started using my scales or fills to make simple solos? Most of the instructional tapes present the scales very well but are weak on relating them to practical use of them. Are there any good instructional tapes or DVD's which cover this topic?...CF

Charles,
http://jeffran.com/courses.php?content=JustJammin

Jeff Newmans "Just Jamming" CD's with the tab show you his idea for the solo or melody and then gives you a ton of music to work out your own ideas.

Soloing is something that comes with time and practice. Learn a few licks and then tie them together. Go thru some of the tab found in the tab section here and pick up some ideas. Good luck!

Wow! Sounds like you have really progressed fast. and I agree the switch ab down to bc down smoothly is hard at full speed.

For soloing you might get Paul Franklin's speed picking cd's; for us newbies they are tough, but then its all tough at this stage. They are available on his website and though they do not include tabs he walks you through each progression veerrry slowly so you don't miss the tab.

Charlie,

I’m going to send you an email containing a MP3.
It’s a recording from a gig last month, of the song I Fall to Pieces.
I’m pretty sure you’re familiar with this song.
You can listen to it and hear how I play the intro part, fills during the song, and the lead solo, or ride, as sometimes referred to as in the steel guitar community.
It was recorded just with an old cheap cassette recorder next to my amp, so the fidelity and tone is not that good, and I will sound much louder in the recorded mix than I really did with the band that night. (That’s also me playing the piano with my finger picks still on)
I’m not claiming it to be a perfect performance, but you’ll certainly be able to hear the steel loud enough and get some ideas of what you liked and disliked about what and when I played.
I was basically jamming, without any of my parts except for the intro being worked out ahead of time, and I actually liked much of what I did.
You may notice that I ended my “ride” by going to a dominant 7th sound. By itself this sounded fine, but in the context of the band’s performance it ended up sounding a little weird because the vocalist started singing a verse again, instead of the “b” section of the song, that I expected. That sometimes goes with the territory during a live unrehearsed gig situation.

Soloing / Taking a lead or ride:

1. Play the melody and phrasing as sung by the vocalist, as close as you can
2. Play the melody but add a few or possibly many embellishments
3. Only hint at the original melody, and basically make up your own melody & phrasing to the song’s chord changes
4. Pick the individual notes of each chord / arpeggio, going through the changes
5. Play cool sounding psg licks/riffs for each individual chord change
6. Play scales or “pockets” in the song’s key

The above ideas, which are not necessarily in any order, should get you started. You could also mix and match them as you please. I’m pretty sure some of this will make sense to you, and whatever doesn’t, feel free to contact me.
I realize you may not like all these ideas, or may not have enough practice time behind you yet to be able to execute them fluidly on the pedal steel. If nothing else, at least it gives you something to try focusing on during practice.
I suggest getting out and playing with a band in a live situation, and recording what you did.
With more and more experience, your own ears, and feedback from fellow musicians, will tell you which ideas work best for different styles of songs.

Unfortunately, although sort of lengthy, my answer is pretty much generic, and doesn’t actually address your issue of how to use the scales and fills you already know, and turn them from a practice exercise into an interesting coherent lead solo. At this point, I’m not positive there is that much of a difference. You tell me – in my solo, I didn’t play anything that couldn’t be found in a scale or a basic psg lick or fill, yet I played it during the solo section and I would call it a ride or solo. I guess one difference is, when you’re practicing, you might go over and over the same few notes of a scale. It wouldn’t be that interesting if you just played the major scale over and over again for the chord changes. It usually sounds “better” if you break the solo up into segments or phrases and “tie” them together. My guess is you’re probably doing this already, but you’re so wrapped up in focusing on what you’re practicing, you may not be truly hearing that it sounds coherent and good.
I just thought of another suggestion – Learn a basic simple solo that you like, as close to note for note as you can. Then work backwards and see how it may fit into a scale or lick pattern, and maybe looking at it from this different perspective, will be helpful.

Keep me posted on your progress.

Good luck,
Marc

Marc's suggestions are on the money!

I stress to my students: first be able to play the melody accurately. Then, with home study, work out your own ideas on how to embellish the melody, make little neat tweaks to it. Be creative!

One key skill we work on is how to hear the melody in scale tones. Once you can do that pretty accurately, and then be able to find that scale tone melody on your steel in one or more positions, the world opens up.

Again, melody first, that's the true key, imho.

Then work backwards

At first I thought this guy Marc was channeling ME, then I read -

and see how it may fit into a scale or lick pattern.

The best advice I ever got and what I stress to my guitar students is:
Learn how to start, and stop, your licks at any note within the lick, and play them backwards, wholely and in segments.
Many players, even most, can only play each lick as a entire entity unto itself. Every lick starts at the beginning, goes all the way to the end, and trying to vary off the beaten path is like pulling teeth. Well, GET OUT THE PLIERS. When you start breaking licks apart into segments of rhythmic groupings and melodic contours, everything unlocks and your own favorite licks become your own teacher and you start seeing any & every melody as a springboard to variations ad infinitum. It's impossible to describe how powerfully this technique works until you try it.

Thanks so much for your advice and feedback..it made a great impact on me and lots of lightbulbs went off for me this week. Before this week, my soloing has consisted of a combination of simple Newman fills, and some simple arpeggios which mirror what the band is doing. Sort of boring at times.

Subsequent to your replys on the Forum, I picked a song by the Dixie Chicks called "Am I the Only One" in the key of C and sat down at the piano and worked out a very simple (but cool) melody to play over the chord changes in this song (C, F, G, Am, E). Then I took my "Just Play the Melody" (two tone) scales from Jeff Newman's course and matched the chord tones in his scales to the individual notes which I worked out on the piano and VOILA!... I am shocked at how good it sounds. My playing is now independent of what chords are being played by the band; this provides better texture to the music since I am not playing so much in unison with them. Thanks so much and does it sound like I am barking up the right tree in my methodology and thinking? Now I am just working on practicing the scales so that I become more fluid in my runs up and down the scales and in picking the appropriate tones within the scale for any given situation. I'm am now confident that I will master picking the appropriate tones as I continue to practice.

My next step will be to work on the embellishments to which you have been referring. For example, I am most curious about how steelers use really cool introductory tone phrases leading into the solo ... I don't know the exact correct terminology so let me try to explain in laymans terms... in the Key of C, play an A and a B leading into the C (at the beginning of the solo); experienced steelers use some intricate picking to express the A and B lead notes going to the C..does that make sense? Any tips on how to express these tones leading into the solo? Sorry if I am not using the correct terminology or am not being clear on this question...CF

Since this post is not a FOR SALE discussion any longer, should I be posting this somewhere else on the PSG forum?...CF

Charles.I have been reading your post's for quite a while.It always says the same thing.Is it possible the material you are studying is not right for you?
When you visited me in Las Vegas ,you spoke highly of Marc.He may have the best material there is out there
Dosn't mean your head likes it.If you would get more on bandstand back up,learn it ,and the guitar melodys will drop in your lap.The melody is the easiest in most cases to play.iT's also th e part we can hum.So inside of you ,you know it already.
Band stand material is so important. When I show a new guy (happy birthday).They realize they can't find all the notes unless they get into pocket chords.Remember when I said one day use the D lever
as a Maj7th,and then part of a scale.
I would offer free one on one's,but I am In texas,
I have two D 10's and a new Jackson single neck.
Southwest flys in to Midlin Odessa. It is 171 miles
from me.I will pick you up free,and return free,
Stay as many days as you want ,but you have to help with the dishes.

Yes,you should be pickin lead in any key.It's something in you that's stopping the progress.
You have plenty of talent around you up there.
Hey Buddy. don't forget what my eyes see.8th fret C.A lot of those notes come from the five chord.A and B open ,then closed .

Charles, some very good advice here about breaking any lick into smaller segments and learning to play in and out of the segments in every possible way. For instance, take just 4 or 5 notes of a scale, and mess around with those notes in various combinations over many chord progressions to see how they fit, and lead, from one chord to another.
This leads eventually to the almost "microscopic" concept of looking at how each note relates to every chord in a song or progression. Good players use this leading tone concept to nail a progression with just a few notes. It takes a lot of concentration at first, but becomes easier with time.

For one example: instead of switching to a "D" lick or position when the D chord shows up in the key of G, try playing a G note moving down a half step to F#. You can use the bar, or a pedal like the lever lowering the 4th or 8th string at the third fret. In theory, you would be moving from the root of the I chord to the 3rd of the V chord, and it's a very good "sound" solidly following the chord change.

Basically, whenever you're flying around a G scale, you can use this little move when the D chord comes around (or I to V in any other key of course), and perhaps find some more "V" chord licks and ideas that tie in with that little move. The idea is to keep looking for scalar/chord connections like this, and adding them one at a time into your bag. You will start to hear these little moves in some of the stylisitc playing of your favortie players, and find some of your own pockets.

Whenever I get musically repetetive or lost, I can always find something new by looking "smaller" at a fragment of a lick or melody, and finding new ways to mangle it.

Great Discussion.

The only advice I have is this:

Look through Jamie Aebersold's collection of books and very professional tracks. Some people get turned off because it is "Jazz". I love it because it all "connects." It is logical.

I will recommend vol 84, "V7" Dominant Seventh Workout.
There is more in there than I really want to know. Don't let the theory get in the way of your playing. I use the pages and tracks that help me.

aebersold.com

The tracks are pro all the way. The piano is on one side of the stereo, the bass is on the other.
So one can pan in/out what they want. Percussion is excellent. (this ain't no midi deal)

You will see about 116 volumes. I am sure others will catch your eye.