The Steel Guitar Forum

This thread is interesting....
Makes me think: Besides Sneaky Pete, is there any other steel players that sometimes sounded like lead guitar players that anyone can think of?

Ralph Mooney.

Lou Martin,Marlo Roberts,Al Bruno all could play Steel licks on Guitar. LJ

Billy Carr wrote:Not trying to burst anyones bubble here but in my opinion only, I don't want a guitar player pickin' with me that's constantly playing steel licks, trying to sound like a PSG. If there's not a steel in the band then it's fine but it rubs me the wrong way when they constantly do it. I don't try to play lead guitar on steel and don't want someone standing next to me playing steel licks on guitar. That's about as aggravating as someone playing on top of a lead instrument when there taking a break on something. Been there, had that done, don't like it.

Billy, I can understand how you feel about that. I'm mostly a lead player (and a beginner at steel), but if I played lead in a band that had a steel player, I wouldn't be doing steel licks on a guitar...that's what a steeler is there for. I have too much respect for steel guitar playing to be treading all over it. If I played steel in a band, it would annoy me too.

What about Glenn Frey from the Eagles- Tequila Sunrise sounds darn good!

I'm finding the possessiveness sort of funny.

Steel players who don't like a guitar player in the band playing steel licks seem to be pretty common.

How do you think two guitar players get along? I'll use Duane Allman and Dickie Betts as examples - they played with similarities, but a lot of differences; and they were able to develop some wonderful harmonies.

Most bands with two guitar players on an equal skill level use it to their *advantage* - find ways for play counterpoint parts, mimic each other's licks, dive into spontaneous harmonies.

What would happen with two STEEL players playing together?

(better listen to Suite Steel and the Sneaky/Buddy duets before answering)

While I don't care for b-bender used as "faux steel" I can see many possible ways to do it WELL that are relatively untapped. But it's almost like steelers are threatened of 6-stringers invading their territory (which is kind of how this thread got started, although I'll repeat - MOST long-time b-bender players play it as a completely different instrument and AVOID faux steel...)

...although I will admit to pulling of a steel lick and slow multiple string bend with vibrato the end of a song just to (in good fun) annoy the steel player and "steal his thunder".

The funny thing is, most 6-stringers I know, if they hear a steel player play guitar-like licks smile and say "cool!"...

And so I wonder - is it that steelers just don't LIKE the guitar being used to play steel licks because it clashes; or do they think it's simply that guitarists are incompetent at playing "faux steel"; or is more of a dog marking his territory?

scott murray wrote:

Jim Sliff wrote: And again, like Dave, I hear no tonal change, have read Burton talking about playing it (yes, it IS more than one take spliced together but not unplayable - splicing together pieces of different solo takes is very common) and haven't heard anything about Al taking claim for it. If Al says it's him I wouldn't doubt him, but I don't hear it - and if it's steel playing, it doesn't sound like *Al's* steel playing of that era.

it's funny that you guys don't know a pedal steel when you hear one. Yes, the solo is "guitar-esque" with a lot of single notes, but there are also a few bends that are clearly done with pedals... not to mention hammer-ons with the bar.

There is no change in tone because that's Al's playing through the entire song starting at 12 seconds in.

James plays the intro and everything else in a higher register.

When I complimented Al on this break he was surprised that I knew it was him, so I guess it's a common mistake people make assuming it was Burton. It's possible that James was taking credit for the Emmylou version. But it is most certainly Al on the Gram Parsons album.

I agree...I have studied James Burton's style for years, and I certainly don't think that James is doing that steel solo. Anyone who wants to hear James Burton soloing on 'Ooh Las Vegas' should listen to Emmylou Harris's version from 'Elite Hotel'. That's how James played the solo!

Well, I'll fold if Al says it was him; his memory is like a steel trap! What's bizarre to me about that, though, is that the single-string playing (the guitar-like stuff) was never part of Al's repertoire with the Burritos or Mannassas - he played more normal steel-sounding stuff, even when covering Sneaky's material, and used a much dirtier, warm tone (when he switched from the Fender to the ZB you can barely tell the difference except in some of the quicker passages, as ke kept the same "edgy, on the verge of breakup" tone going. "Las Vegas" is clean as a whistle.

So if Al says it's Al - it's A...but it doesn't SOUND like Al to me. It's out of character both style and tonewise. I guess intentionally so.

Hey, I'm all up for getting corrected when mistaken. If I recall the Grievous Angel album had credits listed for each song and steel was not listed on Ooh Las Vegas. These listings of course are not always completely accurate as sometimes parts are added after the script has been completed or just omitted for whatever reason. As stated earlier, I think we all agree that it's hot stuff.

Jim,It is Al he used the same run that starts on the low string in another song..Maybe a live Mike Nesmith record from Australia?Stu

Russ,

You gotta a YouTube copy of Waddy playing Rider In The Rain?

YouTube just now says it's been 86'd. Won't show it.

I'm very familiar with the song, but would like to see Waddy actually playing it.

Thanks...

Chipper

Reviving an old thread here but I haven't been on here in a long time so I've been doing alot of reading.

On Dwight Yoakam's Live in Austin DVD, Pete Anderson plays a slide on "Always Late" and I thought it was a steel until I seen him playing it.

In reference to the earlier mentions of 'Ooh, Las Vegas' - see page two - (I assume it's the Emmylou Harris version in question): I'm certain that it was Hank DeVito on that recording and not Al Perkins.

I apologise if this has been corrected in the interceding pages.

Gerry Hogan and I had an enjoyable twenty minutes chatting with James Burton and Hank during a mid-1970s sound-check at London's Hammersmith Odeon; it hadn't been long since they'd recorded 'Amarillo' together. It took very little prompting on our part to get James and Hank to demonstrate their guitar/steel parts to us.

Then James allowed me to noodle around a bit on his famous paisley Telecaster. It was nice moment or two for me, and I added another iconic guitar to my 'collection' (previous triumphs had been Duane Eddy's Gretsch 6120 and Lonnie Donegan's 000-28 )

Nothing to add re: the B-bender discussion - it's an art-form all its own, and I seriously doubt that it was ever intended for pedal-steel duplication. Not in the minds of good players, anyway.

Don't forget that you can put a Telecaster with Dusenberg string benders across your knees and play it with a tone bar. Then you really can get pedal steel sounds. Your main drawback is that it's difficult to use more than three levers, and so you don't have the versatility that you have on PSG with as many pedals and knee levers as you can handle.

If I am playing guitar with a steel in the band I don't usually put in any "stell like" sounds if I can help it. I usually will not bring my bender to the gig either. I think it makes the band sound much better, makes the steel player stand out better, and makes the guitar stand out better, if we don't try to copy each other. Now, if there is no steel then I will use whatever skills I have to put in fills and so forth, "steel like" or not. Does it sound like a steel guitar???...of course not, but it fills the tune up, and helps provide some variation from the same sound of the same guitar all night. I use piano riffs too, but never heard of a pianny player gettin' "too" upset...

What I like is pedal steel players who sound like pedal steel players.