The Steel Guitar Forum

This subject interests me a lot. I play bass, and have a strong timing and sense of groove. I´ve played with some very good and some rather bad drummers over the years, in various styles of music.

As beginners, most of us struggle with timing issues. But some musicians are never able to grasp the concept, and wont hear timing. With some personalities there is an attitude problem too - "dont tell me what to do".

On bass, I can straighten out the timing of a less than good drummer. It requires solid timing, the right phrasing and volume (yes). Force him to follow. It works a bit, and when the ladies in the audience starts moving you know that the groove is there. But it will never sound great, and his timing is still bad.

With a great drummer, everything works withour effort. I can put the note anywhere in the pocket to adjust the feel, and it will work. He has timing, and listens to the whole band. Its not about how many notes he can play. It is a fantastic feeling when the whole band is grooving, unlike anything in the world for me.

On the pedal steel however, our ability to help is limited.

Fredrik is so correct. I've played with some really bad bass players and they can make my job as a drummer incredible difficult. I've also played with incredible bass players, that have made me a better drummer. It's so hard to describe the relationship between a bass player and a drummer. It sometimes feels like a marriage.

Check out the phone app “Tempi” it reports the current tempo and charts the variance graphically in real time. Immediate feedback on how consistent the tempo is without actually being a metronome. They call it a reverse metronome in the description.

A little late to this particular party but I wanted to say:

Herb, right on with your comments. I'm sharing with the band.

We had some big grooves back in the day, but I recall some times when the rhythm section exhibited what you're warning about.

David Sawyer wrote:A little late to this particular party but I wanted to say:

Herb, right on with your comments. I'm sharing with the band.

We had some big grooves back in the day, but I recall some times when the rhythm section exhibited what you're warning about.

Hmm, that’s weird. I thought this looked familiar. Is posting the same message twice in one thread a thing now?

I would guess that was likely a technical issue, possibly a refresh on the "Post a reply" page or something similar and not a purposeful posting of the same message, responding to Herb, again, when Herb's reply is back on page 2.

Only the poster will know for sure I suppose.

I have a friend who was a drummer before he took over the family studio. His sense of timing is uncanny, he would say something like: " That was a good track but you sped up from 110 beats per minute to 115 at the end. Can you do it again, same feel but just hold back at the end?" He hated the way a click track added a mechanical feel and always tried to talk people out of using one.

My opinion is that when a drummer is off to the races the last thing they'll ever think about is how the over all band sounds to the audience and it's usually futile to try to talk sense to them. Grooves are nice and it's great to play with people who are aware of the overall sound , have a good internal clock, and are aware of the importance of visual communication on stage but being a pro is being good at making the best of a bad situation. I'm not saying don't try but save it for after the set and be civil.

The worst thing you can do is make an on-stage problem visually apparent to the audience. It ain't a mistake if it don't look like a mistake. When you flub a note or forget a lyric or detest one of the band members, don't telegraph that to the people who paid to see you.

Out of nowhere - what about the drummer who asks us all to turn up our volume because he can't hear us because he has to wear earplugs because he plays so loud?

Look for something called a beat bug. It goes on the snare and displays the tempo as the drummer hits the drumhead. They can see in realtime if they’re keeping tempo or not. Also I found this, which is similar only using an app.