The Steel Guitar Forum

i disagree..those zums are a breeze to change around. pin positions can be changed easily enough with ingenuity.

I'll bite. Absent a drill press and clamps, how do you put a new hole in the rods with any accuracy?
The MSA requires no ingenuity, just 2 Allen wrenches.
My Zum has resisted my attempts at tinkering. But 'tis a joy to play the top side. And Bruce is only 90 miles away if she needs the underside seen to.

chris ivey wrote:i disagree..those zums are a breeze to change around. pin positions can be changed easily enough with ingenuity.

I agree. The only slight difficulty is accessing the bell crank tightening screw which is too horizontal.

What do you do when a rod is too long for the new job you ask of it?

Lane Gray wrote:I'll bite. Absent a drill press and clamps, how do you put a new hole in the rods with any accuracy?
The MSA requires no ingenuity, just 2 Allen wrenches.
My Zum has resisted my attempts at tinkering. But 'tis a joy to play the top side. And Bruce is only 90 miles away if she needs the underside seen to.

Making pull rods for a Zum is tough for any model. First, the threads are rolled (not die cut) so they actually have a larger diameter than the original rod stock. To drill a hole for the roll pin, I flatten the end, punch a mark and drill on a drill press

To answer your question, I always shorten a rod at the belll crank end, as I have no access to a thead rolling machine.

Lacking a drill press (and having no other use for one), I just choose to play the top side. It seems easier. I'll experiment on the MSA, and if I find a change I want on the Zum, I'll either look for a neighbor with a drill press or have Bruce do it.
I love that Zum feel and sound

Tony Glassman wrote: First, the threads are rolled (not die cut) so they actually have a larger diameter than the original rod stock.

I've never seen the undercarriage of a Zum so forgive my basic questions.
1. So, are these rolled threads "knuckle" threads as found on the base of light bulbs? Do you know why Bruce chose that type of thread?
2. Are the bell cranks clevises? That is, is the pull rod in the center of the clevis and held in by the roll pin that goes across the clevis?

Thanks,
Joe

Correct on the clevis, sorta. If clevises can be open-ended slots. The bellcrank actually has about 5 clevises for timing and leverage control, and the roll pin rides in them. (I had to look up clevis, as I've never needed that bit of knowledge before). The bellcranks resemble a pair of coarse tooth combs standing up from the shafts.

EDIT: Here's a forum listing showing the bellcranks: http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=201121

As to the threads, my brain rebels at comparing lightbulbs to a 5/40 thread. Sorry, I can provide no useful feedback

Thanks Lane.

I don't know how much it really matters, but I like the pulls to connect to the bellcrank on both sides symmetrically such as with a locking collar. I don't like pull rods that have an el bent in the end that pull on one side of the bellcrank.

Bruce's roller pin is clever because it makes for a symmetrical pull and, being thin, has less friction than a bent rod.

I believe later model Zums use a bent rod thru a hole in the bellcrank with a hairpin clip.
Jerry

Jerry is correct as usual.

I have a 2004 model Zum and they look like this as Jerry said

The later Zum which uses the "hairpin" clip is an ingenious idea. It has a straight across notch that accepts the clip instead of a hole. Much easier to make and to install the clip and works great.
Jerry

The later Zum which uses the "hairpin" clip is an ingenious idea. It has a straight across notch that accepts the clip instead of a hole. Much easier to make and to install the clip and works great.
Jerry

Hei Guys

It's Promat the S-10 I own. Great guitar with beautiful tone and long sustain.
For me it is the best and a brad I prefer. For now I have had a chance to play three different PROMATS and all were great,... I wish you would too,...

http://www.promat-steel-guitars.com/home

Stay in tune,
Blaz Patty

Jerry Roller wrote:The later Zum which uses the "hairpin" clip is an ingenious idea. It has a straight across notch that accepts the clip instead of a hole. Much easier to make and to install the clip and works great. Jerry

Jerry, I have mixed feeling about the new Zum undercarriage

Pro:
- vertical tightening screws are easier to access
- hitch-pinned pull-rods easier to mfg
- can use one bellcrank to pull changes (2) on adjacent strings

Con:
- have to remove pins to move pull-rods between leverage slots (harder)
- hitch pins can fly off into orbit and get lost
- adjacent rod-ends or pins can rub
- sometimes need to loosen and move bell-cranks laterally to remove rod ends

All told, I like the old system better, but regardless, all Zums are world-class instruments.

Tony, the ingenuity that I am referring to is in the ease of building the guitar or making the pull rods. A straight across slot on the end of the rod instead of having to turn groove completely around the rod. I really do like the design of the older bellcranks, same principal as the Franklin. I would like to buy the right Zum with 8 + 9.
Jerry

Jerry Roller wrote:Tony, the ingenuity that I am referring to is in the ease of building the guitar or making the pull rods. A straight across slot on the end of the rod instead of having to turn groove completely around the rod. I really do like the design of the older bellcranks, same principal as the Franklin. I would like to buy the right Zum with 8 + 9.
Jerry

Jerry, sent you a pm

I love you Black G F I
You make me cry
Lets have a party
Proceed to party

WHY?
becuase it is
~lightweight
~sounds great
~Looks cool

Should be getting shipped soon!

My Zum Hybrid is the best thing since, or before, sliced bread and I am quite partial to my Beard MA6 as well -- doing a sound check on a recent concert tour!

A brad I prefer,...



http://www.promat-steel-guitars.com

Are you in tune?

Paddy, that Zum is a thang a' beaty

RAINS. Why? this one does everything i expect out of a guitar, tone, sustain, stays in tune, great pedal action, has the growl etc. I played an emmons PP for 24 yrs amd wish i still had it because of what it is but i would play either one and smile

Thanks Quentin - yes it is a pretty special guitar, and my older standard Zum is pretty damn good too hehe !

I'm gettin to be pretty fond of my Mullen Pre-RP...First Mullen i've ever owned.It feels great,tone is amazing,looks like it will be pretty good as far as maintenance goes...
i'm one of those "one-steel only"players,due to finances & this is it !!! I saw it in the Forum classifieds & missed out on it.my wife told me,"sorry honey,but be patient,you'll find something just as nice"...a couple of months later,here she is !!!There is however a really special Marlen out there somewhere that i owned back in the 70s that still has a place in my heart.