The Steel Guitar Forum

Fred Justice put me on to the Hilton last year at the Texas Show.
This by far has been THE BEST INVESTMENT in all of my gear.
Tremendous tone improvement and best of all NO MORE POTS TO BUY and a ^$@&%*@# string to wrap and rewrap !
See you at the TSGA Show.
Rodney

Rodney I'll be there again in a week with a truck load of them wonderful maintanace free Hilton Pedals.

If there is anyone in the market for one at the show stop by and I'll fix you up with one, see you all soon.

Dekley Low Boy or a Fulawka.

I am happy with my old narley lookin' Shobud pedal. I've had great luck ferreting out AB pots.

Hey Calvin, I can't believe your too "DERNED" lazy to spend a few minutes and change out a pot! Whats this world coming to!!

Calvin,

I like the SOUND of the pot pedal far better than any electronic pedal I've heard. If the new Dunlop pots outlast the OLD Allen Bradley pots (very likely), I will get over 10 years of the sound I like best. And who's to say that in 10 years the Hilton pedal will not blow a power supply, take a power surge hit or have a component or other failure. And the pot pedals dont fail catastrophically. After many years of great service with a quality pot, they give you plenty of warning that it's time to replace the pot. It seems to me that Goodrich is giving pot pedals a bad name nowadays by supplying pedals with inferior pots.

Greg

Greg

you make a good point, thats why i keep an old cheap pot pedal around . just in case something does happen to the Hilton i can still play while the Hilton is being repaired then its right back to the Hilton asap....say what you will, i can not tell any differance in tone, if anything the Hilton sounds better
you can be the best player on earth and you will never convince me there is 2 cents worth of differance in the sound
the only thing is every pot pedal i have ever had started to get scratchy, the Hilton never will

For my 2 cents I love my old string & pot sho-bud, I'm still waiting for the string to break , 8 yrs on this one ! But I hate a noisy scratchy pot, & replacing them is a chore. thanks

Greg said:

It seems to me that Goodrich is giving pot pedals a bad name nowadays by supplying pedals with inferior pots.

I'm amazed that Goodrich hasn't jumped on this already. Granted, they could have an investment in inferior pots that they may feel have to be used up, but, I think they are taking a hit on sales because of it.

I also think the Dunlop pot will be the cure for the "bad pot-itis" syndrome.

I think that the Dunlop pot is one of the best things that has happened in the steel market for ages. I am really pleased with the ones I have bought, and it also means that my Fender vol/tone and 2 Sho-Bud pedals are not redundant. Roger Rettig's post about the tonal affect was very telling, and I have heard this point of view from others. Also, having to carry the extra mains transformer around would be an inconvenience for me. As far as I am concerned, the less trip hazards on stage the better.

I like to keep it simple, so I use either my Emmons or Sho~Bud pot pedal. Being an electronic technician by trade, I look at active pedals as having way more potential things to go wrong than the pot pedals. Electronic components do fail. Must admit to being frustrated by pots going scratchy though. The Dunlop replacement pots sound promising, I'll be trying one out sooner or later...Jerry

Thanks to everyone using my pedal. I am always here to help those using my pedal. I think it is wonderful people have a choice in what they want to use. My advise is to stick with the equipment that sounds best to your ears. I am always humbled when I look at the many great players using my pedal. From my sales records I see the majority of the big shows in Branson, and Nashville use my pedal. From my sales records I see the majority of the Steel Guitar Hall of members use my pedals. From my sales records I see the many guitar builders who sell my pedals with the guitars they build. Of all the pedals mentioned, mine is the only one that has a United States Patent. This means it is different than all the others. I think playing steel guitar should be fun, something you enjoy. Way too many musicians take everything to seriously. When I play the steel guitar, I am going to have fun. Don't worryabout what other players are using. Use the pedal that sounds good to you. Be happy!

i have never heard of an "electronic" pedal going out, but i sure have heard of pot pedals getting scratchy and unuseable during a gig. But i have an old goodrich curly chalker electronic volume pedal that sounds as good as any pedal electronic or other wise. It's still working today like it did the day i got it from Phil Goodrich. I bought a new LDR2 from frenchy, it sounds no better, i have also used a hilton pedal, i found no improvements that would warrant me to go out and buy one. I have an old goodrich "Steelman" volume pedal that is older then most guys taking this poll...still works like the day i got it.JMHO

I agree with Ken. I don't need another wire to trip on when I'm on stage. I'll take a Goddrich 120 with a Dunlop pot. The Hilton is a great pedal though.

Uhh, I know the intent was not to polarize folks and have them choose up sides when this thread was opened.

Seems to me the question should be: “What volume pedal do you like the best and WHY”??

There are a lot of good reasons that were expressed here for using Hilton, Goodrich, Shobud, Pots vs. Electronics…etc…..We all have to choose our own poison, eh?

Here are some reasons why I like the Hilton pedal that I haven’t heard expressed in this topic.

I had a Goodrich 120 pedal. I think Goodrich is a fine company with great standards. Still, I was searching for more Sustain. After some research, I found it in the electronic Hilton Digital Sustain unit that attaches to the leg of your steel. I instantly fell in love with the sound, clarity, tone and the sustain!!!…..Truly a happy steel experience for me.

But, I still had the scratchy Pot noise issue to deal with. I changed the 500K pot more than 3 times….a very disappointing experience indeed.

Back to research….and I find I may be able to deal with both issues in one unit…..Yep, the Hilton Electronic Pedal.

Now, I’m no electronic expert, but as I understand it, this is what it does.

The analog guitar signal is digitized in the pedal processor. The Hilton then transmits a very clear signal for each string played (clarity). Further, the signal is boosted or strengthened electrically to your Effects unit or into your Amp. Note: This is not a delay or reverb effect unit. It just truly puts out a genuine and naturally clear sustain output from your guitar. It rings and rings true.

There is more power from your Steel, so much so, with experimenting, I cut down on the Amp volume and Presence controls a bit. Now, I have less throw of the pedal itself, as I choose. I have sustain to kill for and the clarity for what my sound is on an Emmons and a Fender Stringmaster, all in one unit. I do use an RV3 and use very little delay and reverb.

But wait, it doesn’t stop there. IMPORTANT: There is a tone control (highs, lows), a Master Volume control (if you want to back off the out power) and a Back Off Stop control (totally off or a little with the up pedal position) on the bottom of the Hilton Pedal.

No, I’m not on the road, but I have never had home or gig problem with it, ever! I TRUST IT!!

I’m sure Goodrich and others have a competitive pedal out there. And that’s good for competition and it’s good for all of us. Yes, the Hilton Pedal is a bit expensive; but you do get what you paid for……

Or, I could go back to my pinky riding the guitar volume control. Nah!!

Uhh, if I could only play better, but I do sound good, bad…. practice, practice, practice…. TX
Rgds,
Ron

The analog guitar signal is digitized in the pedal processor

Are you SURE about that ?

Hi Baz,

There is a small chip set processor in the Hilton Pedal. The signal out of 99% of all guitars (unless one has an on-board processor) is analog. The Hilton processor digitizes the guitars signal and enhances it, ie: each string signal for clarity & separation, with the power the pedal has, you then get improved sustain with this enhanced signal. It's my understanding the signal is converted back to analog (enhanced), then finally goes into your Amp which is an analog device.

It's much like a CD player. The digitized source signal is sent to the speakers in an analog state.

Unless, Mr. Hilton responds first, I will check the specs and explanation (unavailabe to me at this writing) that the Pedal came with and get back with a correction if I miss-spoke here. TX

Warmest Rgds,

Ron

As the owner/user of Goodrich, Bigsby, and Sho-Bud passive pedals and the Hilton active pedal, I can say that there is a sound difference between active and passive that is obvious to me. The Hilton does provide more string separation and low-end clarity than any pot pedal I've used (that's about all of them). I also really like the adjustability factor, and their ultra-smooth feel.

That said, I still use the pot pedals (mainly the Sho-Bud), usually in conjunction with a buffer preamp, when I want a more vintage vibe in both sound and looks. There's also something about the Sho-Bud's feel that I really like - maybe it's the pivot point. The Bigsby volume/tone pedal is quite a work of art and works great to boot, but heaven help you when it's time to change the pots (especially the tone pot...).

I do prefer the Hilton for road gigs with "modern" artists and for recording "contemporary" tracks. In short, I guess I'd say there is no one "best" volume pedal (just like there's no "best" guitar), it's all in what fits the bill.

Ron, thanks, the reason I asked was that I was under the impression that the op amp was an

advance pre-amp incorporated in the electronics

I took this to be an analogue device, I wasn't aware that they incorporated A/D and D/A converters.
I think that their digital sustain unit does.

Actually both the Hilton volume pedal and the Hilton "Digital Sustain" box are both completely analog, using very high quality audio opamps. There is no conversion to or from digital whatsoever. As I understand it, the active circuitry in both the volume pedal and the sustain unit are nearly identical. Of course the sustain unit doesn't contain the same volume control section. The chips in the Hilton units are NOT "processors" as you'd find in digital devices. They are analog devices used for audio amplification, buffering, and/or volume control.

Brad

I have two Hilton pedals. They sound great and they've never turned on me. Thanks once again, KH. haven't tried the Goodrich LDR but I might in Texas, because those Goodrich boys are good fellows.

Hi Brad, Baz,

I took the liberty to submit the quote below from the Hilton website in re: our Digital vs. Analog discussion.

What does it do? As the name implies, it digitally sustains the signal from your guitar pick-up. It allows the windings of your pick-up to reach a dynamic range never before thought possible. Frequency response is increased to dynamic levels, throughout the entire spectrum. Bandwidth performance is enhanced, and widened, to extended levels. Experienced listeners, and audio experts, in controlled tests, all reached the same conclusion, "It's Revolutionary!" It provides the "EDGE" you need to cut through with quality sound. As it cleans up your sound, the high, low, and midrange dynamics are enhanced. Single notes sound fuller, bigger and better. As you play chords you can better hear individual note seperation. Our technology comes from 1997 IC chips that are specially laser trimmed for dynamic circuit performace.

Apologies are in order if I interpreted or misstated the above quote incorrectly. As a common layman, I yield to those that know far more than I in certain technical subjects like this. I promise to stay out of this arena in the future.

After absorbing the quote above, my pea brain assumed the guitar signal is in analog form, then digitized and on to the Amp. etc. etc

Frankly, I am still not sure of how the technical process works here.

Brad, your probably right in your explanation. Thank you for your clarification and helping out.

As for me, I am a 200% satisfied customer after purchasing both Hilton Electronic devices. However it produces the sound, Analog,Digital,Vibrations,Laser,Infrared or Smoke Signals, I am deeply impressed with the Hilton Pedal. TX

Rgds,

Ron

The last time the pot went bad in my L120, I thought about buying a Hilton. After shopping around, I somehow got the impression that Hilton pedals have an arrangement with the dealers that forbids them to offer them at discount prices. As I tried to convince myself that I should go ahead and anti up for a new tech pedal, something about that dealer thing just didn't set right with me. So I simply bought another pot and done the string thing one more time. Maybe someday stuff like that won't bother me so much.

I believe everyone that sells them IS selling them for a discounted price compared to normal "list" price margins on similar products. Heaven forbid any dealer actually make a small profit to stay in business.

If anyone would like to view my patent, here is the patent number 6859541 Do a Google patent search on that number. Someone may want to post a link to the actual patent, where we can see pictures. Actually, I am just a dumb hillbilly from the Ozark Mountains. I am a half bread Native American. Actually 1/16 Cherokee Indian. My relatives were forced to Indian Country during the forced "Trail of Tears" Indian removal. I suppose you could say I am educated beyond my intelligence. After graduating with a degree in mathematics from the university, I went to work for a company called North American Avation, in Long Beach California. This was in 1965, and they had the contract to build a thing called the "Lunar Landing Module". I worked on the "Lunar Landing Module" that went to the moon in 1969. Maybe some of you are to young to remember the first time people went to the moon. I did all my electronic inventing before I had any electronics training. I finally went back to college and completed 4 years of electronics training. I am currently working on inventions for the music industry with miro controllers, and digital ICs. Especially control with digital potentiometers controlled by micro controllers.

This page tells it all Click here

Keith can you confirm that the steel guitar AUDIO signal is or isn't converted to digital via A/D converters and back again.
Baz

BTW thanks for the logo sticker for my pedals.