The Steel Guitar Forum

<SMALL>Does anyone know who is suing Mr. Seymour? </SMALL>

It's Maurice Anderson, and I think he has a legitimate grievance. Anybody who read Bobbe's forum will recall that Reece and MSA were constantly belittled and insulted, as were such players as Donny Hinson, Tommy White and Johnny cox because they bought Milleniums.

It's one thing to say "I don't like (whatever) brand guitars," but what happened over there was a sustained continuous series of attacks on Reece and everybody who is associated with him. Even Curly Chalker was dissed because he played an MSA at one time.

It reached the poiint where it became a joke that that every post had to say something nasty about Reece even if the subject had nothing to do with him.

It's too bad things have come to this, but I really feel Bobbe should not have allowd his forum to deteriorate into the "I hate Reece and MSA" cesspool it had become.

I suspect that this is the eruption of a volcano that's been smoldering for years. Maybe decades.

I hope Reece and Bobbe can work things out. As has been pointed out, both men are great players and valuable resources to our community. This unfortinate situation can only have negative consequences for all of us.

please....please close this before it goes any further

It is highly unlikely that Bobbe's statements actually constitute libel. To be libel, his statements would have to be:

1) false statements of fact that

2) he knew to be false and that

3) caused material harm to the plaintiff.

Note that statements that appear to be statments of fact to you and me may be considered expression of opinion under law depending on the context in which they were made.

HOWEVER, THIS IS NOT ABOUT LIBEL -- it's about using the court system to shut up a dissenting voice. Punitive lawsuits are brought by financially advantaged parties who know that the defendent is unlikely to spend the money required to represent himself in court. The cost of bringing the lawsuit is trivial, the cost of defending oneself against the charges is large. How many of you could afford to spend that kind of money just to defend your name?

This technique has already been used effectively to silence one voice in our community. It's now being used again. The really funny part is that I believe that Bobbe, more than anybody, is in a position to know the truth in this matter. Of course, the truth is not what is at stake here.

Mike Perlowin- Perfectly stated! I own a new MSA and those statements Bobby made were unfounded as he did not own one or play one.
State his opinion once, okay. But over and over, give me a break, I can read between the lines !<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Richard Gonzales on 02 January 2004 at 09:04 AM.]</p></FONT>

I didn't receive the email. I see a lot of assumptions in this topic, though. People who don't know the facts of the case should refrain from conjecture. It only muddies the already murky waters.

------------------
<img align=left src="http://b0b.com/Officeb0b.gif" border="0"><small>               Bobby Lee</small>
-b0b-   <small> quasar@b0b.com </small>

 System Administrator

I have no idea of the circumstances surrounding this lawsuit and apparently, almost nobody else seems to either and I can't see the purpose in foresnically examing past threads to find out. Airing idle conjecture in a public forum like this can only have a negative impact on our community. I hope both parties can come to an agreement but it really does not need to be a public process. I vote for closing this one, b0b.

Didn't Bobbe close his forum last month for this very reason? If that's why, I think that stands as a testiment to his character.

Bobbe has always been a good friend to me, and he has always had good things to say about others.

Chris

Well, before the Lock comes down I have to say that I am of the opinion that this as well as Bobbes "old" forum is not a Manufacturers, Songwriters, Salesman's Repairman's, or Big Shots Forum. it's a "Steel Player's Forum".

In all the Posts here, I think Bobbe, as well as Mr's E, Franklin, and most non HOF members have NOT forgotten this ( to their great credit). For the most part.

It's for the guys that come home with blood blisters from their fingerpicks, need to know how to get beer stains off their horns, play with hacks, OR top namers, have problems that their "regular" friends can't solve, and a thousand other things that only fellow Steel Players know. Maybe from people with physical or even mental problems needing advice, support, or just needing "somewhere to fit in".

Bobbe's was maybe "more that way" to include "the crazies", like the way some of those "notable crazies" that have passed on might have been. It was also open to people in his shop or office sometimes being able to "post things in his name". I think the intelligent among us who know how "these things work" passed most of it off. Most of the "attacks" I saw were from the "hyper sensitive" that were "totally clueless" of the aforementioned.

ALSO, In ALL of my correspondence with Bobbe, he's not EVER castigated or besmirched ANYBODY. Kind of interesting. Even when I pointedly asked him, he just said "Oh it'll work out". We usually talk about harleys, girls or I'll give somebody I want to meet him and introduction. Maybe even a funny story or two.

I don't remember anybody "attacking" anybody for playing any brand of guitar. Not that they weren't welcome to rebutt said "attack". I saw plenty of Mr's Hinson, and the others mentioned's posts "there" and didn't see any of them unable to defend themselves. I didn't even know Donny played an MSA.. Hmm....


I don't like Emmonses, Sierras, OR the brand in question. I'm not even so hip on my Sho Bud at particular times. I have been able to expess my opinions, and with no more "care and reflection" than I've seen from The Respondent. Nobody's even done more than emailed me, or directly responded. Maybe it's the way I put it. Maybe I just don't have "deep enough pockets". I dunno.

I've been told my guitar wasn't fit to burn here. I've been told I was racially and culturally insensitive, I've been told I played too many notes. I've had all kinds of "attacks" happen that could indeed keep me from making my next quarter million bucks. I choose to defend them myself. I think I've been able to do so adequately.

At this point, like a DOZEN others in my "career" I'm completely and utterly "finished" with no future hope of jobs, or money coming in from playing.

Whose fault is it? Who's going to "get it going"? Oh, I know a couple lawyers that probably could, but more than likely I'll do like I always do and connect with The Guy in the Mirror. Maybe like times before, we'll ask God. Don't count me out. I never do.

( Actually, while I was "editing" this the phone rang, and I'm pencilled in for all of January AND February. Thanks God.)

If anybody needs an "author" to defend themselves in this, my track record stands as my testament, and I'll gladly "take their side" in providing a rebuttal for them. Pro Bono, as they say. (Whether I agree with them or not.)( It's a hobby of mine as listed on my profile.)

Don't just spew off a bunch of mis-spelled gobbeldy gook, and try and defend somebody or something that piques your sensitivities.. Among common folks you'll just lose. Send me an outline, and I'll type something up for you. If you choose to "go it on your own", your results may dismay you. I've done this "a lot".

I hope this comes out alright.

I'm still betting on the Steel Players to win out. We know the Lawyers will be a close second..

b0b, is it my imagination or is your hairline receding....further?

So this is the "New Year".

Seems very much like the Old One..



EJL<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Eric West on 02 January 2004 at 01:25 PM.]</p></FONT>

Are you being paid by the word, Eric?

Eric, take your Ridelyn maaaaan! Your tripp'n!

NOTHING like reading the "Saturday Evening Post".
It gets Gooder and Gooder......
What a Gas.
I'm just thinking....
Just HOW MANY are really sitting back behind their Computers EVERY DAY reading this stuff?!...
I noticed that Too, Eric. (The Line thing)
Eric, Have you ever thought of being an author of a "Best seller"? I think you just might make another Quarter Million or so....

b0b. You keep asking me that. I'm wondering if I could somehow, and do it without giving you a percentage..

Like I've said before, just cause I 'rite it don't mean that I read it. I'd hesitate to myself...

Kevin. Sometimes I wake up in "caffiene starvation" and it has an opposite effect.

So it was today....



EJL

I am watching this thread as it escalates into what very well may be resolved without anyone getting hurt which I hope will be the case. I appreciate both parties invloved and would like to see this resolved..which leads me to...

When CBS took the Fender Company over back in 1965. Leo Fender had nothing in writing to prevent him from returning to his favorite
past time,and that was building guitars and amps.

I assume CBS was unaware that Leo would in fact return sometime a few years later to form a new company with an obscure name of MusicMan.

At that time I was still a Fender salesman and when the word got out that Leo was in fact backing this new small company MusicMan
the first thing CBS did was to have the name
"Leo" copyrighted to prevent Leo Fender from naming one or more of his instruments "The
Leo" model.

Leo didnt have anything of the sort in mind and that was told to me by the horses mouth.
Once again the word "Sue" came into Focus,CBS scrambled for the rights to the name Leo. They already owned his last name,and now wanted his first name as well.

What a suprise to CBS when Leo had his attorneys write CBS NY and LA that he had nothing of the sort in mind.

Leo Fender was bored sitting home and wanted to return to the people and business he loved so dearly.

He many times told me how much he missed being back in the business. Unfortunatly due
to internal dis agreements Leo Fender decided to move on to G&L..No law suit followed. CBS was afraid of the shadow that
Leo cast on the world and for what???? nothing.

The motto of this story is if any of you want to name your new born son Leo..you will have to get the approval of CBS Headquarters.

If your sibling is a female..check out to make certain that CBS dont have the name "Leona" copyrighted as well.

Happy New Year and I hate Law suits. The two people involved in this scenario should shake hands and go on with their lives.

Life is short and the Lawyers pockets are deep. Those invloved should kiss and makeup PS what CBS didnt know is that
Leo had a middle name edited for spelling.


------------------
Copyright(c) 2004 by
Jody Carver "All Rights
Reserved"


<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Jody Carver on 02 January 2004 at 04:00 PM.]</p></FONT>

I think everyone needs to re-read Mike Perlowin's statement about saying something bad...and saying something BAD.

Have you noticed Mike doesn't post very often, but when he does he has something to say. Spells alright to.

My Daddy always said, keep your words soft and sweet because you never know when you might have to eat em.

Don't close this though b0b...we want to be keep up to date.

Bob<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Bob Carlson on 02 January 2004 at 04:09 PM.]</p></FONT>

Well my friend Stephan "Red Eye" O'Brien and I had a tremendous set-to once before over this type action. I think we remained and I hope we will remain friends after this one. But this is not about Steve and I, it's about several things other than friendship. Quoting Steve in his post: "---highly unlikely that Bobbe's statements actually constitute libel." The term "highly unlikely" must mean that maybe Steve, along with others don't know what statements were made or are being contested. I just read Bobbe's Tips and I could find no where where it said Bobbe was being sued for "Libel". An assumption maybe or a conversation possibly.

Steve goes on about the "Implied Bradshaw dissenting voice being shut up"..There's a website posting at the end of this message which if you take the time to read, will probably shed more light on that affair than you really want to know. It's all legal, been checked out by a lawyer and you'll be made aware of the "real truth" for the first time, that I've read on any public media. Other than an expressed opinion of mine, the words are those of the two litigants themselves.

Why Bobbe's forum was shut down? I guess only Bobbe knows, but there were several things said on that forum that could lead one to believe it was important. I'm not a lawyer so who knows.

Now, to this lawsuit. I have been a personal friend of the Anderson family for over 40 years, and I ain't gonna' stand by with my mouth shut on this one. I did on the Bradshaw affair and I'm really sorry I did. I called Reece this AM and asked him if he was the litigant in the Seymour lawsuit, and he said "I sure am, Fred, I'm one of the litigants and it's a matter of public record in a Dallas court." Period. There it is. You don't believe that, you email and ask him if it's so or not. When asked who the other litigants were his answer was, "It's a public record like I said and if folks really want to know they can check it out, but I certainly am one of them." Gonna' be expensive? Probably so on the loser, and like in most lawsuits there will be a loser.

I'm asking that if you want to flame, then flame me through email. I won't dignify short sightedness on b0b's Forum, I have too much respect for it and those who read it.

Forget the website. MSN won't allow you access unless you do the .Net number...Just email me at fjshannon@cox.net and I'll send it to you...It's now 6:55 PM CST and I'm giggin' tonite, but I'll answer all emails when I come in.


Fred

------------------
The spirit be with you!
If it aint got a steel, it aint real

<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Fred Shannon on 02 January 2004 at 04:20 PM.]</p></FONT><FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Fred Shannon on 02 January 2004 at 04:45 PM.]</p></FONT>

Bob

Do you include me in that group of people who
keep it
soft and sweet?

I hope so.

I did my best. Better be nice to me or I'll make my stories "longer"

Someone here has a very short memory.


Wayne

Oops, just saw your edit.<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Jim Smith on 02 January 2004 at 04:24 PM.]</p></FONT>

Yes Jody, i,d say you keep your words soft and sweet enough.

Always like to read your posts.

Bob

I went thru the song & dance & signed up to read the document. Out of respect of b0b's forum, I say no more. I do hope for an immediate resolution.
I will say that my scroll bar sure got a workout. Whew.

For what it's worth, I'll close this topic if Bobbe or another principal in the lawsuit asks me to. I'm afraid that if I do it for any other reason, I'll be accused of taking sides (as I have been in the past).

Also, please be aware that I am not at my computer 24/7. Any requests for action will have to wait until I am online.

------------------
<img align=left src="http://b0b.com/Officeb0b.gif" border="0"><small>               Bobby Lee</small>
-b0b-   <small> quasar@b0b.com </small>

 System Administrator

OK, I'M one of the big reasons Bobbe shut down his forum. Had nothing to do with MSA, although the lawsuit WAS being talked about. I think moderator Joey Ace has aleady told us, how he warned Bobbe about the potential horrors of an uncensored forum. And we saw exactly what happened. The Dover character, whom I've been told by another well-known member of THIS Forum doesn't even exist, posted obscene, profane, and inflammatory comments about everything from MSA guitars to my wife. So I, (along with several others, I'm sure) suggested that Bobbe shut his Forum down. The fact that he did just that, tells me a lot about Bobbe's character. Now, postings on an open forum may not fall under free speech, but it does fall under free SPACE. Unlike THIS Forum, which requires that each member give a full name, and provide a password, Bobbe's was an E-Z Board forum, where anybody could pretend to be anyone, and say anything. And that obviously caused a mess. Could Bobbe have prevented it? I don't know. But he DID take steps, albeit too late, to eliminate the garbage. For this, he should be commemorated, not sued.
I do not know Maurice Anderson, but I know he's a fine steel player. I know Bobbe Seymour, and he's an excellent player as well. I think anybody who's familiar with this type litigation realizes that, NOBODY'S gonna get a million bucks, or close to it. As several of you have said, it's just gonna widen the gap further.
And, as a sideline, it's interesting that we've not heard from Mssrs. Anderson and Seymour. Guess they've got better things to do.<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by Stephen Gambrell on 02 January 2004 at 09:02 PM.]</p></FONT>

bOb

Can you have deputy Joey Ace watch the ranch while yer gone? He has the locks,many are bigger and stronger than your'n.

Sue City Sue

<SMALL>I think we should start a donation for Bobbe to help pay Atty fees.</SMALL>

Time for a reality check...

Lets See Here....From Bobbe's Website, Memories section.

A Collection of 22 Cobra Racing Cars
A Racing Boat
A Couple of Airplanes
A Rolls Royce

Best for everyone just to stay out of this one and let it run its course.

There will be No further comments from me.<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by John Floyd on 02 January 2004 at 07:31 PM.]</p></FONT>

possibly the judge may want to hear an MSA next to an Emmons....case dismissed