Courage to change to Mozilla

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 11 Nov 2004 6:54 pm

.[This message was edited by Jim Phelps on 17 November 2004 at 07:38 PM.]

Mark Ardito · Post by **Mark Ardito** » 12 Nov 2004 10:40 am

Here are the stats on a clients website that I maintain:

MSIE 6.x 9521 99%
Netscape 7.x 121 1%
Opera 7.x 3 0%
Firefox 3 0%
Netscape 4.7 1 0%
MSIE 5.x 1 0%
Safari 1.x 1 0%

This was for the entire site for the month of October.

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Sho~Bud Pro I, Fender D-8 (C6&E13) http://www.darkmagneto.com
http://www.arditotech.com

Jeff Agnew · Post by **Jeff Agnew** » 13 Nov 2004 11:21 am

Mark, that's really a surprise. Those figures are very atypical. I've never, ever seen anything approaching IE6 penetration like that except in an intranet. For the last several months most surveys show IE6 usage declining.

But it's really a moot point because browser stats are notoriously unreliable. There's just no statistically significant way to measure them. There are some interesting sites on the subject, including those here and here.

Target audience, survey methodologies, sample size, and other factors can drastically alter browser stats. Also, don't forget that many alternative browsers can spoof the user agent string for compatibility reasons. In fact, that's a standard feature in Opera, and it's set to "IE, Windows" by default.

Without question, IE has the largest browser penetration but that's due to Microsoft's near monopoly in the OS market more than anything.

Mark Ardito · Post by **Mark Ardito** » 13 Nov 2004 3:17 pm

Jeff,

For some reason this client of mine ALWAYS has that high IE hit ratio every month! Other clients of mine have a much higher Netscape and "other" ratio.

I downloaded the 1.0 release of FireFox and have been using it at home. I really enjoy it. I have read several articles about that kid who is 19 that is one of the head programmers for Firefox. He was an intern at Netscape when he was 14 and now he is a sophomore at Standford University and also running the show for Firefox. Not bad for only 19! HA

Cheers!
Mark

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Sho~Bud Pro I, Fender D-8 (C6&E13) http://www.darkmagneto.com
http://www.arditotech.com

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 13 Nov 2004 3:40 pm

.[This message was edited by Jim Phelps on 17 November 2004 at 07:38 PM.]

Tommy Mc · Post by **Tommy Mc** » 19 Nov 2004 7:12 pm

So I downloaded Firefox a couple of days ago. It feels comfortable...not a big difference in GUI from IE6. It blocks pop-ups that Google and Popup Stopper were letting by. The only issue I have is that is takes about twice as long as IE6 to load a page. The graphics seem to take forever to load. Some sites also don't look the same, but it is the slow speed that bothers me. Everybody talks about how fast Firefox is, but this is not my experience. Anybody else had this happen?

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 19 Nov 2004 7:54 pm

Yep, Firefix is slow here too, especially on graphics as you mention. I've blamed it on the combination of the advanced pop-up blocker and the IE firwall, but I really don't know if that's the reason.

As for the sides that don't show properly, there is a plugin on the Mozilla site called "View in IE" that enables you to open the page in IE directly from the site. I have to use it on some sites, but it's not often.

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

Mike Baxter · Post by **Mike Baxter** » 26 Nov 2004 10:56 am

I found that Thunderbird:
1) eliminated all the flags on my OE emails
2) showed the most recent 104 messages of the 1115 total messages in my Sent folder as dated Feb 06, 2001
3) I could not drag the sent emails into my Maximizer database program

I've (reluctantly) switched back to OE. Still keeping Firefox though.[This message was edited by Mike Baxter on 26 November 2004 at 10:57 AM.]

Wiz Feinberg · Post by **Wiz Feinberg** » 26 Nov 2004 11:53 am

I am a Webmaster/developer and have to test all of my work in alternate browsers. I chose Mozilla-based browsers as my alternate, two years ago, while keeping IE 6 SP1 as my main browser.

I was content to continue patching IE and using it as my master browser until recently, when I read about an extremely critical, as yet UNPATCHED IFrame vulnerability in IE, posted on Securia. Despite the fact that MS knows about the IFrame Vulnerability there is no patch or fix for Windows 2000, or XP with SP1. Their only solution was to upgrade to XP with SP2.

I am a contented Windows 2000 user, with all current service packs, hotfixes and patches installed. I use very restrictive security settings in IE, yet I am vulnerable to the current Internet Explorer IFRAME Buffer Overflow Vulnerability. This alert was release to the public on Nov 2, 2004, and is still unpatched! Read about it here: http://secunia.com/advisories/12959/

What I am getting to is that this was the straw that broke the camel's back. Since I have been using and updating Firefox as a test tool, I decided to make the switch offical two weeks ago. Firefox 1.x gracefully imported all of my Cookies and Bookmarks (Favorites), and is now my primary browser. I still use IE for certain websites that I know are safe to view, but it is basically relegated to secondary status, and for testing website layouts.

Warning!
Windows users must have Internet Explorer installed and functioning to obtain Windows Updates, and ActiveX must be on for the Windows Update site to scan for updates. Users who turn off all ActiveX controls will need to manually locate and download patches (http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/sear ... laylang=en), service packs and hotfixes, since the update scanner won't work in the browser, or in Firefox. I am not yet sure if the Windows Automatic Update function requires ActiveX, and will Post when I know the answer. If it doesn't use ActiveX it is the best solution to staying up-to-date without using IE.

Enuf for now.

Wiz[This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 26 November 2004 at 11:56 AM.][This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 26 November 2004 at 12:32 PM.]

Chuck Miller · Post by **Chuck Miller** » 27 Nov 2004 1:46 pm

Been using Firefox and Thunderbird for quite a while now. Running Debian Linux.

Roger Kelly · Post by **Roger Kelly** » 28 Nov 2004 7:21 am

I have just started using Firefox and Thunderbird. So far everything works great. No problems making the change at all.

Jon Light · Post by **Jon Light** » 28 Nov 2004 7:27 am

I downloaded Thunderbird to add to the Firefox I've been running but it failed to import my saved folders---I file & save just about ALL of my correspondences going back some 5 years--and after mucking around trying to get this thing happening (and failing probably due to my own shortcomings) I too have reluctantly opted to continue with OE6 for email.

Jeff Agnew · Post by **Jeff Agnew** » 28 Nov 2004 8:36 am

Wiz,

I feel your pain. Two things come to mind - First, you can disable ActiveX for everything else and still leave it functional for the MS updates. Add the URIs to the Trusted Sites zone, where you can enable signed controls. Although I still set mine to "Prompt". The following should work for Win2K, depending on the specific patch and load balancing. If not, you get the idea:
http://V4.windowsupdate.microsoft.com
https://V4.windowsupdate.microsoft.com http://windowsupdate.microsoft.com http://download.windowsupdate.microsoft.com

Second, the IFRAME exploit can be negated by using Proxomitron or a similar proxy app. I have a Proxo rule set to display all IFRAMEs and ILAYERs as a text link. If I trust it, I can click the link to display content. If not - no harm, no foul.

I can send you the Proxo code if you're interested. UBB code just choked trying to display it.
[This message was edited by Jeff Agnew on 28 November 2004 at 08:38 AM.]

Wiz Feinberg · Post by **Wiz Feinberg** » 30 Nov 2004 6:22 pm

Jeff;
Thanks for the input about adding MS Updates to the Trusted Zone. I already did that, plus I had to add Symantec LiveUpdate to that zone, to allow some program updates to "take" (like the WMI Update to NAV 2004).

Did you surround your codes with a set of [ code ] ... [ /code ] tags?

Wiz[This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 30 November 2004 at 06:25 PM.]

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 30 Nov 2004 6:38 pm

I downloaded Thunderbird to add to the Firefox I've been running but it failed to import my saved folders

Jon, this is possible, but you can't import them the usual way. I did this when I changed from OE to Thunderbird, but I can't remember exactly where I found the saved email folders. You'll have to go to "Documents and settings", then "Program Data", and find the OE folder with your saved emails there, then copy the folders (drag and drop) to the "Profile" folder in Thunderbird. It takes quite some time, especially if you have many huge attachements, but it worked for me..

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

Jeff Agnew · Post by **Jeff Agnew** » 1 Dec 2004 5:34 am

Wiz,

Yep, the CODE tags didn't like all the RegExp formatting. No biggie. If you're using Proxomitron and want the filter code let me know and I'll just send it via e-mail.

I highly recommend Proxomitron, BTW. I wouldn't surf a PC box without it, but it's not for the casual user. Bit of a learning curve.

Jon Light · Post by **Jon Light** » 1 Dec 2004 12:26 pm

Steinar---thanks. Looks like if I can find a day with nothing better to do (haven't seen too many of those lately) I've got my work cut out for me.

Wiz Feinberg · Post by **Wiz Feinberg** » 1 Dec 2004 4:04 pm

Today, exactly one month from the original public release of the IFrame Buffer Overflow Vunerability, on Securia, Microsoft has finally released a patch it. See the bulletin here: http://www.microsoft.com/technet/security/bulletin/ms04-040.mspx

This is the vulnerability that caused me to switch to using Firefox as my primary browser.

I applaud the patch, since I still use IE for comparing layout displays, and for obtaining Windows Updates, but am staying with Firefox, for the time being.

Wiz[This message was edited by Wiz Feinberg on 01 December 2004 at 04:06 PM.]

Glenn Womack · Post by **Glenn Womack** » 15 Dec 2004 10:44 pm

I recently downloaded Firefoc, but I forgot how to make it the default browser. When I am not actively browsing like working offline and hit a link, say to WEbshots, IE opens it. How do I make Firefox the default browser? Getting kinda old and my memory ain't what it should be.

Glenn

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 16 Dec 2004 2:24 am

In Firefox, go to "Tools", choose "Options", then "General". On that page there should be something about Firefox as default browser.

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com