The Steel Guitar Forum

When Don came and played as our special guest in 2007 at the Marshfield Steel Guitar Show, I carried in his steel and we talked about it.

Here's what I recall from our conversation and that guitar he loved. His double 8 Gibson was real heavy. As b0b stated he used a Stevens steel bar. I was amazed at that because I had used one as a kid on my lap 6 string Fender. He said that's what I use.

Next, he b0b's right again. Don told me and showed me his B11th tuning. I tried it and though it made beautiful chords, I was lost on it. You might be surprised but Don told me that he used that tuning on Patsy Cline's "I Go Out Walkin' After Midnight." I know he used the other E6th tuning on most recordings.

Don played on 104 recordings with Hank Williams and if my memory serves me correct on 64 number one songs with Hank, Patsy Cline and others. He recorded "Long Black Veil" with Lefty Frizell, Patsy's first number one "Walkin' After Midnight," 4 songs with Jim Reeves, one was "Roly Poly," also Sonewall Jackson's "Waterloo" and with about everyone else in Nashville.

He also worked with about everyone in Nashville from the 1940's through the 1970s. Hank Sr., Hank Jr., Wilburn Brothers, Loretta Lynn, Ernest Tubb, on and on.

Don Helms was a Great Guy and Hazel his wife was the sweetest nicest person you'd ever want to meet! He was my friend, an early mentor, and I miss him alot!

Terry Wood

I may be wrong, but I seam to remember seeing somewhere that Don used an E13. On that tuning, he used a D instead of a C# on string 7.

Joseph Barcus wrote:you have that right Bob but I got it pretty darn close will have send you a link sometime. oh I dont use any pedals only now and then a slant is required Don didnt do many slants. now the old supro it has a tone pretty close to that time but with David have to use the pedal steel because he goes back and fourths from hank stuff to modern e9th material

Joe, I thought about doing something of the sort - did you just sharp strings 1 (G#?),3,5,7 ? It's funny how some people have added pedals to non pedal guitars and others have removed or not needed pedals that are there

well on mine its the second string thats the G# and yes I did raise that a half. I would use the bar but the strings are to close to stay in tune. I would really love to just use a non pedal but David also plays modern stuff so I have just set my double neck to use both worlds. I only have 8 strings on the back neck. keep the pick up selector in the middle to pull the ohms down to about 8500 not what the gibson had but pretty close

If you have stage space, an S8 non pedal and a S-10 PSG??

im lazy too much to tote lol

I was in the middle of changing my post. I think your way is better from a space saving standpoint, and you don't have to mess with A-B switching, etc. But those old Gibson consoles have a sweet sound! Wonder if Gibsom made an S8 version??

I dont know about the Gibson question maybe someone will chime in huh. yeah most of the time dont have time in between songs to do the switch and I have seen the times I have broke a 3rd string and go back to the back neck and make up something till the set changes

I do not know much about Gibson steels, but I think the late 40's Ultratone was essentially a single neck Console Grande, and so was the Century -- and the Century came with 7, 8 or even ten strings.

I'm using E6 to try and play some of the the music Don played with Hank, and found the Mel Bay book useful. On 'I'm so Lonesome I Could Cry' however the tabs in the book are played higher than what I'm hearing being play on the recording Hank made, and that lovely chord Don plays on the solo (about 1:10 into the song), how is he doing that one? Any tabs for it? thanks

can you make a sample of it so we can take a listen. I also believe on the original recording that was Jerry Byrd

b0b wrote:FWIW, that B13th is actually B11th. The 13th tone in B is G#, and there's no G# in that tuning. B11th is a really good tuning. Jerry Byrd used it sometimes. I'm not sure who invented it.

BoB - According to Alan Akaka, the B11 tuning arose in Hawaii, played a lot by Jules Ah See and Barney Isaacs back in the 50's. "Sand", "Mapuana", "How'd Ya Do" and other tunes are usually done in the B11 tuning by Hawaiian steelers. - Jack

Joseph Barcus wrote:can you make a sample of it so we can take a listen. I also believe on the original recording that was Jerry Byrd

Joseph your'e correct, it was Jerry Byrd playing steel on this one not Don. The song is in E. The chord Jerry slides down into is about 1:12-1:13 into this clip:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4WXYjm74WFI

Well I made a video of the break on the back E6th neck and also on the front E9th neck. I am almost sure and hope someone will set me in line here but I would say If jerry was in C6th then one of his lower strings would had most likely been a C for I am missing a location on the back neck for one part but can get it on the front neck with the E sting but what the heck take listen if you like
http://youtu.be/r4KvRRfqWns

Matthew,

Joe is correct. The original recording was in E and Jerry Byrd played at the 4th fret on C6th, sliding back to the 2nd fret to get the E7th chord that you're asking about. The only way to get that exact phrasing on E6th in that key is to play it an octave higher at the 12th and 10th frets, as Don does in his book.

Jerry Byrd also had some nice bars slants that Don doesn't cover in his arrangement. If you have another guitar in C6th, JB's parts are well worth the time spent working them out. His signature licks will stay with you for life.

b0b

I think Don played 3, 4, and 5 (C#, B, and G# strings) together on the second note of "Walkin After Midnight" (7th fret).

You may be right, Dean, but for the most part he seems to have meticulously avoided playing the B and C# strings together. I scoured his book looking for examples and found none.

I just bought the DON HELMS STEEL GUITAR SONGBOOK and was about to re-string one of the necks on my StringMaster to his tuning when I had an epiphany (you guys probably already realize this I'm sure, but it was a light bulb moment for me).

Since Don rarely used the 7th and 8th strings, I can play all Don's stuff on my C6 neck (Low to hi A C E G A C E G) by moving the tab up 4 frets and down one string.

For example, the intro to YOUR CHEATIN' HEART

Don's tuning

G# --16--16--16--15------12---13---------------
E ------------------15------12---13---7--8-------
C# --16--16--16---------------------------------
B --------------------------------------7--8-------
G# ------------------------------------7--8-------
E ------------------------------------------------
C# -----------------------------------------------
A ------------------------------------------------

C6 Tuning

G ---------------------------------------------
E --20--20--20--19--------16---17---------------
C ----------------19--------16---17---11--12-------
A --20--20--20---------------------------------
G --------------------------------------11--12-------
E --------------------------------------11--12-------
C ------------------------------------------------
A -----------------------------------------------

I played a Hank William tribute show with a 6-string tuned to D6. This gave me all of the Don Helms and Jerry Byrd parts with timbres that sounded reasonably authentic. D F# A B D F#

As luck would have it, the singer did "I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry" in F.

On pedal steel C6th, the inside two pedals P7 and P8 make an A11 chord - same intervals as the B11. Coincidence? I don't think so!

I haven't found Jerry using c6 on any Hank tunes. As far as I can tell it's all c# minor. Listen to end of his solo on Rootie Tootie he plays one sting at a time. I get hi to lo e c# g# e c# b Try this on Honky Tonkin The high stuff strings 3&4 and 2&3 23 fret slide to 24. The chord on I'm so lonesome is on the 12 fret down to the tenth This is also very similar to what Murphy used for his chord solos

E6 ?

I guess the b makes it e6

or C#m7

Don Helms and his wife, Hazel, were special friends to me and my wife. We had the opportunity to visit in their home several times, and Don and I played our steels together each time we visited. Our Gibson Console Grandes were identical in all respects. Don's tunings were those shown on Steve Green's posting above. Don did use slants on occasion, but not regularly. The first 3 videos below show Don making a video with Mark David, and you will see a couple of slants.

The 4th video shows pictures taken with Don during some of my visits.

Don Helms and Mark David Setup
Don Helms and Mark David Thinking for Now Sessions
Don Helms with Mark David Thinking for Now
Don Helms-Memories of my visits with Don

C. E. Jackson

I'd like to mention that while Don said he "never" used bar slants, he did OCCASSIONALLY use them. He would forward slant on his second and third strings and besides being able to clearly hear it on the records, I saw it many times with my own eyes.