The Steel Guitar Forum

I agree with both Jerry and John...it is imperative that all band members use the same tuner or tuner reference..tuning fork, pitch pipe,or whatever...I have had two Peteyrson tuners and would not rely on anything but my tuner to keep my steel in as close to perfect pitch as possible..you see our ears get tired, have off days and are not as consistant as we would like to believe..or have others believe...some of us have too much pride and refuse to use an electronic device...those people will continue to play slightly off pitch. Most experienced musicians realize that there are certain notes that their natural ear cannot accurately tune..for example..I hear 5's and 2's about 3 cents flat (NNS). I said all that to say this: My peterson strobe tuner Always hears and reflects perfect exact (tempered) readings regardless of how much stage noise is happening, or how perfect my natural ear may be that day. I rely on it for the cosistancy.

i really only need my tuner in a live/on stage situation
otherwise, i learned how to tune by harmonics & set them in my tuner
Es to 440 w: a & b down, then let them go & i'm off

CrowBear Schmitt wrote:i really only need my tuner in a live/on stage situation
otherwise, i learned how to tune by harmonics & set them in my tuner
Es to 440 w: a & b down, then let them go & i'm off

I was in a steel shop the other day and we were discussing tuning, I told the owner I tune my E's to 440 with A+B down, then everything else pretty much straight up 440. He said I need to start using the Newman tuning or else I would sound bad if I ever got on a stage with other instruments.
If that's the case, why doesn't it sound bad to me when I play along with my CD's?

basically the Es, Bs, As & F#s are tuned to 440 or 442
the rest are tuned via harmonics & will differ from 440/442

I perfer my Boss TU-12-BUT love,love, love,any good tuner.What a GREAT invention. You young guys would'nt know about this,The first pro band I played in around 56 0r 57 was a large western swing band,Two guitars,upright piano,doghouse bass,Fender triple neck steel,fiddle,tenor sax,alto sax,trumpet, we all tried to tune to that old piano by ear,the steel player would come in an hour early and try to get all three necks on that thing in tune. We played OUT OF TUNE all the time. I don't care WHO you are unless you are one of the rare ones with perfect pitch,your ear is NOT as good as a tuner.The most important piece of equipment in any pac-a-seat.YOU BETCHA.DYK?BC.

...i don't need that, too! when i got my guitar the seller told me, it was tuned up right!

Have a peterson but, rarely use it.

I believe in tuners but if you can't tune by ear how do you know when you are out of tune.

I wonder if the equivalent thread on the Telecaster forum is about setting the intonation on your three saddle bridge...

I perfer my Boss TU-12-BUT love,love, love,any good tuner.What a GREAT invention. You young guys would'nt know about this,The first pro band I played in around 56 0r 57 was a large western swing band,Two guitars,upright piano,doghouse bass,Fender triple neck steel,fiddle,tenor sax,alto sax,trumpet, we all tried to tune to that old piano by ear,the steel player would come in an hour early and try to get all three necks on that thing in tune. We played OUT OF TUNE all the time. I don't care WHO you are unless you are one of the rare ones with perfect pitch,your ear is NOT as good as a tuner.The most important piece of equipment in any pac-a-seat.YOU BETCHA.DYK?BC.

For this use it's great!
But don't think that you will learn to tune better when you use such a great device.
As I learned in the 30+ years that I play steel:
Each pedalsteel,even same modell, same brand, has it's own imperfections you have to deal with. And someone who uses a great programmed "tuningchard" from someone else's guitar can make the mistake not listening to his own ears.
Besides that, anything is said in this thread.
JJ

I don't need to buy a Peterson Tuner, because I have the Peterson iStroboSoft app on my iPhone and it works great.

Cliff Kane wrote:

Dennis Wallis wrote:Tuning fork is what you eat tuna with .

You can tune a geetar but you can't tune a fish.

Wrong. They can be tuned to the key of sea.

What you said Johan ! Tuning has been an issue that has been debated for as long as i can remember and i suppose it will be this way from now on . I have heard most of the newest tuners on the market today and everyone has ''the best '' . Go figure !

I rely on my ears too. All a tuner does is tell you that individual strings are tuned to proper pitch. It does not tell you if the strings are in tune with each other.

Ian S. said;
"I wonder if the equivalent thread on the Telecaster forum is about setting the intonation on your three saddle bridge."
Lotsa guys are using these saddles. I have them on the "Billy Goat," and they're quite accurate!

You guys still using tuners you have to plug in? That's so 2000...

Six reasons why I don't need a Peterson tuner:

1. I am willing to futz around tuning my $2000/$4000 pedal steel guitar using a $20 tuner for an hour before the gig without success, while our guitar and bass player laugh at me from the bar (not that they know any better )

2. I'm extremely fussy about my guitar's sound, and spend $$$ on different pickups, but how precisely my guitar is tuned has absolutely no bearing on my guitar's sound.

3. I know exactly how my guitar was constructed, even who built it, and spend $$$ on improvements, but how precisely my guitar is tuned has absolutely no bearing on my guitar's sound.

4. I ignore the fact that Peterson has built the only tuner with specific features for pedal steel guitar, but instead, I buy a tuner with no such features.

5. I disregard tuners competely, knowing that my ears can do better, even though my ears are completely useless when confronted by ambient noise at a gig.

6. I look around and see no other tuner manufacturer besides Peterson supporting steel guitar in the world today, then I go ahead and buy a tuner from a company with no interest in, or knowledge whatsoever of, steel guitar. I'm a genius !

Just sayin'

John N.

don't beat around the bush John...tell us how you really feel!

John,

I hear you.
How about programmability for the iPhone version ? I`d pay more for the option...

Thanks,

Of course, John's opinions aren't biased in any way.

John,
As you may remember, I have been using my Peterson VS1 since 2002 and I am as pleased with it now as ever. I became a believer in the value of accuracy to within one-tenth of a one cent. To my knowledge, only Peterson and the old Conn strobutuners have that degree of accuracy. When an individual really understands how to use the tuner properly and understands the various pluses and minuses of the more common tuning compromises and tempers, it is possible to develop tuning modifications for any INDIVIDUAL steel with a player's personal copedant. Cabinet drop can be determined for each steel and adjustments made. A bad string is often easily detected by looking at the strobe pattern. String gages may be tweaked to eliminate slight discrepancies between octave strings when played up the neck.

One very useful capability of the old analog versions of the Peterson and Conn stroboscopes is that they could actually show an accurate picture of a string's overtones, at least the first few. This allows you to visually tune beatless. For example: tune your E9 4th string E. On the old strobes you have to dial in the name of the note you are tuning, those tuners cannot find your note for you. As long as you are within half a fret, this is not a problem in the least. Once you have the E string in tune, change the note name to G# and pick the E string. The strobe will show a rotating display, probably indicating a slightly flat tone. That is the G# overtone of the E string. Next, adjust the CALIBRATION dial of the STROBE to stop the rotation of the display, do not retune the E string. Most likely, you will have to dial about 13 cents flat to stop the rotation of the dots and the picture will not be as sharp as with the E fundamental tone. Once you stop the dots on the display, you can read the value on the Calibration dial and see how flat to tune the G# string to sound beatless with the E. Remember this amount, as it will stay constant as long as you keep the guitar set up the same way. Changing string guages or copedants may require minor tweaking. With a little extra attention to what happens to the E tone when tune the pedal down, this same procedure can be used to check all the common chord voicings. While it is impossible to completely eliminate beats everywhere, a player can inelligently chose which way to go based on his or her musical situation.

And now, John, a suggestion for an upgrade to your wonderful products: Add a procedure by which you can defeat auto note-recognition function and allow user selection of the note and the ability to see specific overtones as with the analog versions. It would be the best of both worlds.

Johan, I have been tuning with Conns and Peterson stobe tuners for over 35 years and I can honestly say that once I really understood how to use the tool, my ears probably received the best training I could give them. When I started, I had very pedestrian ears and very little confidence in them. I still have pedestrian ears and pedestrian tastes, but I have confidence now in my ability to hear small tuning discrepancies as I never before could.
Not everyone hears with the same ears and no steel player makes a habit out of purposely playing out of tune. I have found that most times I upgrade my gear with a new amp, guitar, or tuner I have to make slight adjustments in my playing or my tempering. I used to tune as beatless as I could in the three common major chord shapes and even went so far as to have F# compensators installed on two steels. I tended to play lines up and down the fingerboard, sounding pretty, but casting a slightly dark shade noticable on recordings due to the disonance between my thirds and the guitar and keyboard thirds. My playing style has changed over time and now, scalar leads across the strings have lead me to split the differences between beatless tempers and equal tempers a little more. It actually has simplified my tuning slightly but mainly I sound a little more in tune with the guitar and a little pitchier when playing lines involving things like moving sixths.

Johan, I do understand where you are coming from, but with all due respect, I am assuming you don't play with loud bands. I read an article in the early 80's about a brand new Musician's Earplug from a company called Westone Laboratories. I immediately bought a pair as soon as they were available and have used them ever since. Do I wear them for every gig? No, I don't....it depends on the volume. Why did I buy them? Because as a young man I played music with guys in their 60's who had lost a MAJOR portion of their hearing.....playing on amplifiers that were not nearly as powerful as those being developed for my generation.

I later read another article about hearing. The article stated that if you come off of the bandstand at the end of the night with ringing in your ears, the damage has already been done. I came off of a concert stage one night (with a major Nashville Recording Artist) and my ears were ringing like never before...and I WAS wearing the earplugs that night!! Now, if you have an explanation as to how I can tune on stage by ear (which I do prefer) at a volume level just described, I am all ears...

The fact of the matter is this. At that loud of a volume level, I don't fully trust my ears. I DO trust my Peterson Stoborack, which I personally feel is the absolute best tuner a musician can buy. It has features that in my opinion put it above the Stroboflip (which I also own). More expensive? Yes, but like everyone knows, you get what you pay for. Do I tune by a tuning chart? No, I don't. I personally feel every guitar has its own individual quirks. But my Stoborack has my personally programmed temperament locked in. It was programmed with me listening with headphones on, making sure the temperament was tweaked as tight as I felt it could possibly get, then locked into the Stroborack whereby my ears don't have to compete with a loud jukebox or loud guitar player standing next to me. I pull up MY temperament that MY ears decided was in tune......AND I don't have to second guess as to whether or not my ears are "on" that particular night. If I wasn't playing with such loud bands, I am sure my opinion would be more like yours.

I do use my ears to play in pitch and also to tune, but there are times when even the best of ears fall short....

...oh, and by the way, I am 51 years old and it was only 1 year ago that it was determined that I started having a minor amount of hearing loss....I have friends younger than me who haven't been so lucky with their ears.....


Joe Rogers

I can tune my stringed instruments just fine with my $20 tuner. Once my guitar is acclimated to the room's temperature, I "futz around" for just a few minutes, tweaking the tuning, if need be.

The money saved goes to keeping fresh strings on my guitars. No matter what tuner one uses, it can be difficult to tune old strings.

If you tune "Str'at Up" why would you have to have an expensive tuner like a Peterson?
As for the numbers there are a whole lot more folks using a tuner other than a Peterson and I haven't heard the folks with the Peterson sounding more intune.
Come to think of it I've heard a whole lot of guys with a $3000 Carter and a lot less expensive tuner sounding every bit as good as any of the more expensive guitars and/or Peterson.
Come to think of it I know a few guys that sound in tune and really good on a Stage One with a $20 tuner altogether coming in at around a $1000.

Somebody tell my electronic keyboard player to use one...thats who I have to play with. Lots of luck