The Steel Guitar Forum

How can any one on any show now days talk to the aduience or each other when running all over the stage like their clothes were full of fire ants?
As a dear departed steel player friend of mine Jimmy Yates whom my son used to drum for years ago said,you used to either pick it or pack it.
This is in no way meant to sound like an ego trip but i was born with perfect pitch ear.Back when i was just a kid i saw most of the opry people on stage in Wichita falls,Tx.including Hank Williams and they all sang on key and the intrustments were in tune together.
I was learning fiddle then and had never heard the term perfect pitch ear yet.I I worked the road all over the U.S. and over seas for GOO artists.And that was before the electronic tuners came out.We just tuned to each other or first the up right 88 piano if there was one on stage IMHO too many would be players are.
fustrated and do not realize every one doesn't have the ear to be a pro musician.Oopps.They don't have to now.If you doubt that watch a little of whats on tv now,if you can stand it.LOl
Repeating my self,when the tuners came out the Korg company had a great article trying to explain it was not to tune to,But to quickley retune to a tuning you had decided upon your own was an in tune sound but seems it went over most players head. Supposed to tune one string to the tuner usually A 440 as that was the accepeted concert pitch and the rest by ear and write down what you came up with to retune to.Tracy

BGrado..

I don't know about Joe Nichols on the Opry but his steel player is terrific. Who is he?.

I agree B and on the last thread when I made mention of the PSG in live performances being out of tune I was by no means referring to this Player whoever he was. As for Joe it sounded OK to me.
Bill Cutright...

Tho, Craig Morgan was almost in tune, I can't bear to watch all his facial contortions..

.. Let’s don’t beat around the bush he was terrible and a tone deaf person would have noticed, but if you judged by the pans of the audience you would have thought his performance was the best on the Opry that day.
Hey BobbeSeymour love your knowledgeable insightful replies on this matter. I thought I’d suck up a little here and maybe you’d give me killer deal on new Steel.

I'd rather listen to the ET Jamboree at midnight on Saturdays than the GOO. Most of the time they'll have some decent singers and usually a good steelman. I just wish they would keep the rock & rollers trying to be country off of it, as well as, bluegrass. Guess I'm still 100% PSG and Classic Country!

Dave Diehl wrote: Kenny Chesney is the worst singer I've ever heard and I have never heard him sing live "on key". I don't know how he continues to get the reviews and awards he does. Guess it goes back to the Studio being able to cover up a lot.

I agree, in sentiment. In 2000, I had to hear him ten, or more times.
I was in Buffalo, NY, when he got thrown in jail for being a horse thief. (Too bad they can't hang em' anymore.)
I was with Jerry Kilgore at the time, and he did get up with us to sing at least once that I remember.

I could never see what the big deal was with him.
(his popularity)

But in all fairness, he isn't actually the worst I've heard.
My vote goes elsewhere for that one. How can I say this nicely?
His name starts with a J, and ends with "ohn Michael Montgomery".
We did a show featuring him at a military base somewhere in Wa., or Oregon.
People were running for the exits.

All this talk about monitors and not being able to hear......

Reminds me of when I went to the GOO in 1969. I sat in the balconey looking at stage right. There was a snare drum and a fellow with a stick and a brush, an upright bass player, Spider on guitar and maybe Jimmy Capps was there also, an old upright piano with a fellow playing it, and some others like a fiddle etc. There was ONE speaker in sight and that was an old Ampeg cabinet that was hanging down from the ceiling pointed back at the musicians. Everyone who came on to play an electric guitar reached down and plugged into some device on the floor in front. If you looked up to the right there was a window there and you could see an engineer in there mixing for live broadcast.

When they hit the first note I was dumbfounded. I was only a freshmen in college and was with my school band playing a football game against Vandy. I talked my buddies into not going to a porno movie and we got the last three Friday night Opry tickets. The sound was absolutely spectacular!!!! Billy Grammer and Doug Kershaw and Granpa Jones and many others. I felt like I was sitting right on the stage with them and the sound was like putting your ears into a record and becoming part of it. The volume was so modest that everything they did sounded so meaningful and beautiful. I learned that night that country music is not about massive sound pressure levels, but about communication. A simple song, a simple sound system, and folks in the audience who were simple people with a love for the music that made them like fine winetasters.

Everything was in tune, all the vocals were gorgeous, the electric guitar that Spider played which was a Gibson made Epiphone Sheraton Natural finish and sounding better than any guitar I have ever heard then or now....that is all gone in place of what they have now. What they have now is surely not bad, but it does not have much of the reality and class of the original Opry. It was nice remembering this.

Hi, I'm Dean Holman. I'm the steel player for Joe Nichols. I used to play for Ricky Skaggs in the mid-90's. The first time I played the Opry, I felt like I was the only one up there. As one of the other posters said, the Opry is pretty much plug and play as well as it is for the singers. Joe uses ear monitors as well as his back ground vocals do. I regularly use them, but not on the Opry. You're always at the mercy of the monitor engineer who does the best that he can. Sometimes things happen during a live show that is unforeseen. As far as Joe being a great singer is concerned, I've been with him long enough to know that 99.9% of the time he is in tune.

Joe has been super nice to me and we're good friends. I believe in him and his music.

I hope to see some of you out there. If any of you are connected on myspace, look me up. My screen name is steelarama.

Take care and God Bless!

Dean

Joe Drivdahl wrote: I notice that Rhonda is the only one singing on key. Why is that?

I've even heard the usually solid-as-a-rock,
Martina McBride sing off key on the Opry.

Are these people unable to hear themselves?
I have a theory about why Rhonda is able to sing on key... No Drummer!

Rhonda comes from Bluegrass, you sing loud
and you sing on key or they laugh at you.

So a combination;
loud voice to get over her head tone, and no drummer.

Even though the drummers are behind plexiglass sheets
it is enough stage clutter to mask monitor returns..

For the others I really do suspect crappy monitor mixes.
Read; just too low.

Just a basic 'house level that is safe' as mics are moved around,
no feedback, but isn't CLOSE to tuned in for real lead singers.
I am sure this is the problem,
because the IN ear singers are more in tune.

There is this level between
hearing the monitors and hearing your 'headtone',
and if you get trapped between it
you just can't pick either note with accuracy.

I really think even the best pros are getting sandbagged by this.
And THAT'S a shame.

Interestingly, Bob Brolly (MBE) has been asked to appear on the Opry, and as his Musical director, I shall also be there.. in the fall sometime..

The last time I was in gNashville was at Fireside with an Irish contingent recording with Porter as a producer, I think the B***jo picker was called "Cedar Stump" ! The steel player was Weldon and also Irish stew (Basore)was there another day. I was reprimanded by Weldon for using too many of HIS signature licks on the covers I'd played on in Ireland..
(I've still got those stolen licks filed away for future use)

Does Bob's current invite imply anything about HIS tuning ? or would it have something to do with the documentary we're filming for the BBC ? after all Bob is a Six days a week BBC presenter and did get his MBE from the Queen of England for his contributions to broadcasting and charities..

I am right there with you, Billy Carr. I was in a bluegrass band for a while trying to scratch out a tune on a fiddle. I got my fill of bluegrass pretty much. I still enjoy listening to good bluegrass, but a little goes a long way.

I don't know how you get the RFD channel. My cable company doesn't give us any option when they add a channel like that. They just add it and increase the charge. But I really enjoy shows like the Midwest Country Show, with Joe Savage. And the Johnnie High Country Music Revue with Reece. The musicians on these shows are top knotch, and you can actually hear them, especially the Midwest Country Show.

Joe

The Oprys not dead...they just buried it alive right next to Country music..

This is a funny thread, and I agree with everybody! (So far). I guess we are really all "brothers in steel" and this thread is proof.


About Joe Nichols steel player, a great guy, great player and good friend, talk to him if you ever get close to him, he'll appreciate it.

Dean Holman is a goodern. He has a great future ahead of him not like me, I have a great future behind me. (and it's getting bigger, my shadow weighs 12 pounds!)



Bobbe



Bobbe

Yep---He's Joe's gain/Branson's loss-- But we've had him for quite a while--multi talented and a great guy with it.

Most of Bobbe's secretaries have
great futures in front of them too.

I sat in with a friend at a local MIC night last week, he's a fine singer and a fine Guitar player. I was sitting maybe 3 feet from the monitor and the guitar was so MID RANGED that I couldn't actually zoom IN on what key he was playing in ! It was too loud and way too middy. The Bartender was the sound guy ! There was also about 100 folks in this very small bar having a great time talking and such.

So I got up, went and got a Beer, drank it, came back and played anyway

Had a great time.

I did gospel music on a show in South Texas with the Vincent family when Rhonda was 12 years old and just learning to play. She was a excellent singer then. I think one reason she can sing on tune is because she grew up singing close knit harmony with her family and she is a genuine, pure voiced singer. The others aren't.
Charley

Joe Casey,
Thats funny - "buried alive."

Actually for me at least, country isn't completely buried I don't think. Sometimes a song comes along that is pretty good, like Alan Jackson's "Small town, Southern Man" I likes that'n. And George Strait's "Cowgirl" song. And Uh... off the top of my head, I can't think of any other newer tunes that I care for right now. I think there are a couple though. Alan and George have managed to stay "pretty" country throughout.

Charlie,
I agree with you on that. One thing about bluegrass singers, their talent is usual "real". Its from gathering around that one mic, I think, and I wonder if a lot of their stuff isn't recorded "live" with minimal overdubs?

I remember an interview with Allison Krause before she bacame mainstream. She swore she'd never "compromise her music." Yeah, ok, Alison. I want to hear her and Robert Plant do a duet of "Steel Rails."

Joe

Hey Bo - those 'happy' audience pans on the Opry are years old from the archives, when Jimmy Dickens was on stage. They just insert 'em when needed.

Of course they are, Barry!

Great thread and comments. I was fortunate enough to be at the Opry this past summer for Porter's 50th Anniversary. The host was Marty Stuart and I suppose there might have been more preparation for this show because the singers for the most part did an excellent job. Especially Gene Watson and Patty Loveless. Flawless really. And floor monitors..not in ears. Overall,it has been very sad to see the change in country music to the state it is in. Mostly bad 80's music mascquerading as country. And I absolutely despise seeing the backing musician's in some of the new acts looking like they should be in a hip hop act. Backwards baseball hats and piercings...uuugggghhhh!!!! (Kenny Chesney's band ) IMO

David L. Donald wrote:Most of Bobbe's secretaries have
great futures in front of them too.

David... you owe me a new monitor! The old one is now officially a coffee catcher...

LOL, good one.
I'll send you some handy wipes.
Brandy DOES come to mind. Often.

The future is what happens before you get there.
I notice they enter the room,
before they enter the room.

Joe D. I really love that Alisson Krauss / Robert Plant album.
These two really sound like they are singing together.
Watching each other and smiling.

Both of them have tons of stage time and decades of singing.
I am sure she wouldn't have done it if he couldn't
have hung in there with her properly.
There is a lot of feeling and heart in the music too.
And the country cuts sound REAL country.
And steel turned UP.

No doubt her next bluegrass album will be quite roots purist,
to make sure the hardcore doesn't desert.

I'm not giving up,Somewhere out there is real talent lurking in a VFW or LEGION hall,that will break lose and be discovered.[except for one or two exceptings,There is NOTHING out there in the top 40 so-called country artist that is even CLOSE to someone like Marty Robbins,Faron,Jim Reeves,Eddy Arnold when it comes to vocals,Plus very few songs written that has a melody,It all sounds alike,almost sung in a monotone.Some of it is getting so close to rap,it's scary.Thank goodness I just got the RFD channel,At least can see and hear some REAL country,by REAL artist doing it RIGHT,Since I got it have seen Porty,Dolly,Norma Jean,Billy Walker,Charlie Pride,Faron,Ray Price,Wilburn Brothers with Curly,etc,So nice to see the REAL thing for a change,by the way saw Michael Douchette with Billy Walker,Great playing Mike.DYKBC.

David,

I have only heard the one song from the Allison and Robert Plant album - Whatever it is, the one video they have where they are walking toward each other.

Anyway, I don't really mind that song, but for someone who said she'd never compromise her music, it seems pretty commercial to me. But I can't speak about the country cuts on the album because I haven't heard them. I suspect they'll be released as singles and maybe I'll get to hear some of them.

Joe

I havn't been to the Opry in years . Sorry to hear that it has gone so far down hill.Does this mean singers like Connie Smith no longer sings on the Orpy Ron

Todays music has reached the point where the worse you are as a singer, the better the chance of becoming a star, or in one case, Entertainer of the year! 3 times!