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Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:17 pm
by Steinar Gregertsen
It was recorded in much the same fashion as before that, except with a few enhancements (digital reverb, chorus, flange, etc.).
The 80s gave us drum machines and MIDI programming,- inventions that sucked the life out of pop music for pretty much the whole decade. As samples and MIDI has improved so has the musical results, so I'm no enemy of modern technology, but go back and listen to the arrangements and production values of most of 80s pop music and it's pretty horrible stuff. Some nice catchy tunes here and there though.

Even more important - the 80s gave us MTV, the single most important factor in preparing the ground for the insane commercialism we see today.
but try to compare the musical chops and abilities of just the Neo-Classical Metal era to those players of the 60's and 70's.
Weill, IMHO, with the exception of Steve Vai and a few others, the only thing the Neo Classical crowd were any good at were motor skills. Most of them knew how to move their fingers real fast on a fretboard and had good coordination, but musical depth were sadly lacking in most of the music. Sweep picking arpeggios over an Am/G/F/E chord sequence gets old real fast...
Jimi was simply Jimi. Imagine what he could have done had he not given in to heroin
The coroner who performed the autopsy on Jimi's body did not find any traces of heroin or any other sign of excessive use of heavy drugs.
Hippies are (sadly) now pretty much homogenized and mainstream
And so will you be when you're in your 50s while your kids may have turned out to be "neo-hippies"... ;)


Steinar

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:17 pm
by Tucker Jackson
Well this topic has veered away from music, but since the originator has gone down the highjack path too...


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The question should not be "who invented the PC," but "who developed software to make it useable?"

This is a photo of a small start-up called Microsoft Corporation in 1978. The gentleman in the lower left corner is Bill Gates, aka "The richest man in the world."

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:18 pm
by P Gleespen
Matt Rhodes wrote:I think my generation also invented the Search Engine:

Try Googling "first personal computer", then we can have a real conversation. :)
Being a card-carrying member of Generation X (I think I'm about two years older than you), that's the first thing I did. :)

From wikimapedia:

"The Commodore PET, the TRS 80, and the Apple II, also known as the 1977 Trinity by Byte magazine, are often cited as the first personal computers."

The great thing about googling phrases like that is you can generally find quotes that will back up pretty much any statement you make. :P :)

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:27 pm
by Mat Rhodes
Oh, so I imagined the IBM 610 (1957). My bad, Mr. Gleespen.

http://www.maxmon.com/1973ad.htm

I can't say I understand all of the animosity. I thought Hippies were transcendental and above getting riled at other's opinions.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:29 pm
by Jim Cohen
Matt Rhodes wrote:The SGF has been pretty stale for the last few months. Now I've given you something real to think about and discuss
Yes, like "questionable fashion and personal hygiene, flexible mores, other-worldly (read "unproductive") intellectual pursuits, and the overall championing of mediocrity..."

Thank you for your valuable contribution.
.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:35 pm
by Mat Rhodes
Well, Jim, like all the others, you've decided to read what you want and selectively leave out the rest. I guess predictability should be expected :roll: .

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:42 pm
by P Gleespen
Matt Rhodes wrote:My bad, Mr. Gleespen.

http://www.maxmon.com/1973ad.htm
It's all good. :wink:

So, you know that article you're citing pretty much rules out the 610 as a viable PC based on it's outrageous price tag, right?
I can't say I understand all of the animosity.
While I can see that some of the other fellas are getting bent out of shape by your calling their generation a bunch of stinky slackers, I hope you don't think I'm angry at all. I'm just having fun! This is a crazy roller-coaster ride we're ridin' baby! WhoooHoooo!

;-) :) :)

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:50 pm
by Mat Rhodes
I guess what I don't understand is how music produced by that generation became such a Sacred Cow. It's OK to criticize rap, pop, pop-country, and every other genre that has contributed to the downfall of Western Society. But I ask a legitimate question, and I get a mostly bunch of knee jerk responses that have nothing to do with the real topic. You guys are worse than a woman scorned!

If you don't like my opening paragraph, and it hurts your sensibilities, then try ignoring it and respond to the real subject.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:56 pm
by Jim Cohen
Matt Rhodes wrote:If you don't like my opening paragraph, and it hurts your sensibilities, then try ignoring it and respond to the real subject.
I guess I could, but I just don't feel like it anymore. That's human relations for ya. Go figure.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:57 pm
by Tucker Jackson
Matt Rhodes wrote:But I ask a legitimate question, and I get a bunch of knee jerk responses that have nothing to do with the real topic.
Matt, I answered your question, as did Steiner and others.

You've chosen to ignore those responses about music... and have instead gone on to fight a culture war. One based on "painting everybody with one brush," even though many (most?) of us responding are not what you call hippies.

Then you ask innocently why you're not getting responses to your question about music? Pu-leeze. If you're serious about talking about music, start a new thread.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:59 pm
by Mat Rhodes
Sorry, Jim. If I said something that didn't have an element of truth in it, then I'm wrong.

Tucker, you must have edited out the "mostly" in my sentence. I liked yours and Steiner's responses - thoughtful and to-the-point.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 2:59 pm
by Steinar Gregertsen
Edit... nevermind... move on, nothing to see here..

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:01 pm
by Doug Beaumier
edit... :?

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:11 pm
by Mike Winter
http://ezinearticles.com/?Do-You-Suffer ... &id=386853

Yes, you read it. Men suffer from P.M.S (pre-menstrual stress).

I am a man, and I like you (if you are also male) may suffer from P.M.S, why? Just like women you have a hormonal system. If this system is out of balance, then symptoms may occur.

A common symptom of hormonal imbalance is premenstrual stress. The problem with men is that you don’t menstruate. So you just don’t know you are suffering because there is no way to know it is premenstrual.

How do you know if you suffer?

Ask your wife, spouse, girlfriend or family or friends, to mark on a calendar when you are grumpy, moody or just feel as if you are under stress. When you feel tired, when work is upsetting you, when you stress affects you or you are anxious. Mark it on the calendar and note the pattern.

Every four to six weeks you will have a period where you feel grumpy, moody, tired etc. This is the male hormonal cycle.

Most of you will be saying … it isn’t me; it’s just been a busy period of time. I’m not grumpy, people just don’t understand me. Of course I’m anxious, look at all the work stress I have, the deadlines I have to complete by Friday.

Look around you, if everyone else is doing the same workload as you, are they just as grumpy, tired and irritable. If not … it is you … and yes … you are suffering from P.M.S (pre-menstrual stress).

Just ask those around you, if they believe you suffer. Don’t get mad, grumpy or depressed if they say … yes!

Men's health is a common topic today. You die earlier than women; have worse health statistics, more heart disease and many other health complaints. You deal with stress less efficiently and the effects of stress are worse.

The hormonal system is part of this. Did you know that your hormonal system controls your heart rate, cholesterol, stress response and blood pressure? All common problems, in men.

The first symptoms of imbalance in the hormonal system are not a heart attack or high blood pressure. It is the annoying symptoms that you discount easy … P.M.S (pre-menstrual stress).

Like most other bodily functions, the hormonal system is ignored when there are only minor signals saying it is out of balance. How often do you wait until your back is crippling you, before you see someone to remove the pain?

Hormonally, the same applies. You ignore the minor symptoms (this is not just men, women do this also hormonally), until larger ones occur.

Women end up with Hysterectomy’s, or cancers of the uterus etc, thyroid problems and many other health problems. Men, because even though you have the same organs as women, you still function differently, end up with heart problems.

As life is increasing in stress, the hormonal system is asked to work harder. Notice how as life is more stressful, there is an increasing number of testicular cancers, prostate problems, heart disease … all the statistics for these are getting worse not better.

So what to do?

Get healthy, hormonally included. Reduce stress, boost your energy, have more holidays, relax more, learn ways to look after your self better.

Male P.M.S (pre-menstrual stress) is just the first sign of ill health; don’t put it down to a bad day at the office, or just too much stress. Change now before it is too late, don’t end up clutching your chest, riding to hospital in the back of the ambulance and then remembering …

If only I had listened, become healthy and lived better … if only.

Dr Graeme Teague is an expert on stress and the affects it has on health. His unique and fresh views on anxiety, depression and stress are a welcome change. His web site Fast Stress Relief.com is designed to give you all the information and facts on how and why stress affects you, and more importantly simple, proven and natural ways to eliminate anxiety, depression and stress.


:D :) :P 8) :P :wink: ;-)

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:20 pm
by Jody Sanders
Bob, I think this has gone far enough. The personal attacks are not what this forum is about. I highly recommend this thread be closed. Jody.

Bottom line...

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:20 pm
by Ron Whitfield
You weren't there, Matt. The 60s could never be 'explained' to anyone sufficiently who was unfortunate enuf to have missed out on the greatest decade, 1960-1970. RIP
As Doors guitarist, Robbie Krieger, suggested to a befuddled caller/listener during a www.coasttocoastam.com interview the other night, "just drop some acid".

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:30 pm
by Mike Winter
I don't think anyone's getting upset. Matt's right in that the Forum has been a little dry lately...kind of nice to have an open dialogue on something other than the endless debate of what constitutes real country, etc. :)

If my little joke offended anyone, I'm sorry.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:31 pm
by Duncan Hodge
Wasn't Jerry Garcia a hippie? Sorry, but it just seemed like the next logical step in this thread. If someone already mentioned this please forgive me on account of I have ADD, don't read very thoroughly and am much too old a hippie to take stimulants anymore. The only people who seemed able to take amphetamines well into middle age were the old redneck country players, not the hippies.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:37 pm
by Mat Rhodes
Alan Holdsworth was harmonically innovative. Probably more so in the 80's than the 60's and 70's, but still an innovator of that generation. Touche to me.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 3:40 pm
by Tucker Jackson
Yeah, Alan Holdsworth was good. My brother's a huge fan.

The Beatles had a few good ideas too :)

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 4:12 pm
by Steinar Gregertsen
Genesis. Yes. Focus. King Crimson. Emerson Lake And Palmer. Jethro Tull. Camel. Etc, etc... (that's not a band name).
Like or dislike them, but "sloppy" is not the word I'd use to describe their musicianship. And they would probably not have happened if it hadn't been for the "psychedelic" excesses of the late 60s.

Steinar

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 4:22 pm
by Edward Meisse
One of the things that confuses me a little about this is the idea that hippies are limited to a certain generation. I look around and see the culture alive and well. But it has evolved just like everything else. And there are now hippies of all ages and social standings. But I do think that the music of our time, every genre, lacks real creative energy. That is why so many of us, from Winton Marsalis to Asleep at the Wheel to Allison Krause are looking to the past for inspiration. And someone will find it. And then they'll breathe life into the culture again.

Hippie?

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 5:23 pm
by Randy Phelps
The term 'hippy or hippie' was coined by time magazine for a story they were doing on youth culture. As with any age, folks always feel the need to somehow codify an age and make general statements so they feel like they 'understood' what happened.

Things then, like now, are fairly unorganized. Even with the internet there are all kinds of different little movements and different kinds of music evolving. As far as being musically conservative or liberal... that is okay as a construct as long as we can all agree it is meaningless beyond some kind of algebra based on stereotypes.

If we want to take a period of time say 1964-1974 and ask 'were their substantial contributions made in this period by musicians playing music that challenged the popular norm of the time?" Answer: an unqualified yes. Country music was headed down a pretty dangerous path during the early 60's toward a very pedestrian style full of strings and 50's style pop music. Without the radicals like Willie, Waylon, Buck Owens, Cash, Kristofferson, eventually Haggard, Paycheck" country was headed for a very uninteresting future.

Bands like Commander Cody, the FBB, Nesmiths bands, Ricky Nelson's bands allowed a wider band of listeners to be invited into country and gave it a breath of fresh air. The outlaw movement does not happen without the aforementioned including Charlie Daniels, The allman's etc...

If there is something unfortunate it is that while the 80's country scene was SAVED by the influence of punk (the new traditional movement of Dwight Yoakum etc) came out of several movements that reinvigorated the music. Ricky Skaggs came out of the hot band which was full of folks who were straight out of Gram Parson's band.

So, in that past example alone you can see that the 'lines' being drawn are as artificial as Dolly Parton's... melding of traditional pop and country music.

The history of popular music (including country and hillbilly) in the modern world is a wonderful mosaic of influences and happenstances. All of them valuable and important.

What we have missed in the past 10 years is the crucial and rich influence of another form of music in Country to re center it. Instead, country has slouched imo toward a watered down popular music of the late 1970's/early 1980's.

I'm ready for the revolution to help us rediscover the value of the music we've always had.

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 6:18 pm
by John De Maille
Unfortunately, I've been involved with playing country music for the last 30 or so yrs, so I can't consider myself a contributor to comment on music of the late 70's or 80's or 90's. But, I have heard a rendition of "Eight Days A Week", thanks Doug Jernigan and Jim Cohen has done a whole album dedicated to the music of the 60's. Bus Stop, Walk Away Renee, A Whiter Shade Of Pale to name just a few. Wonderful music! I grew up in that period, cut my teeth with a Fender Strat and happily became a "Hippie". I had a band that toured the east coast from Maine to Florida, playing that style of music. And yes, I agree that some of it was pure crap, ( remember "BubbleGum Music" )I never played any tunes along that line. I (We) gravitated to the West Coast sound of the Byrds, Gram Parsons, Poco in our later playing career. I even went to Woodstock in 69' and rigged the sound towers. Saw and heard the whole show of "new" and mostly good music. And, today, some of it still is being played. I work for a place that has concerts every summer. The Boston Pops, Philadelphia Pops and the New York Pops usually include a few Beattle tunes to their repertoire when they perform for us. So, musically, I think there was a contributiuon made by some Hippies from the 60's. It all tends to trickle down to future generations.

Not referencing anyone in particular, but a few should heed

Posted: 30 Jan 2008 6:31 pm
by Ben Elder
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