The Steel Guitar Forum

Rick Nicklas wrote:Okay Doug, I just watched the last clip (third one)and you are right.... he needs to pull this one off the internet. You don't need to be a steel player to smell something fowl on this one. I kept waiting to see the speed picking portion anywhere but it did not happen. But I still think the first one is legit.

You know, Rick, I'm not so sure. I find it terribly distracting trying to split my brain into one half hearing and one half watching, so I noted that the "speed picking" started in the audio at around 1:43, then turned the sound off and watched the hands at about 1:41 (bearing in mind that the visual picking starts about two seconds before the audio), and it does actually look to me like they're playing that passage. Try it without the audio and see what you think.

Doug, I hate to hang myself out here to be flamed as an idiot, and I have no explanation for the sync/out-of-sync discrepancy at the beginning, but I've been wasting my time staring at this dang thing over and over and I think the hand movements do correspond to the music, but with the audio delayed about two seconds. So at the least I think it's a quite good job of faking.

Brint, as I said in my last post (just before your last post) look at the very END of the last clip.

He gets up out of his chair and the pedal steel music continues to play, BUT as he walks on the floor we hear his shoes clicking in perfect sync with the video. He picks up something on his steel guitar and that clicking noise is in sych with his hand motions. That proves that there is No audio delay in this clip. Not even at the very end. The only 'delay' is in the faker's hands.

i don't know why i care, but i really don't think it's a fake. I think the loud tap you hear at the end is him putting his bar down. Just because a noise seems to correspond with his shoes or whatever, does not make it necessarily so.

Did you look at my video? these things get out-of-sync quickly. I am reaching to turn off the camera before the music stops.

Also, why would anyone post something so obviously fake and out of sync? It don't make no sense! the song is good, but the playing is not really stellar.

If he'e faking it, he's faking it to his own previously recorded track. There's simply no way he could fake all those lever and pedal moves exactly right if he hadn't (at one time) played that track himself.

I don't know who that guy is but I saw the video before, he needs lessons bad, guys this dude has poor right hand technique, just look his right hand is in the "claw" his top knuckle is not elevated, just compare it to Herby Wallace or Jeff Newman. This is very very poor right hand technique, if it is real this is about the max that he will get.

I would be so embarrass by this video wouldn't you?

What is the moral of the thread? LEARN RIGHT HAND TECHNIQUE!

Doug I agree totally with you he is a PHONEY!

Guys he gets up and the steel keeps on playing?

WOuld you not want to review your video before throwing out on the web?

Eat your heart out Ashley Simpson!

That's so bogus it's laughable. You can tell the guy has fooled around with a steel a little but he ain't playing it in these clips.Besides all the clues already mentioned he just ain't making the moves with either hand to even be close to foolin anybody.For instance,he's getting things out of one position you just can't get. I can't believe anyone on this forum who can actually play would buy this crap for a second.

I can't believe anyone on this forum who can actually play would buy this crap for a second.

I can't believe it either. It's embarrassing. I am totally shocked that there are Steel Guitar Forum members who cannot tell that this guy is a fraud. He is Not playing what you are hearing. He knows some basic pedal steel moves, but he is way off. I am not impressed with his 'picking'. I Am impressed with the audio, but this joker is not the player.

I'll say it again... the room noises at the beginning and at the end of the clip (the footsteps, etc.) are IN SYNC with the video. This proves that there is no delay in the audio. Don't blame compression, don't blame digital technology, don't blame the internet, don't blame a poor connection. The audio and the 'visual' are in sych... and this guy is missing over half of the notes that we hear. His picking is Way off. It's an absolute joke.

There are a lot of clues, but the dead giveaway is the end: He gets up from his chair... the steel keeps playing... yet we hear his footsteps on the floor as we watch him walking... while the steel music is still playing. Come'on!

Here's another occasion when we discussed this guy.
http://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopi ... ht=#943182

You were right Johnny, and they were wrong. His fake job was a little better on the blues slide clip, but I smelled a rat about about 10 seconds into that clip.

I wonder who actually played the steel parts...?

If he'e faking it, he's faking it to his own previously recorded track.

I thought he was "lip sync'ing" to his own track about 15 seconds into it. We're hearing *two* audio tracks - the prerecorded music, and as Doug observes, the ambient noises picked up by the video recorder.

It's a sham, but his own sham IMO. Both clips are an incredible amount of "air steel" to play so visually well. I doubt anyone here could pull it off.

As far as it being a waste of a pedal steel and being "easily" played on a 6-string, I'd love to see that said to Gary Moore's face. Differences in taste are one thing ("I don't like that kind of steel playing", for example), but pronouncing it a "waste" is rather provincial...

...he needs lessons bad, guys this dude has poor right hand technique, just look his right hand is in the "claw" his top knuckle is not elevated, just compare it to Herby Wallace or Jeff Newman.

I don't know what kind of player he is, or how good he is. But I do know that steelers don't have just one way of holding their right hands. What works is what works for you, and it's the music that counts, not the way you hold your hands, or what kind of gear you use.

Any one who doubts that should watch a Chet Atkins video, and then one by Thumbs Carlisle. Techniques as different as night and day - but they were both great players!

I'm not sure if he's faking it or not but I like the tastefullness of what I heard on the video.
Don

Donny OK I should not have compared him to Herby or Jeff, but to get good tone it stars with a good right hand! and this is a good example of what poor right hand technique is. If one wants to sound like crap and don't want to tack the time to learn the instrument go for it.

I used to play with a "claw" myself it was a very hard habbit to break. I play with an elevated knuckle and it improves alot of things. The idea is that you flick more of your wrist as oppose to your fingers, you can see how this would improve ones playing.

I also felt that when I played with the "claw" I would max myself out, learning this new right hand technique helped me out so much, trust me look at most well rounded guys when they play is their top knuckle elevated or not? These are the guys I try to model myself from.

Whenever I see someone playing sloppy, it shows, and it shows very loud in this video. I shake my head thinking this guy spent alot of money on his steel why not go a little further and get lessons?

why would anyone fake THAT?
Its just not that interesting to bother..might as well shoot a "fake" video of me changing a lightbulb.

This is funny. This thread and disscussion is about a guy pretending to play steel in a YouTube video. It has nothing to do with technique or sloppy playing. The "claw" approach can work real well as in JayDee Maness and Doug Jernigan to name a couple impeccable players who play like that. This is about a guy blatently,clearly and obviously faking it - that fact should not even be up for debate. Anyhow the audio tracks are only somewhere between fair and OK in the first place and are things any journeyman E9 player could have come up with.When you read the viewers comments below the video it's apparent that 99% of them think he's really playing which reveals that they're not familiar with the instrument,its potential and what it looks like when a guy's really playing it. I see the same disconnect on ths forum to some extent - which puzzles me.

Sidebar - In a thread a while back I mentioned the "claw" as a strained, uncomfortable way of playing *for me* and was told it was "correct" and that a raised knuckle etc. was "wrong".

Just goes to show you.

On topic -

hy would anyone fake THAT?
Its just not that interesting to bother

Because some people aren't locked into particular styles of music. That particular song sold like hotcakes when Gary Moore recorded it on 6-string. Amazingly, what's "not interesting" to some people IS interesting to the general public.

I'm just shaking my head at the negative comments about the song, whether or not it's right for steel, etc.

If HE doesn't care, neither should you guys. Put some of YOUR stuff up - do you think you'd be upset if someone said it's a waste of a steel or not interesting?

The double standard rears its head every other day, seemingly.

As for the grip he uses, one size doesn't fit all!

We have a player here that is also a forum member named Marty Broussard. He has a similiar grip. Marty's playing is nothing less than "amazing" as many can attest!
Dave

This is funny. This thread and disscussion is about a guy pretending to play steel in a YouTube video. It has nothing to do with technique or sloppy playing.

This is about a guy blatantly, clearly and obviously faking it - that fact should not even be up for debate.

You're right Michael, the debate is Over.

I have learned a lot in this post. Although I do not know many of the forum members personally, I notice that the members who spotted the hoax are mostly long-time players with lots of experience. I can only assume that members who did not spot the hoax are fairly recent players and might be easily impressed, or maybe they simply believe everything they see and hear on the internet.

Now the question is WHY would this guy waste his time doing this. Well... YouTube is full of phony videos… staged accidents, staged fights, kids pretending to sing, idiots playing air guitar, mostly it’s kids with too much time on their hands, and a video camera. This guy is obviously a wannabe who plays a little bit of steel guitar. People who are impressed that he can mimic the audio so closely... don’t be. He’s missing half of the notes.

Our discussion should now focus on Why some people feel the need to cheat, steal the work of another player and take credit for it. Is it to impress his friends? Is it a joke? Is he just having fun? Or is he really trying to make us believe that he is the player?

I notice that the members who spotted the hoax are mostly long-time players with lots of experience. I can only assume that members who did not spot the hoax are fairly recent players and might be easily impressed, or maybe they simply believe everything they see and hear on the internet.

Doug, that seems to just continue divisiveness here. Saying about "fairly recent" players "maybe they simply believe everything they see and hear on the internet" and that they "might be easily impressed" seeems...to me...to imply that newer players are not smart enough to notice video problems; it has nothing to do with the playing. It doesn't personally hit me since I think it is a hoax (although one where the guy prerecorded the part, as mentioned - what, do you guys think he hired someone else to play it?)

You seem to be making your own pronouncement of a definition of "spotting the hoax" if you're tossing Donny in with "recent players" by association. In my case, I'm a "recent player" on steel maybe, but 40 years of guitar gives you a pretty good perception of "air guitar" videos - I picked it up, but with a similar observation to Donny's - so where do we fit in your attempt at arbitrarily grouping the relative observational skills of players?

Some other "recent players" are as I recall are longtime musicians "recent" only to steel - don't assume only your long-time steel buddies are the only ones with enough experience or qualifications to pick up on this stuff. Sheesh, I had both my sons - 25 and 12, both guitar players not not steel players - watch it and come to the same "prerecorded" conclusion I did with no prompting from me. My wise, a non-musician, non-tech person, "video-camera challenged", saw the same thing.

You seem almost angry at people who don't agree precisely with your position...and it's posts like that last one that just seem to further push the "them and "us" attitude. The more upset you get at differing opinions...especially by newer players...by tossing out thiny-veiled insults (the some" and "most" attempts at tempering things just aren't worth much when the post was made at all), the more you maintain the "we experienced players are the only ones whose opinions have value" attitude that seems so darned common around here.

And this:

Our discussion should now focus on Why some people feel the need to cheat, steal the work of another player and take credit for it.

...has a two pronged, insulting intent. Unless you can PROVE the guy stole the recorded take you're on thin ice, and IMO WAY out of line. It doesn't matter who YOU are - you're now accusing someone of musical plagarism without any proof - you seem to think your opinion (with no supporting FACTS) and "status" gives you the right to now play lawyer or something.

Plus I don't recall it being your thread, -so who appointed you in charge of making a pronouncement that the subject matter should be changed?

I expect someone will probably reply with some version of "we on the forum don't think you respect or listen to experienced players" - however, do. I just don't agree with posts that further stregnthen the "demilitarized zone" between some experienced players who chest-puff and newer players (or ones outside the "established norm - especially when they accuse a player who apparently isn't a member and can't defend himself.

When you essentialy "execute" someone without knowing any facts or details, it's just lame IMO.

I don't know who he is but I really like him!

Because some people aren't locked into particular styles of music. That particular song sold like hotcakes when Gary Moore recorded it on 6-string. Amazingly, what's "not interesting" to some people IS interesting to the general public.

Jim, I'm not locked into anything. I will put my musical diversity up against yours anyday, anyday bro, but Im not here for a pissing contest.You think I dont dig it cause it aint country? haha. No I dont dig it because its pedestrian suburban blues. ITS BORING. I dont give a toss about Gary Moore or how many records he sold back in the stone age. Selling records is not an indicator of good music to me, sorry..Im sure Britney has sold alot of records too . The general public can also go take a long walk off a short pier. What interests them is generally the most banal watered down pap available. I'll turn on the radio when I want to know what they like..which will be never. As I said, why bother to fake something so utterly mundane and completely unspecial?

Jim you seem to have this attitude that you are on the cutting edge and everyone else here is some kind of country purist who starts angrily spitting tobacky when they hear a distortion pedal. If that makes you feel better about yourself to think that way, good for you i guess, but you couldnt be further off base.

I will put my musical diversity up against yours anyday, anyday bro,

In this corner......

not here for a pissing contest

shoot, the first bell hadn't rung yet....

shoot, the first bell hadn't rung yet....

whatever dude, bell rang a dozen posts back when he accused me of being locked into a particular style of music.

Jim, Thank you for your analysis. I stand by my statements. Yes, I am a little more outspoken than usual in this post because I am stunned and amazed at some of the responses here. I have learned a lot from this post.

The guy in the video is pretending to play the steel guitar. I simply, and cordially, stated that most experienced pedal steel players can spot that immediately. I remain baffled and amazed that there are members of this forum who can watch this video and fall for the hoax. I didn't mean to offend anyone, and I apologize if I did. I'm just stating my observations. Discussions here about how the guy is holding his hand, how he uses the knee levers, etc., are irrelevant and an absolute joke. This a guy on YouTube pretending to play. There is nothing else to say about it.