The Steel Guitar Forum

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 10:33 am**

perhaps a player that has a quality ear and the ability to shift between very smooth melody lines and complicated phrases that match the song and the style of the song while fitting into the overall content of the band. The player is also not timid and not afraid to CRANK it up rather than hide behind the rest of the band with a solo that only they can hear

They also know when to just plain shut up

there is no written rule that states he /she (we) must play 100% of the time.

Obviously this person has a fine knowlege of there instrument and APPLIES it. Always thinking ahead.

and maybe even smiles now and then

Although these principles can be applied to any Musician, the question pertains to us stone faced Steel Players

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 12:03 pm**

Mitch..those things you listed sure would make for a great musician....wouldn't matter if he played the banjo. But Scott Henderson, my friend, you nailed it. I really could care less who has a cd out, what type of steel he or she plays, how to sound like so and so, who's playing where. It's nice to know i guess, and i am happy and encourage them all. These are great steel guitarist, no doubt. And most of us will never reach that level of playing, and i sure admire the ones who have. But to me, i often get just as much joy out of hearing a newbie play, then i do some lounge musician who has played 35 years, and is there only for the money. No matter how good he is. It has to do with heart i guess. And sharing your love of the instrument with others. And encouraging the struggling ones trying to figure this extremely difficult instrument out. I have backed opry strars, played that great 6 night a week gig. But the most enjoyable and meaningful engagement i have ever had, was when i played the Developmental Center in Muskegon Michigan for a teen dance for "Special Kids". This warmed my heart, and made the learning, and hours of practice pay off. Just to see those young special needs kids dance and enjoy themselfs, was just wonderful. They didn't dance very well, and i couldn't play very well back then. So for once, we were all equal. I remember them going into my steeler seat, taking the things out and looking so curiously at them. Asking questions as best as they could talk. I walked away from that job, appreciating the instrument more, and it was a learning experience we all should have. These are little things that make a steel guitarist. Now if i could only "Sound" like one!

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 12:21 pm**

Of course what George and Scott state is correct and understood, but I think that description is more of an ambassador of the Instrument rather than what makes a quality player.

The thread question I feel relates to what makes a fine player , meaning one who is playing along with other musicians. that player can also be a great ambassodor as well.

I took the question as referring to the musician aspect...

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 12:41 pm**

I took the question as referring to the musician aspect...

Tony as i stated in my post, that generic statement could apply to the banjo. It like reece's post dealing with your tone being in your hands. There are no special technical guidlines for the steel guitar. And i was not speaking of just being an ambassodor to the steel guitar. It is what you feel, share and emotions, that will bring about creativity.

The thread question I feel relates to what makes a fine player , meaning one who is playing along with other musicians.

Ever hear an accordian player play "Proud Mary" ? i did once, it wasn't pleasent. Not because technically she wasn't a good accordian player. And we all played along with her alright. My point being, you can be great technically, and accomplished, and still not have the creativity and be a great steel guitarist. Like herb said, ya gotta know when to hold'em, and know when to fold'em.....

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 12:48 pm**

George...

Like herb said, ya gotta know when to hold'em, and know when to fold'em.....

I think that's a simultaneous event vis a vis the accordian...

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 4:09 pm**

You hear guys (The Public) talking about Lead guitarists, Bass players etc, even Drummers, but the only people you hear talk about Steel players are Steel players, except for the odd drunk in the audience who reckons he loves the guy on the harpsichord or the zither or even (on one occasion) the Balalika thing. What D'you think.
Cheers, Dave

Actually Dave they dont have a clue.
I tell someone I have a pedal steel while theye listening to one on the radio and they say "Whats that?"
I think mebby its better that way.heee-hee

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 4:25 pm**

I think the majority of the civilians have no idea what the instrument is, other than the "thing that makes the whining or crying sound."

WARNING! OFF TOPIC! I remember back in 1962, Del Shannon's song "Runaway" was a big hit. Many of y'all remember, I'm sure. It featured a rather distinctive solo on an electric organ,with a sound and style not usually heard at that time. KFWB radio, in LA, held a contest to name what instrument played the solo.

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 4:54 pm**

So how ya like it ?
Most civilians couldnt name the instrument that played the Steel Guitar Rag

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 5:08 pm**

When we played the Steel Guitar Rag in the Loggins & Messina band, Jimmy played the melody on his Telecaster.

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 5:45 pm**

Yea sad but true, I used to play it better on my spanish than I do now on the steel

Posted: **18 Jan 2007 6:15 pm**

I really don't know what a good steel player is but I know I sure have fun and enjoy playing mine. I don't play in the big time but I do play at a club every Friday and Saturday night, been there for 5 years and really enjoy it. We have nice crowds and they like my steel playing, so I guess i'm ok in their eyes and as long as they think I play ok, I'm happy

Posted: **20 Jan 2007 4:43 pm**

I think what makes a GOOD steel player is a true love of the instrument, good learning technique , practice ..feeling, emotion. Have I missed anything ? What makes A BRILLIANT steel player is all of the above plus masses of "taste".
I got all emotional for a minute there.

Posted: **21 Jan 2007 2:11 am**

Hi Dave, how you doing mate? Re your question, I don't think speed comes into it at all. Some can pick fast, some cant. I think taste and tone are much more important. A good friend of mine who is an incredible drummer, showed me an article in a drum magazine. The article said "how to know you are a good matured player" It said "If you are on the bandstand and see somebody who you know walk in who plays the same instrument you play, and you don't play to impress him, but just play for the band" That's when you are a matured good player. Agree on that mate??? Keep in touch

Micky Byrne England www.mickybyrne.com

Posted: **21 Jan 2007 2:21 am**

Micky Byrne wrote:Hi Dave, how you doing mate? Re your question, I don't think speed comes into it at all. Some can pick fast, some cant. I think taste and tone are much more important. A good friend of mine who is an incredible drummer, showed me an article in a drum magazine. The article said "how to know you are a good matured player" It said "If you are on the bandstand and see somebody who you know walk in who plays the same instrument you play, and you don't play to impress him, but just play for the BAND" That's when you are a matured good player. Agree on that mate??? Keep in touch

Micky Byrne England www.mickybyrne.com

Posted: **21 Jan 2007 11:51 am**

Here's a couple penny's worth to add to the discusson...

Whenever I hear comments about "knowing when, or what, not to play", I never hear comments on what that means in practical application.

Earlier someone said that when he stopped playing he thought it left a big hole in the music. My thought was that maybe that is just what should be happening. We are brainwashed by the radio version of what music should sound like, and I, for one, don't like that constant barrage of sound. It's a throwback to the "wall of sound" concept....and I didn't like it then, either.

I think music should breathe, have dynamics, and that means you don't need everyone comping chords all the time. Completely laying out is a big part of the "knowing when, or what, not to play" part, IMHO

Posted: **22 Jan 2007 9:09 pm**

"All of the above", I would like to clarify that. IMO all the posts above I read have some merit and truth in them, in one way or another. It is a lot in the minds of your audience.
If they think you are a good steel player, then you are a good steel player, as far as they are concerned....al.

:)

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 5:29 am**

Scott H., I appreciate your sentiment. But shouldn't that apply to ALL musicians of all instruments, and singers as well. Yet, on this forum, guitarists, drummers, singers, and others are often shredded by steel players. How does that fly in terms of the beliefs that you stated in your eloquent post.

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 5:47 am**

Umm. Dave Seddon a Welshman, I suppose that makes me a Greek , Nica playing on You Tube Dave, all the best Frank Bloomfield .Corfu

Dave Seddon wrote:Well there you go, a stupid Welshman asking a stupid question. I still think Somewhere ther is a good answer. OK forget about the public, I'll rephrase the Question. "What makes a good Steel Player, from a Steel Players point of view," be it Speed, Tone, Technique, Style, Feeling, Effects or what???
Cheers Dave.

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 9:09 am**

Jeff,
Oh yes I couldn't agree more. I do feel that this thread goes beyond the boundries of steel guitar and in to the wide open world of music as a whole. All instruments are an extension of our emotions and I respect anyone who uses what ever tool and respectfully tells me their truth with their instrument. I am very adiment about how we over complicate things though. In my playing I stick to the philospohy of KISS. That's my choice.I can't tell anyone how to play because it is not my place. I think I go out of bounds when I tell another player to "play it this way" When I here someone playing their heart out for me I repsect them and REGARDLESS of their level of ability or talent, if they are giving me their truth, their expression, their best then I consider them a good player. That's all I ask when I am listening to someone. Gimme those three things and I am impressed. God only made one person that can be you and that's YOU. So if you give it all you have than you are a good player.

"If life were a competition we all would have been born with numbers on our backs" - some guy in a bar

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 9:41 am**

I remember when I first heard Lloyd Green's "Revisited" CD. I was in awe of his technical accomplishment. I knew how incredibly hard it is to do many of the moves he did. But at the same time I realized that anyone who doesn't play steel would just hear it as normal, competent, modern country music. Pretty, but nothing spectacular. This contradiction struck me pretty hard.

We don't become steel guitarists to be famous. There isn't one steel player in the world whose name is a household word. It's an obscure, specialized artform.

One of the benefits of learning steel is that it opens your ears to the artistry of the masters. Few non-players can fully appreciate the music of great steel players. Often the difference between mundane and sublime can only be heard by an experienced ear.

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 10:04 am**

Dave Seddon wrote:Well there you go, a stupid Welshman asking a stupid question. I still think Somewhere ther is a good answer. OK forget about the public, I'll rephrase the Question. "What makes a good Steel Player, from a Steel Players point of view," be it Speed, Tone, Technique, Style, Feeling, Effects or what???
Cheers Dave.

Dave-When you re-phrase that question, you get a different answer.

Now in that respect, IMO, Creativity,Tone,Emotions(feelings),Technique, makes a good Steel Player. A Steel guitar is a very personal special instrument, and can produce ANY kind or style of music. It hasn't been nearly as well known as it will be in the future time to come....al.

:):)

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 11:44 am**

As far as the John Q. Public question goes I think if the steel is in tune, in time, has a semblance to a riff they think they heard on their favorite tune, has some tone and feel, it's good. Mega notes a minute, 27 knee levers, a black PP Emmons, etc. have no meaning. Around here there aren't many bands with PSG's. So any crying, bending note, or other such sweet sound is just different. Who in the crowd hasn't played, owned, or know someone who plays guitar or drums? Practically no one. Their knowledge base has a much greater depth with mainstream instrumentation. Until I started playing steel I never even noticed the PSG in Elton John's "Tiny Dancer" or awed at the sounds in Anne Murray's "On Top of the World". People come up and want to know what kind of keyboard I have or call it a dobro. It's OK as long as they keep wondering. Sometimes remembering that I'm probably the only PSG player in the room keeps me from getting too nervous.

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 1:03 pm**

Excellent post, Bobby Lee! That's an accurate assessment, in my opinion.

RR

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 3:24 pm**

Bob
A very good point and I agree. If you're not gonna be famous might as well be happy and in our hearts that's all we want anyway isn't it. As long as any player progresses I think he is a good player. I see guys at steel shows and that is the only time I may get to hear them and get excited and proud for them when I see an improvement in their playing. This forum, to me, is not about communicating but communicating with each other to make each better players.

Posted: **23 Jan 2007 6:10 pm**

A heart and soul full of music and decent technical skills is what makes a GOOD steel player,,, Jerry Garcia had major limitations as a steel player, but had a head, heart,and soul FULL of music.. It enabled a neophyte steeler to lay down an all time classic pedal steel guitar part in Teach Your Children....

If you combine that sort of musical soul with great technical skill, then you have a GREAT steel player... We are talking about steel here, but the same applies for any instument... bob

The Steel Guitar Forum

What Makes a Good Steel Player

Dave Seddon a Welshman