The Steel Guitar Forum

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

The fact that the pedal steel guitar is by far the most difficult instrument to play of all

This is not 100% serious, is it?

Suggest a more difficult one.

Barry Blackwood wrote:

As I said earlier, if you want to attract younger people to the pedal steel guitar, it would be wise not to have such a crap attitude towards the style(s) that they like.

Rick, that is a two-way street...

I agree, Barry.
I've spent time in rock bands and country bands.
It constantly floors me about how many musicians are so myopic when it comes to music.


That being said, I still think that if the steel guitar community is serious about the survival of the instrument, we'll have to be more open to using the instrument in different styles of music.

In other words, if you guys truly want the instrument to be more popular, you would be wise to embrace artists like Robert Randolph.
Who else is a rock star, up front and center with a pedal steel guitar?
We need more like him.
That's how you're going to get kids to pay attention.
Then most likely, they will become interested in the guys in country music who came before him.



Rick

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4b5twrfyAj8

I can't believe I'm even replying to that kind of silliness.

To be trivializing every other musician's effort, just like that, feels a bit, uhm, self-indulgent.

[...] there is a multitude of worlds out there with differing definitions of complexity.

Still, it is a very young instrument and maybe the best is yet to come.

But I honestly sense very little desire from the community to go to new places. With exceptions of course.

Ulrich Sinn wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4b5twrfyAj8

I can't believe I'm even replying to that kind of silliness.

To be trivializing every other musician's effort, just like that, feels a bit, uhm, self-indulgent.

After all the majority of works played on pedal steel are from the three chords and the truth variety.

Nothing wrong with that, but there is a multitude of worlds out there with differing definitions of complexity.

Still, it is a very young instrument and maybe the best is yet to come.

But I honestly sense very little desire from the community to go to new places. With exceptions of course.

Ulrich,

Thanks for posting the Youtube video. I really enjoyed that.
When I was studying music a few years ago, my theory class was fortunate enough to be invited to a concert that was performed with a Baroque Organ.

It was one of the most amazing concerts that I had ever been too.
It was as though the sound was wrapping around my entire body.
Truly an incredible experience.

Rick

**I went out the very next morning and bought a few albums of Bach's compositions.

Alan Brookes wrote:

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

The fact that the pedal steel guitar is by far the most difficult instrument to play of all

This is not 100% serious, is it?

Suggest a more difficult one.

A steel guitar without pedals.

Ulrich Sinn wrote: After all the majority of works played on pedal steel are from the three chords and the truth variety.

that's baloney!

and we don't 'have to' do this or that or 'need
to' do this or that or 'need to' like anybody we don't.

alot of this thread is wrong.
we don't even 'need to' keep the steel
alive. it will do that on it's own.

Chris nailed it. Thread over.

b0b wrote:

Alan Brookes wrote:

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

The fact that the pedal steel guitar is by far the most difficult instrument to play of all

This is not 100% serious, is it?

Suggest a more difficult one.

A steel guitar without pedals.

Mark Wayne likes this.

b0b wrote:

Alan Brookes wrote:

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

The fact that the pedal steel guitar is by far the most difficult instrument to play of all

This is not 100% serious, is it?

Suggest a more difficult one.

A steel guitar without pedals.

It's not more difficult for me, but if you trying to do the things a pedal steel can do, then I can see the difficulty. Frankly, I gave up on pedal steel because of a lack of cooperation between my feet, knees and brain, not to mention hands. Somehow, I'm managing to find a happy medium. My right hand thinks "pedal steel", my left hand "non-pedal".

I have not read every post so if this has been said already please forgive me.

The question of new and different types of music and the steel should be framed by what the objective is. If we're looking to promote the use of the PSG, get new people to learn to play, keep it around for another 50 years and widen the awareness of the instrument by the listening public, then we do need to think outside the box, go boldly where no steel player has gone before, or whatever cliche you would prefer to use.

As an old guy and a comparative newcomer to steel, my goals are far less lofty. I am enjoying the learning process, and the fun comes with playing with music that I want to hear. I call it OPCM - Old People's Country Music - and I really don't care whether Bro Country or whatever else that's new these days has steel because I'm not going to be listening to it and I'm not going to be playing it.

It's not right vs. wrong, I have no beef whatever with those who want to blend steel with jazz, techno, pop, whatever. If it's popular with those genres, great. If not, it's not going to prevent me from having fun trying to learn all the songs most of y'all mastered decades ago.

"Why Isn't Pedal Steel More Popular"

Not wanting to come across as a pedant (or co-pedant), but I suppose you need to consider whether popularity exists only among musicians or includes listeners. Further, is pedal steel more popular in non-country genres than it was 50 years ago? Given the instrument was invented not much before then, I wouldn't expect its popularity necessarily to have settled, or the subtle differences between pedal steel and Hawaiian guitar to be fully understood by the wider population quite yet. I sleep easy that it is a unique beautiful sound capable of being used in just about all types of music (including non-western music) and that it's popularity by any measure will only grow.

Don R Brown wrote: the fun comes with playing with music that I want to hear. I call it OPCM - Old People's Country Music - and I really don't care whether Bro Country or whatever else that's new these days has steel because I'm not going to be listening to it and I'm not going to be playing it.

Ditto!!

b0b wrote:

Alan Brookes wrote:Suggest a more difficult one.

A steel guitar without pedals.

Mike Neer wrote:It's not more difficult for me, but if you trying to do the things a pedal steel can do, then I can see the difficulty. Frankly, I gave up on pedal steel because of a lack of cooperation between my feet, knees and brain, not to mention hands. Somehow, I'm managing to find a happy medium. My right hand thinks "pedal steel", my left hand "non-pedal".

Bar-slants are harder to master than pedals and knee levers, in my opinion. Your skill on the lap steel is much more impressive than the guy holding his bar at the 8th fret, mashing pedals to get the notes he wants.

I would say French Horn or any of the double reed instruments would be harder to play at least at first.

To me the act of saying the instrument that you play the hardest instrument to play is either an excuse for not playing well or an arrogant boast. In any case it is a foolish and meaningless statement.

b0b wrote:

Alan Brookes wrote:

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

The fact that the pedal steel guitar is by far the most difficult instrument to play of all

This is not 100% serious, is it?

Suggest a more difficult one.

A steel guitar without pedals.

That's illogical. Take your feet off the pedals and any pedal steel becomes non-pedal. Pedal steel has all the problems of non-pedal, and they're compounded when you start pressing pedals.

Herb Steiner wrote: ...

But one of the great instructors of the discipline is now gone. No, not Jeff Newman; I'm discussing the 5-hour, 6 nights a week, honkytonk sit-down gig, where it was okay to suck until you got better.

...

"Baptism by fire" is the only way, IMHO. There's no looking back, no repeat, replay, or loop buttons - if you can't play it, just wave as it goes by! At the end of the night, go home and shed like hell.

After almost 50 years of playing 6 string guitar all the way up to the level of shedding Charlie Parker tunes, I have found the PSG to be full of surprises, and there's a lot of truth to spending the first year or 2 achieving the level of "suck master" before getting into the meat and potatoes of it!

I go to open mic's pretty much as an opportunity to practice in a group, not to strut whatever stuff I have accumulated. At venues I visit most people have never seen a pedal steel in "3D", and are appreciative of seeing an instrument they've only heard on records or seen beyond reach.

Alan Brookes wrote:

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

The fact that the pedal steel guitar is by far the most difficult instrument to play of all

This is not 100% serious, is it?

Suggest a more difficult one.

sarangi

Jamie Mitchell wrote:

Alan Brookes wrote:

Ulrich Sinn wrote:

The fact that the pedal steel guitar is by far the most difficult instrument to play of all

This is not 100% serious, is it?

Suggest a more difficult one.

sarangi

bassoon? Or the Riverside Church organ is probably right up there in difficulty. 5 manuals, not knee levers.. dancin' and using all 10 digits!!

http://www.organarts.com/legacy03/harrison.html

I doubt that the Sarangi is as difficult to play as pedal steel. For a start, the strings don't have their pitch altered whilst it's being played. As far as the bassoon is concerned, it just plays individual notes. There are no chords to learn. The organ does require the use of both feet and both hands, but, again, the keys don't change notes whilst the instrument is being played.
Keep making suggestions. I still haven't heard of an instrument that comes even close to the pedal steel for complexity.

Leave it to the hillbillies to come up with the most difficult way of doing something.

Methinks the thread has taken a turn for the absurd.

I don't believe I could summon the audacity to walk up to the Principal Bassoon player of the San Francisco Symphony after a performance and say something like, "You know man, my lips have never touched the reed of a bassoon in my life - but I do play some pedal steel guitar and I am willing to bet that it's more difficult to become a good player on steel than it would be on the the bassoon. I mean, after all - you don't have to learn any chords."


A number of years ago we had a dobro workshop out here that was put on by Jimmy Heffernan. Many of us know Jimmy, and along with his career as a Nashville session musician he has been in the bands of among others, Brad Paisley, Doug Kershaw, Joe Diffie and Larry Sparks. He was one of the fellows who recorded in the early 2000s one of the great dobro albums of all time, The Resocasters which also featured the late great Mike Auldridge and Hal Rugg. You don't get these gigs just because you're a nice guy - you need to have the goods. I don't know if there are other instruments beyond the following list, but these are what I know he plays for sure: pedal steel, dobro, banjo, electric bass, and guitar.

During that workshop weekend we were out to dinner and I asked Jimmy, "so as a multi instrumentalist, what would you say is the hardest to play?"

His reply: "they're all hard."

Pedal steel is easier for me than most other instruments. To change chords, all you have to do push a pedal. You don't even have to remember what key you're in because they all use the same pattern. Try modulating from D to Eb on a marimba. You have to learn the whole song over again - every position is different. On pedal steel, you just play one fret higher.

On pedal steel, you don't even have to know the names of the notes you're playing. In fact, most players don't. How is that "harder"? I think it's one of the easiest instruments, actually. A little confusing at first, that's all.

Are there more steel manufacturers than there were fifty,thirty even ten years ago?I'm thinking yes,but I don't have any real info to support that. If so, are they profitable and would that be a gauge? Seems like playing well is hard.

All instruments are hard to play once you get past the basic stuff. Difficulty is relative to what the player wants to accomplish. I always keep that "ripe plum" out of reach, just enough to tease me to get better.

Things like major scale modes, playing all keys in one position, etc.,etc. make any instrument hard to play.

When I pick up any of my instruments (guitar, PSG, bass, dobro, mandolin, banjo, non pedal steel) I know that all that stuff is there, somewhere ! The hard part is finding it. I feel that I cannot really be a good player until I know where every note is on the instrument. It's tough to come to terms with at times. Maybe I'm too hard on myself. It's the "one man's ceiling is another man's floor" kind of thing.

Meanwhile I'll just keep going out and gigging

I gig pretty regularly on all types of guitar, including slide.....mandolin....bass....uke. I play a little piano, squeezebox and harmonica. Now I'm pretty obsessed with the pedal steel. Steel is a bit awkward because of the independence needed with all your limbs, PLUS the intonation thing. Still, it's pretty do-able, it seems to me, with work. I sounded reasonable "steelish"within minutes of sitting down behind it. (Not saying getting GOOD will be easy....trust me!)

Far and away, the toughest instrument I've tried.......and was forced to put down, by my suffering wife who normally never complains.......was the fiddle. There's just a steep learning curve before you make anything even resembling a pleasant sound.