Memories of the Sho-Bud shop in London

Hans Holzherr · Post by **Hans Holzherr** » 19 Aug 2007 1:15 am

Ken, the Hirschen reopened in 2002. It's interesting that you mention the Hirschen as the place where Peter Schild and I met you for the first time. I have no memory of that, but that's entirely possible $:\$ . I always thought that I had met you just once at my band's rehearsal room in Bern, where Peter Schild presented to you his two prototypes, an S-10 and an S-12. Can you help me with the year? Could it have been 1982?

Hans

Ken Byng · Post by **Ken Byng** » 19 Aug 2007 2:59 am

Hans
I met you at the Hirschen, and you told me about Peter's guitar and picked me up one day and took me to see the guitar. Unless I have that the wrong way round. Perhaps it was Peter who picked me up and you were already in Bern. It was a long time ago, and my memory is not what it was. I should have kept a diary throughout my life. I was hoping to see you at Grindelwald when I was playing there 4 years back, but the snow was too heavy for you to get through if you remember. I played at the Hirschen between 1981 and 1984, so that's as far as I can narrow down the period. How many pedal steel guitars has Peter made so far? The last guitar that you posted on here looked very impressive indeed.

While I was in Zurich one time with Rose Marie's band, I had the pleasure of being on the same bill as Tammy Wynette, Billie Jo Spears, Bill Monroe and other top name US artists. The was in the Hallen (correct spelling?) Stadium. Box Car Willie came into our dressing room and scrounged some cigarette papers from our guitar player. Bill Monroe followed Rose Marie, and we had to play 3 encores. Bill said to us as we came off stage "How the hell do we follow that". Well follow that he did, and absolutely brought the house down - he was incredible. Then, even better, the artists all came back to our hotel afterwards. I also played with John Brack at one festival. Wonderful times. The Swiss people are fantasticly hospitable.

John Roche · Post by **John Roche** » 19 Aug 2007 3:46 am

Anyone remember a guy that worked at Selmer his name was Wilkinson ,can't remember his first name, it may have been Dave, i think he was the manager

Jonathan Shacklock · Post by **Jonathan Shacklock** » 19 Aug 2007 3:56 am

I wouldn't want to see this thread get closed for going off topic (my fault as much as anyones) so can I suggest we only post with specific memories of the Sho-Bud shop in Denmark Street (or it's previous incarnation in Norbury). I'm still holding out hope for a photo or two...

Nick, I had assumed they just sold steel guitars. It sounds like they stocked other instruments - Tele's anyway - as well as records (such as Archies) and presumably accessories.

Sorry, no reflection on any of the fascinating stories here.

Jonathan Shacklock · Post by **Jonathan Shacklock** » 19 Aug 2007 4:03 am

John, you've got mail.

John Roche · Post by **John Roche** » 19 Aug 2007 4:20 am

Jon it was Rose Morris not Selmar where he worked

Micky Byrne · Post by **Micky Byrne** » 19 Aug 2007 5:44 am

Hi Ken, sorry to hear about Martin the manager in Zurich. I remember all the staff too, and remember the night we arrived and the night guy saying to us "You want drugs, Women, I get for you" lol....yes sure was a red light district. Sorry for mispelling it as Jeff instead of Jess Hudson. Also didn't realise it was Clem Cattini that night in the Traveler's rest on drums. I wasn't too sure on the bass player either.....memories going, your's is better than mine. Thanks for showing John that intro to Welephant walk...I remember it to this day

I'm sure some forumites may dig up that LP and ask for the tab now. All over to you then??

Sorry if we've gone off the subject of the Sho-Bud shop, but I think it's been quite well covered now

Cheers,
Micky

Micky Byrne United kingdom

Micky Byrne · Post by **Micky Byrne** » 19 Aug 2007 5:51 am

Hi John, Dave Wilkinson was for a brief period lead singer I believe for "The Gentry" 70's Country band before Alf Stillman who went on to run a pub....I believe the band was originally called the Crays or Krays, but I may be wrong as usual

Micky Byrne United kingdom

Micky Byrne · Post by **Micky Byrne** » 19 Aug 2007 6:02 am

Jonathan, The Norbury shop was just as well stocked as the later Sho-Bud shop. They originally had the infinite raise/lower, rack/barrel 'Buds, like the "Professional" then onto the newer ones. I remember trying one of the 1st S-12's with the nylon tuners 2 raise/1 lower in Blonde. later I of course got mine from Denmark street in blue. I agree with Ken Byng on the price war of the 2 main outlets for steel at that time. In 1977 I only paid £995 for my S-12 3 and 5 'Bud with a part X of £500 on my ZB.

Micky Byrne United Kingdom

John Roche · Post by **John Roche** » 19 Aug 2007 6:22 am

Hi Micky, Dave also was a very good song writer along with two other guys from the Reading area,in 1973 i was with a non country band at the time from Wantage called Taurus
and we recorded four or five of their songs at Guy Fletcher's studio somewhere near Reading, one of the songs was about Christine Keeler called Woman of Fortune, the producer was a chap called Rod Mcqueen
who co wrote Beautiful Sunday. I think it would have been quite unusual to have a steel guitar on songs aimed at the pop market in 1973..Happy memories never the less

Tony Smart · Post by **Tony Smart** » 19 Aug 2007 1:20 pm

Hans,
I played at the Nashville Sun - Zurich, in about 1980 with a band called Country Shack.(Bob Haskell and Dave Hartley played steel after me with the band)

Was this the place with the model railway running around the bar delivering drinks?
Can't remember for sure.

Bought my Korg Tuner ( the big one ) from the Sho-Bud shop. It's still going strong and I have to say I prefer it to the newer ones. Pity it's so big.

Alan Brookes · Post by **Alan Brookes** » 19 Aug 2007 4:06 pm

In all the time I lived in England, from 1945 till 1980, I never saw one pedal steel guitar in a music store.

During the 60s it was a matter of, "If you want to play one, build it youself."

I built plenty of lap steels, and even a D12 console steel, but without a machine shop I wasn't able to put pedals on.

I tried once, using wood, but it was pretty crude and the wood kept warping.

I wasn't able to get my hands on a pedal steel until the 90s, after I'd moved to California.

Things must be improving over there !

Sean Doherty · Post by **Sean Doherty** » 19 Aug 2007 11:53 pm

Yes John the shop in Denmark street is called "Wunjo" and is quite good for London. You can get some good deals there I bought my Resonator guitar there last year for a good price.
As for the Emmons yes I saw that there early this year and was at the time considering buying a twin kneck steel. I was suprised at the price and did say to Brian the owner that it seemed to me well over priced. He asked me to make an offer for it as he was selling it for somebody else. I had no idea what it was worth except not as much as that and secondly I have played Emmons guitars before and not really liked the sound.
I guess it is still sitting there in Denmark Street but a £1000 cheaper.

As for the "Steel Mill" at Maidstone Eric is still there I was in the shop last year. He has his steel set up in the shop so still a connection with the pedal steel around the place.

Sean

nick allen · Post by **nick allen** » 20 Aug 2007 12:08 am

Jonathan, my recollection (as open to doubt as anyone else's!) is that the ShoBud shop was or became a kind of "country" shop... I seem to recall seeing Teles and some Gretsches in there, maybe a few acoustics, I'm not sure - but definitely with a country orientation.
Nick

Paul Frank Bloomfield · Post by **Paul Frank Bloomfield** » 20 Aug 2007 1:56 am

This thread has brought back some good memories,like
swapping my '54 Les Paul Black beauty for my first
pedal steel, a Rose Morris 8 string 4 pedal job,think
I might have lost out there !! As I lived in Swansea
a trip to London was a long haul so I never really had much to do with the music shops there, it was'nt until I found Eric's shop in Maidstone that I started
the once a month trip up to visit( ironically I was
born in Tunbridge Wells about seventeen miles from
Maidstone ). I also remember going down to Southampton to see Maurice Anderson on a Saturday, our Ken Byng put the show together and it was quite
something !
As previously stated Eric has his steel set up in the
shop,and had a couple of Emmons upstairs when I was
there last year,I believe he was starting to sell them again.
All the best from sunny,hot Corfu
Frank Bloomfield

Barry Gaskell · Post by **Barry Gaskell** » 20 Aug 2007 3:26 am

Hi guys
My first guitar was a Denley and the second was a Fender 400 from a London shop called (I think) 'Take four' in Shaftesbury Avenue. My ZB was of course from good old Eric in Maidstone. I'm deperately trying to remember the name of his trusty secretary with the gravelly voice, (was it Eileen ?) She was always pleased to hear from you. My Sho-Bud Pro III custom was traded from Music Ground, (in, I think at that time, York)
The guy who dealt with them was John Brady. I remember seeing one of the last ZBs there, a pinkish colour, without the V headstock and very compact. They had quite a few steels in. That would be around '78.
That's if I remember right, If not, I'm the queen Of Sheba and there are no dry cleaners in Peru. ???
P.S. Anybody got an RV3 going reasonably cheap, Uk or Stateside. ?
Barry

Paul Frank Bloomfield · Post by **Paul Frank Bloomfield** » 20 Aug 2007 6:22 am

Barry is correct,it was Eileen ( I think her surname
was Budnikas or something like that )and she had a great sense of humour I still have some of the letters she sent to me on behalf of Eric when I was
selling the odd steel in Wales for him, sadly she died a few years ago, she was a great lady.
Frank Bloomfield, Corfu

Sean Doherty · Post by **Sean Doherty** » 20 Aug 2007 8:42 am

I know we are straying of Charing cross road but I bought my first steel from Erics when he was in the Broadway in Maidstone it was a red Denley which was steels that Gordon Huntley co built designed with sombody Dennis I think. I then tradfed it at Erics for a a bright blue ZB student before moving up to a ZB single on a double neck. I also remember his secretary as well.

Sean

Micky Byrne · Post by **Micky Byrne** » 23 Aug 2007 6:18 am

Hi Sean, Nigel Dennis is the name you're thinking of. I remember well the days I backed your dad Al, did some good shows. Last time was when we were headed off to Cornwall. We got as far as Clapton Common, and his Transit van died on us

....good days.

Micky Byrne United Kingdom

Sean Doherty · Post by **Sean Doherty** » 23 Aug 2007 8:45 am

You have such an amazing recall for names yes you are correct. Must have been one of the first British built pedal steels, no doubt you know of earlier ones!!

Have a D10 Carter now arrived 2 weeks ago and is excelent

Those old Transits they did have a habit of comking out in those days. Oh I guess you were on your way to the Cornwall circuit

Sean

Ken Byng · Post by **Ken Byng** » 17 Sep 2007 11:36 am

I have just spoken to Ron Mawn on the telephone. Bad news - John Edmed passed away last December. John suffered from a severe stroke some 2 years earlier, and tragically never regained the ability to play again.

Ron also reminded me that the co-owner of the busines was Les Elcome. Les was never into steel guitar, and John was the driving force behind the ShoBud shop. Ron and I have just been reminiscing about the old days, Reece Anderson, Scotty et al.

Ron said that John Edmed used to practice steel for 8 hours a day in the shop. No wonder he made great progress even though he was a relatively late starter.

Micky Byrne · Post by **Micky Byrne** » 17 Sep 2007 1:36 pm

Ken, I have just read this. I'm so sorry to hear about John Edmed. I knew about the stroke, but never realised the severity. He was an amazing guitarist. We only chatted about this last week when I met you in "Ranks" club, and as you said, he went on to be a great steel player in a very short time. Like yourself John was responsible for getting us on to Sho-Bud guitars. I will always remember his sence of humour in the shop. Thanks also for reminding us about "Les" the name we'd forgotten. Little late now but I'll still say....May John R.I.P.

Micky Byrne United Kingdom www.mickybyrne.com

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 17 Sep 2007 2:52 pm

Hi, you guys!

For John Roche:

There was Tom and Dave Wilkinson - both were in the music retail business, and I believe that Tom was/is a drummer. I last saw Tom on one of my infrequent returns to London where he was working in Denmark Street - still selling guitars! Interestingly for me, Terry Dene was in the same shop - I played with Terry in 1960 on his third comeback.... (pretty good singer, despite his reputation for unreliability).

My early days in the West End were fantastic! It seemed to me that every shop-assistant was a pretty good player AND a real character as well - of course, I was pretty impressionable in 1958! By 1960, Micky Borer (GREAT guitar-player with Cliff Bennett & the Rebel Rousers) was working in Lew Davis on Charing Cross Road, along with veteran guitarist and all-around good guy Peter Dyke, and ex big band drummer, Jimmy Frost.

Later that year, all three of them moved to Jim Marshall's shop in Hanwell Broadway, W7 - right next door to the trolleybus depot. I took my meagre custom to them in West London from then on, just when my fortunes were improving. Jim M. sold me a new Gibson J-200 and a 1958 Super 400.... Jim also built my singer (pop-star Eden Kane) a small p.a. system (a 50 watt amp and two 2X12" speaker cabinets) and asked us to road test the rig. He made a pretty big name for himself building his world-famous Marshall guitar amps shortly after that..... (THERE's a rig I wish we'd kept!)

Sorry I've hijacked the thread - it's too evocative a subject for me and I couldn't resist.

My best regards go to Ron Mawn who was invaluable to me 20 years later when I'd break knee levers on my Pro-111, as well as a few emergency repairs on my ZBs. I'm sad to learn of John Edmed's passing, and that of dear Eileen in Eric's Maidstone store - she was a real pal to me.

Great days, and I still have copies of all those hire-purchase agreements.....

RR

Roger Rettig · Post by **Roger Rettig** » 18 Sep 2007 5:32 am

For John Roche (again!)

What ZB did you buy from Vic Collins? He bought my maroon single-neck from Eric Snowball when I traded it for a new ZB D-10; I wondered if the maroon guitar was the one you acquired.

RR

Ken Byng · Post by **Ken Byng** » 5 Jan 2008 10:10 am

I have just spent an interesting couple of hours with Ron Mawn who worked at the ShoBud shop for a number of years. He has loaned me a photo album with some incredible shots taken from that period around the mid 70's.

Here is a shot taken inside the shop - from left to right, a youthful Lloyd Green, Ron Mawn and Les Elcome who was the shop's co-owner.

A selection of stock on the showroom floor

The sadly late departed John Edmed with Lloyd (note John's special SuperPro with abelone inlay)

Ron Mawn with 70's LDG with rope inlay. Note the Mr Ripoff T-shirt - that was the name of the company in Norbury prior to their move to Denmark Street in London.

I have some other interesting photos that I will put in this section separately.