How Many Players Finance Steel Guitars? Worth it?

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 21 Jul 2007 4:49 pm

This is an odd topic, but I'm wondering (in general) what financial methods are used when buying steels. Seeing that many steels are in the $3,000 range, unless you have a lot of disposable income you would have to consider using a credit card or getting a small bank loan. The reason why i'm asking this question is because I really need another steel - and I'm trying to work out whether or not a "loan + plus interest" is a good idea. Like most people, I have bills and debts that keep me on my toes financially, so it's hard to put my hands on a big chunk of money at any given time. But the "loan + interest" option makes me question whether or not I really need another steel. I'm just gigging a lot and getting sick of breaking down and putting together the one I have, as well as being without a steel when my only one is set up on a multiple- night engagement. I'm trying to weigh out the cost of the steel against the advancement of my playing. For example, I have the second of a two-night gig tonight, and I was home all day and wanting to practice. No steel. It's driving me crazy. But do I really want another monthly payment on top of everything else? The bank is just waiting for me to make a decision. The loan is available to me, and I can handle another small payment. But should I just save instead for another year or so, and sacrifice my practice time until then?

I certainly don't expect anyone to disclose their personal business here, but I would appreciate some general thoughts, experience or advice on this matter. Thanks.

Larry Strawn · Post by **Larry Strawn** » 21 Jul 2007 5:13 pm

Chris,
I believe it all boils down to what you want to do!

If it was me, and this is just my opinion if I really wanted it for what ever reason I could think of, and the added small payment wouldn't hurt to bad the interest on the loan wouldn't bother me any at all.

If I was in your position giging as much as you are, I think I'd go for the extra guitar and make the pmts. JMO.

Larry

John Poston · Post by **John Poston** » 21 Jul 2007 5:14 pm

It's tough to weigh the cost/benefit of a second steel against the hassle of constant break down, set up and transport. It gets worse if you live on the 3rd floor like I used to.

I know a lot of people, full time pros included, who keep a second student model around, either to keep always set up for staying in practice, or for easy travel gigs. There are several options under a grand, especially used. Of course, you might be more limited in knee levers, but it might be enough to just stay on top of things.

Just something to consider if money is tight.

Jerry H. Moore · Post by **Jerry H. Moore** » 21 Jul 2007 5:15 pm

Me and the credit union owns mine. I financed it and it is paying for itself by working every Sat. night. If you can finance it and afford the payments I say do it. Why do without something you need? If they'll finance it for 30 years then do it. Here's my policy: I'm 53 years old and who's gonna care in another 30 years if I paid off my steel guitar! ...I know that's exaggerated but really, you know whether or not to go in debt............or do we???? Life's too short to worry about the little things. Send pictures when you get it.

Darvin Willhoite · Post by **Darvin Willhoite** » 21 Jul 2007 5:16 pm

Around 1972, I financed a D10 steel with a bank loan and it was only $500. Of course you could buy a pretty good car in those days for $500, and I was only making $1.20 per hour on a part time job and going to college.

The Lord has been really good to me since then, I've been able to pay cash for all my musical equipment. But, I make a living as a Mechanical Engineer not a musician, I only play for the fun of it.

In my opinion, there is nothing wrong with financing something you really want or need, as long as you can make the payments.

Terry Kinnear · Post by **Terry Kinnear** » 21 Jul 2007 5:18 pm

Hi Chris, On may 1st .I ordered a New Mullen G2.I took out a credit union loan,for 5000.oo . My monthly payment is only 115.oo . not bad, i play 2 gigs, a month to pay for it.It helps if you get wife a second job and a paper route.ps my wife is very grumpy at 4 in the morning. Im 52 years old ,i thought, i better get it before,i retire.I have an old early shobud Pro1,i bought back in the early 70.great guitar,but getting worn out Terry in Pa. [Steel Wondering ]

Lee Baucum · Post by **Lee Baucum** » 21 Jul 2007 5:20 pm

Just don't finance it with a 20% interest credit card.

Dennis Coelho · Post by **Dennis Coelho** » 21 Jul 2007 5:25 pm

Interesting topic. What follows is just my own take on how to deal with this. I know others will have different opinions.

There a few things you can say right off for certain: do not buy anything with your credit card thinking that you will make minimum payments. In most cases you will end up paying for the thing four or five times. Credit cards are only useful if you know you can pay it off completely in thirty days with no finance charges. A bank or credit union loan is a much better way to go, and knowing that you have a specific amount of cash at your disposal can allow you to search for bargains or dicker a bit on the purchase.

My deal with my accountant (spouse) has always been ( 36 years) that I pay for instruments from gigs and lessons and instrument deals. With that in mind, I sometimes am allowed to take a household loan knowing that I have a gig coming up in the meantime to cover the amount. Sometimes, I have anticipated a household loan only to find that I get a couple of new students or an unanticipated gig and I don't need the loan. Works for me.

Good luck.

Dennis

Robert Harper · Post by **Robert Harper** » 21 Jul 2007 5:58 pm

Since it is just a hobby for me. I pay cash. If I made money from it, I might consider financing. However I have made it a policy to paay cash for hobbies or not have the hobby

Bill Moore · Post by **Bill Moore** » 21 Jul 2007 7:21 pm

At this point in my life, I'm almost 62 and retired, I would not borrow money to buy a steel guitar. That being said, I do own 4 guitars at the present time. The most recently acquired guitar is a BMI S-10, 3+4. I wanted a dependable, fairly lightweight guitar, one that would be handy to take to band rehearsals without having to do as much set-up. It usually stays in the case at home. It seems to be the perfect guitar for that purpose, and it sounds excellent. I would not hesitate to play this BMI at any gig. I have a little less than 900.00 invested in this guitar. There, I think, is the key point, you don’t need to invest 3000.00 in a second guitar. I think that a 1000.00 limit for a “convenience” guitar would be a better idea. Maybe you would not have to borrow anything, at least the loan would be less. Guitars in this price range might include MSA, BMI, the Carter, Zum, and GFI student models, maybe an older Sho-Bud, all S-10 guitars.

James Harrison · Post by **James Harrison** » 21 Jul 2007 7:26 pm

Chris, take a fools advice, don't finance anything that is not nessesary. Save the interest that you will pay the bank and save a little more and get a guitar that is good enough for practice. Then start saving for that second guitar that you really want. You know that if you can make payments that you can save that amount each month. I have seen times when buying on credit was the only way to get anything. I payed my last interest in 1975 and I have saved lots of money by paying cash for all purchases. I know some cannot do that and I have been there. You need that interest money more that the bank does. I hope I have not made anyone feel bad and I am not bragging I have just been lucky I guess. James

Scott Swartz · Post by **Scott Swartz** » 21 Jul 2007 9:18 pm

Setting up and breaking down is a pain, but do you really want to leave your steel, whether you own one or two, at the gig? Whether its two or five or however many nights?

I still have the gear I was using in the early 80s (ok ok and some newer stuff), I think because I know not to leave it unguarded, YMMV.

If you're on tour in a van its a lot harder and more hassle, but the small tours I have done the steel went into the hotel room with me.

A. J. Schobert · Post by **A. J. Schobert** » 21 Jul 2007 10:04 pm

I don't see how setting up and breaking down is tuff. If you leave your PSG in a club all alone don't be surprised to find it stolen! I would never leave my steel out of my sight, look how many steels have been stolen! True if someone wants it bad enough they will get it but I like to have some peace of mind.

I think alot of guys get small loans for musical instruments they may not want to admit it but I think they are out there and in large numbers.

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 21 Jul 2007 10:45 pm

Lots of great advice here, guys. Thanks a million. I just came back from a gig where it is nearly impossible to get my car anywhere near the club at 3am, and I need a steel tomorrow afternoon for a gig outside of town. The club doesn't open until 7pm tomorrow evening! This kind of stuff pops up all the time. So I may have to do what's necessary to get a second steel that is not only good for home practice but is gig-worthy as well. These days, it seems that most student models are gig-worthy anyway, so I'm leaning towards heeding the advice of those that say a cheaper S-10 for basic home practice and the odd gig is the way to go. I think my mindset on the $3,000 was to just get a good one and be done with it. (Shipping, taxes, etc. puts about $5-600 on top of the asking price for where I live, so a $2,300 guitar shipped from the US wil be close to $3,000). This time next year I'll be teaching university and my income will double, which makes it tempting to get a real nice one now. But the reality of putting down that kind of money right now for an additional steel makes the cheaper option a little more attractive. This is the type of mental pushing and pulling that led me to start this thread in the first place.

As far as my steel being stolen, fortunately I'm living in a place with a low crime rate. Hardly anything gets stolen from bars, and everyone's usually gone and the doors are locked before we leave anyway. I'm always there to pick it up just when the club is opening again, too. Not much public exposure to the gear while we're not around. But I'd never leave my steel in a bar that was still full.

Ken Byng · Post by **Ken Byng** » 22 Jul 2007 3:19 am

As a steel guitar salesman many years ago, I was encouraged to offer finance for players to purchase their steel guitars as the cost was prohibitive for most. The owner of the shop used to say to me that the finance company made more profit out of the deal than he did, especially if the loan was over 3 or 4 years.

The only person to pay cash for his pedal steel at the shop was John Paul Jones from Led Zep, and he could well afford it.

Stu Schulman · Post by **Stu Schulman** » 22 Jul 2007 3:24 am

Darvin,Great answer!

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 22 Jul 2007 4:00 am

I'm trying to weigh out the cost of the steel against the advancement of my playing.

The two are really unconnected. A day away from the instrument certainly won't hurt you, and you can always buy a cheap lap steel and work on just your playing technique. You can also just listen to recordings (which we do a lot better when we're not distracted by our own instrument) and try to work out new or different parts in your head.

It's fine to say you want another steel, and even just go and buy one. But need another steel, especially a $3,000 one? Do as you will, but if I were you, I'd start bringing your present steel home every night.

Billy Carr · Post by **Billy Carr** » 22 Jul 2007 4:29 am

Go for it. As long as your playing regularly and making money with it. Having two guitars is so much easier. Especially when you want to change strings or set around and just pick. It does make a difference in playing if you only play on weekends,as opposed to all during the week. Plus before you go to a gig, it gives you a chance to be loosen up and ready to play when you get there. Some folks spend money on hunting, fishing, traveling, etc. which is fine when they want to. So I don't see a problem with steel players spending on guitars. We only live once, so enjoy life and if that means more than one PSG, then so be it.

Rusty Walker · Post by **Rusty Walker** » 22 Jul 2007 5:05 am

Chris,there maybe something available in Halifax.You could pop over on the ferry and pick it up.Save U.S. shipping.When I was in St.Johns I bought a beautiful Ovation that someone had got,but really wanted an accordian.But however you do it,a 2nd steel is a must-at least in my mind.

Colby Tipton · Post by **Colby Tipton** » 22 Jul 2007 5:12 am

Chris,
I know you like Sho-Buds, you know you can't get a new Sho-Bud.
If you are going to stick with a single neck E9, buy you a Stage One to play for now and get you some new Coop parts for the Pro-I you have now.
That would be fairly cheap and you would have a good "Bud" to boot and the Stage One for a spare.

T. C. Furlong · Post by **T. C. Furlong** » 22 Jul 2007 5:25 am

Hi Chris,

My rule of finance is: Never Borrow Money On A Depreciating Asset. You are a Sho Bud fan and lately Sho Buds have been anything but depreciating. If I were you, I would wait and find a nice deal on a Sho Bud that is likely to increase in value from what you pay. That way, you may be able to recover any interest and maybe even some principle too.

And if you can't swing a payment, you could always sell a few more seal flipper pies to an unsuspecting gourmand in the lower 48.

TC

James Morehead · Post by **James Morehead** » 22 Jul 2007 6:44 am

Me, I like to avoid debt like the plague. I take my steel home every night, it's just part of the game to me. Leaving it at a gig is not really a question of "if" it will be stolen, but "when" it will be stolen. If you finance a second guitar, and your 'bud get's stolen, you'd still be down to only one guitar anyways--and now saddled with debt and stress. And then you would start bringing your second guitar home anyways, so IT doesn't get stolen! So you might as well just take your present guitar home and keep adding some Coop parts. You won't have the stress of paying off loans. But that's just me.

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 22 Jul 2007 6:49 am

I try to keep 2 steels that are exactly the same. One in the road case ready to head out the door and one set up for practice. If something screws up I have a backup handy and I don't need to adjust to a different guitar. The money can be a problem though. I'm putting the money together for another steel now. I am finally done with my credit card debt and no way are those guys getting there claws back in me so it may take a few months.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 22 Jul 2007 7:13 am

My advice is: Do not go into debt for a second pedal steel guitar. Look around for a deal on a used one, or a student model. Last year I was lucky enough to buy a 1974 Emmons S-10 for $850 and that is now my main pedal steel guitar. In fact, it's my Only pedal steel! (besides a Carter Starter that I use for teaching lessons). The Emmons appears in my avatar. Maybe you have an extra amp or guitar around that you could sell to raise some cash for a PSG?

As far as leaving your steel in a club... it's fine IF the club is secure. I left my old Emmons D-10 on the same stage for 5 years solid! We played there Wed-Sun for 5 years, and my steel guitar lived in one spot for all that time, no problems. Every night when we finished I would place the guitar's Case over the top of the instrument, with the lid of the case hanging down in the front of the steel. It looked like a big table on the stage. The club was in a brick building, very secure. So it depends on the situation IMHO. Nowadays I do all one-nighters, so my PSG comes home with me every night.

A well known PSG player once told me "the pedal steel is the Last thing a thief would take! It's heavy, no one knows how to play it, most people don't even know what it is. They would take the guitars, mic's, effects, the small stuff, maybe an amp, but a pedal steel? no way."

Chris LeDrew · Post by **Chris LeDrew** » 22 Jul 2007 7:32 am

Guys, this is helping quite a bit. I did think about Bob H.'s advice of getting two identical steels.....that makes sense to me. Another Pro 1 may be the answer. T.C. also had a good point about buying a guitar that will appreciate in value, thereby covering off the interest. Rusty, I am currently looking into a steel guitar for sale in the Halifax area, so it's a coincidence you brought this up. (By the way, people ask me all the time here if I remember you.

)

As much as I would like to bring my guitar home every night, the time setting up and tearing down is just not worth the hassle for me. I have a steep set of stairs that lead to my music room, and on top of that, I would spend the majority of my time going back and forth th the bar setting up the steel........it would be a nightmare for me. Many of the clubs I play here are on George St. (36 bars, one steeet), a road closed to traffic in the night time. I would have to haul a 50-pound pedal steel about 100 yards every night, and then bring it back again the next night. Just not practical. On one-nighters, though, I always take it home.

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