Would this be at all fun?
Moderator: Brad Bechtel
- Jeff Au Hoy
- Posts: 1716
- Joined: 11 Oct 2002 12:01 am
- Location: Honolulu, Hawai'i
Would this be at all fun?
So many of us non-peddlers nowadays have a means to record... I got to thinking (oh no, you say)... wouldn't it be fun if we were all given a common starting point (like a certain melody) and we each posted our individual creations? Maybe like, SUBJECT: One time through--COLD COLD HEART. Then everybody would post their own version of Cold Cold heart played once through. It would be really neat to hear all the individual styles over the same song.
Okay scratch that.
I think a specific melody might be too confining. There's a rainbow of genres represented by the players on this forum. How can we open this up a bit, yet still have a common starting point?
Maybe start with a given set of chord changes?
Scratch that, still too confining...
How could we structure such a project and have it be fun and inclusive of everybody?
On second thought... let's go back to the original idea. Maybe it would be interesting to start with a tune like "Cold Cold Heart". It would be neat to hear the Country Western folks do it. Then the Blues folks. Then the Hawaiian folks. Then the Jazzers. Then the Bluegrass folks. Then the different Rock stylists. Etcetera. All of these different styles over the same song. These are all broad classifications and I know most artists hate being categorized... but... am I sorta getting the idea across?
Okay scratch that.
I think a specific melody might be too confining. There's a rainbow of genres represented by the players on this forum. How can we open this up a bit, yet still have a common starting point?
Maybe start with a given set of chord changes?
Scratch that, still too confining...
How could we structure such a project and have it be fun and inclusive of everybody?
On second thought... let's go back to the original idea. Maybe it would be interesting to start with a tune like "Cold Cold Heart". It would be neat to hear the Country Western folks do it. Then the Blues folks. Then the Hawaiian folks. Then the Jazzers. Then the Bluegrass folks. Then the different Rock stylists. Etcetera. All of these different styles over the same song. These are all broad classifications and I know most artists hate being categorized... but... am I sorta getting the idea across?
- Fred Kinbom
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Jeff - great idea! Where can I listen to this song to familiarize myself with it?
All the best,
Fred
All the best,
Fred
www.fredrikkinbom.com - New lap steel album out now - listen here: fredrikkinbom.bandcamp.com/album/songs-for-lap-steel-and-harmonium
- Rick Alexander
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- Gerald Ross
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Mike Neer writes:
I disagree Mike. I think we should all use the same rhythm BIAB rhythm track (with the Coyote Dxi sampled sounds and the real drums - in the newest BIAB version). This way everyone has the same basis to work from and we can hear the differences in steel styles and how each of us work off a standard rhythm. Sort of like a "control" in a lab experiment.It's hard for me to get past canned tracks, like BIAB. I'd rather hear just an acoustic rhythm guitar.
Gerald Ross
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'
A UkeTone Recording Artist
CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'
A UkeTone Recording Artist
CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website
- Jeff Au Hoy
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- Gerald Ross
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The question is what are we hoping to see/hear?
If we allow different backup arrangements, some will be full blown multi-instrumental and others will be sparse with perhaps a single guitar strumming chords. Using this approach we will hear the musician's arranging and steel guitar skills.
If we use the BIAB approach we will hear how each musician responds to the same rhythm and chord changes.
One is not better than the other. It's just a different headset and set of expectations.
If we allow different backup arrangements, some will be full blown multi-instrumental and others will be sparse with perhaps a single guitar strumming chords. Using this approach we will hear the musician's arranging and steel guitar skills.
If we use the BIAB approach we will hear how each musician responds to the same rhythm and chord changes.
One is not better than the other. It's just a different headset and set of expectations.
Gerald Ross
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'
A UkeTone Recording Artist
CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'
A UkeTone Recording Artist
CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website
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- Gerald Ross
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Not really. What I picture is the BIAB backup track would be converted to an MP3 or WAV for download.
You then use this as a single track on your recording.
And with BIAB we could have all 12 keys available as a download. It would take seconds to generate these.
The question then is... what style? Swing, Country, Rock?
You then use this as a single track on your recording.
And with BIAB we could have all 12 keys available as a download. It would take seconds to generate these.
The question then is... what style? Swing, Country, Rock?
Last edited by Gerald Ross on 21 Jun 2007 9:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
Gerald Ross
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'
A UkeTone Recording Artist
CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'
A UkeTone Recording Artist
CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website
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- Location: Burtonsville, Maryland, USA
Great idea, Jeff!
I would rather see this take place without the BIAB element being required.
The way I would envision it would be someone would post a link to the source song so everyone has the same starting point as a reference, and then just let everyone have at it in their own way.
The results would be much more interesting to me and give a better insight into the individual musician's style.
Also, if someone wanted to set up a BIAB track to share with others, no problem. Just don't make it required.
I would rather see this take place without the BIAB element being required.
The way I would envision it would be someone would post a link to the source song so everyone has the same starting point as a reference, and then just let everyone have at it in their own way.
The results would be much more interesting to me and give a better insight into the individual musician's style.
Also, if someone wanted to set up a BIAB track to share with others, no problem. Just don't make it required.
- Michael Papenburg
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- Ray Montee
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GREAT IDEA there Jeff!
George "Keoki" Lake from north of the Arctic Circle, used to do a round robin type of sharing program.' It was simple and nice. We merely played our choice of songs onto an audio cassette that Keoki provided. There was a list of participants included and when we finished our contribution, we'd simply package the cassettes and send them off to the next person on the list. Half of the fun was wrapping up the little package.
George, why don't you come on in here and tell us more as I've forgotten why there were so many cassettes in each package.
Fun idea Jeff Au Hoy, if'n you don't make it too complicated, equipment-wise.
George, why don't you come on in here and tell us more as I've forgotten why there were so many cassettes in each package.
Fun idea Jeff Au Hoy, if'n you don't make it too complicated, equipment-wise.
- Jude Reinhardt
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- Location: Weaverville, NC
Sound like fun, but when I play it's just me and the instrument. I admit that good backup would make me sound better, yeah, put Asleep At The Wheel behind me and I'll single note Cold Cold Heart. Bet I'd sound good. I'd rather just hear someone play their instrument. Solo, alone, got the blues, so lonesome I could cry, just me and my guitar expressing myself.
Jude - Who's report card always said "Jude doesn't play well with others".
Jude - Who's report card always said "Jude doesn't play well with others".
"If we live in fear of banjos, then the banjos have won".
"Man cannot live by bread alone, he must have Peanut Butter". - Kruger Bear
"Man cannot live by bread alone, he must have Peanut Butter". - Kruger Bear
- Nathan Golub
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- Location: Durham, NC
Would it be possible for those of us who play in more than one style or who have more than one guitar, to post several variations ?
Why "Cold Cold Heart" Jeff, why not a "standard" or well know Hawaiian tune/song.?
we may even end up with a project CD like Bruce Clarke's "War Chants Galore"
Why "Cold Cold Heart" Jeff, why not a "standard" or well know Hawaiian tune/song.?
we may even end up with a project CD like Bruce Clarke's "War Chants Galore"
-
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- Location: California, USA
I think this is a very exciting idea. The tunes could be solo, BIAB backup, ryhthm guitar, etc. The more options, the more participants! Unless it would create copyright problems, could it be arranged where the original poster could provide an .mp3 of an old recording of the song as well? (and chord charts for lesser experienced of us?) That way, everyone who wanted to could reply with their recording. I guess it would just take someone to start us off with:
1. an .mp3 of the song (not sure about copyright issues, or which version. Just whatever version inspires you)
2. chords
3. their recording of it
1. an .mp3 of the song (not sure about copyright issues, or which version. Just whatever version inspires you)
2. chords
3. their recording of it
-
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I'm new here and new at playing steel, but I think this would be a lot of fun and good for learning too, and I have some thoughts on it. Wouldn't an ideal control be a song that no one's heard before, and either in tab format (or in a midi sound file) so that everyone starts with just the unembellished notes and then adds his (or her) style to it?
I had a lot of fun learning a song from the back of the JB instruction book, that isn't on the recording, and coming up with some ideas on how to bring it to life. The song is "Hawaiian Love". I haven't seen it listed in any of the albums I've seen on line.
Another idea would be -- maybe some people have songs they've written that noone's heard. They could be submitted and one could be chosen.
I had a lot of fun learning a song from the back of the JB instruction book, that isn't on the recording, and coming up with some ideas on how to bring it to life. The song is "Hawaiian Love". I haven't seen it listed in any of the albums I've seen on line.
Another idea would be -- maybe some people have songs they've written that noone's heard. They could be submitted and one could be chosen.
- Alan Brookes
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- Location: Brummy living in Southern California
To get some sort of co-ordination you could specify a key and a tempo, and then string them all together into one long recording.
I remember many years ago, when one song used to be covered by many artists, Frank Sinatra, Dean Martin, Guy Mitchell and Perry Como all recorded the same song with the same tempo in the same key, and one of the disc jockeys on Radio Luxembourg synchronised them all together singing at the same time. It was a long time ago now, but I seem to remember the number was called "Man on Fire", or something like that.
I remember many years ago, when one song used to be covered by many artists, Frank Sinatra, Dean Martin, Guy Mitchell and Perry Como all recorded the same song with the same tempo in the same key, and one of the disc jockeys on Radio Luxembourg synchronised them all together singing at the same time. It was a long time ago now, but I seem to remember the number was called "Man on Fire", or something like that.
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Definately Country and Classic Hank Williams
Cold Cold Heart is built in to all USA built Steel Guitars, you just need to dig around a bit for the notes
Cold Cold Heart is built in to all USA built Steel Guitars, you just need to dig around a bit for the notes
Last edited by Frank Lombard on 22 Jun 2007 8:06 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Alan Brookes
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- Location: Brummy living in Southern California
Absolutely ! My PSG refuses to play in tune unless I play Cold, Cold Heart at least once a session !Frank Lombard wrote:...Cold Cold Heart is built in to all USA built Steel Guitars, you just need to dig around a bit for the notes
Of course, it also insists on me playing "Harbor Lights" if I want to get the C6 neck to co-operate.
- Don Kona Woods
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Jeff, I like your creative mind.
Jeff says
This being the case you would just let everybody do their own thing (or as Rick would say, thang), backup and all, and even give the choice of straying from the melody, since you want to evaluate different creative styles.
Gerald’s idea seems to be having a different approach. He says;
How can an MP3 copy of chords be a violation of copyright? Plus this is an educational exercise, isn't it? No violation for educational purposes.
Aloha,
Don
Jeff says
If you want only to look at individual creations with different styles then the song, COLD, COLD HEART would be the constant and style would be the variable to be tested.I had it in mind that the control in this experiment would actually be the song itself.
This being the case you would just let everybody do their own thing (or as Rick would say, thang), backup and all, and even give the choice of straying from the melody, since you want to evaluate different creative styles.
Gerald’s idea seems to be having a different approach. He says;
It sounds like he wants to test the differences in sound of each steel guitarist. Here the constant would be the backup, and the variable is steel playing. So his idea of BIAB would fit.hear the differences in steel styles (sounds?) and how each of us works off a standard rhythm.
How can an MP3 copy of chords be a violation of copyright? Plus this is an educational exercise, isn't it? No violation for educational purposes.
Aloha,
Don