...about that 'Pass and Play' idea...

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

(moderator) Brad briefly entertained the thot that someone brought up recently, concerning the possibilities of an in-house multi user-review of (primarily home-made) new steels, via the USPS/?shippers?.

The idea being: member/builder/seller ships their new baby off to the first SGF reviewer, who then ships to the next..., while posting their opinions til it runs it's course, and the guitar returns to it's originator, or buyer.
Possibly, all in concert with the Brad (1st reviewer?) to keep things tidy, announce new items, etc.

The original idea sounded full of merit, but few chimed in about it.
We seem to have a bunch of hot shot craftsmen aboard, and many more whom could use the 'hands on' help to improve their guitars thru this kind of interaction.

What's the real consensus of the lap steel crowd of today?
Do we have enuf interested parties to support and sustain such a venture?

There should be some new and interesting steel creatures coming out of Oahu's Northe shore in due time, and I'm sure the builders would be up to contributing, if their are enuf gamers.

How 'bout it?

Tom Pettingill · From: California, USA (deceased)

Interesting idea, I like it.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Well Tom, with the (as expected) underwhelming response from the current comatose SGF lap crowd, I guess we can file this idea in the can.

Rick Aiello · From: Berryville, VA USA

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

My 'problem', Rick, is like many others whom I've heard expressing dissatisfaction with the steadily devolving state of this Borum.

I merely picked up on a past proposal that I found interesting and cast it out again to see if there were any hungry fish.

Was that anywhere near as cheap as the talk your engaging in?
For an intelligent person as yourself who has 'claimed' in the past to dislike arguments, I'd have thot you'd have something more constructive to contribute to this post.
My bad. Expectations met!

Thanx for sticking up for SGF members, tho.

Jeff Au Hoy · From: Honolulu, Hawai'i

Okay I'm awake. They confused my meds again. I know I wouldn't be able to handle it. You know... potato chip oil stains on the fretboard... filings stuck to the pole pieces from steel wooling the rust off the strings.

Rick Aiello · From: Berryville, VA USA

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Get some thicker skin, dude!

Rick Aiello · From: Berryville, VA USA

Bugger off ...

Don Kona Woods · From: Hawaiian Kama'aina

Hi Ron,

The whole idea has merit but it would rest with a limited number of people being interested so that may be the response problem. There may be a lot of us groupies that would like to hear some of the discussion, but would not have the technical expertise to contribute.

I do understand your frustrations with a lack of responsivness from SGF members to postings. Have you ever noticed how many people check postings out but never participate. I think it is time for some people who read to come out of the woodwork and participate. We need some new ideas. But it takes a little courage, which some may not have for one reason or another, because a person's contributions could be critized.

Perhaps we could be a little more tactful in how we express our feelings, so that sensitive people are not offended. Know what I mean?

Aloha, Smile

Don

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Wow, watch the view meter roll now!

I guess some members really do have an interest in this thread after all!

Matt Johnson · From: California, USA

Brad Bechtel · From: San Francisco, CA

Gentlemen, please behave.

I didn't suggest that idea, Ron, and I wouldn't recommend it myself. I think it would be a pretty expensive way to do such a comparison. For example, it cost me $50.00 USD to ship the Rondo lap steel back to them in the same boxes they shipped to me originally.

Last month the SF Dobro Club meeting was at my house. I brought out some of my lap steels and played them through my Fender Pro Junior, just as a simple comparison. I think if we had a get together such as you describe, it would have to be a local situation, not cross country or international, unless someone can foot the bill for all that shipping.
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A web site devoted to acoustic & electric lap steel guitars

Colin Alder · From: Santa Cruz, California, USA

OK, I'm into this idea. I've already spoken to a few people about it, both on and off the Forum. Just email me your interest in an eight or a six string. I'll be sending out an eight in about a month. I have orders that I am finishing first---then the CruzTone roadtrip. Cool

Colin Alder · From: Santa Cruz, California, USA

Andy Volk · From: Boston, MA

Re the round-robin guitar review ....I did this with a Georgeboards guitar a few years back. Like Brad, it cost me a lot to ship it to the next reviewer and frankly, I was worried the whole time I had it that I'd accidently dent or scratch it. A group review or an (insured) in-store review is the way to go IMHO.

Re condeming the forumites for not embracing your idea .... after about ten years online, a lot of the topics that confounded people for years prior to the internet have now been covered by the forum in great, sometimes exhaustive detail. Nonetheless, it's still the first and last thing I look at on the web every day. It's only as boring as you make it. Pouting if folks don't emrace your ideas isn't gonna mkae anyone change their mind.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

I've yet to find the recent thread that included the original idea. It wasn't MY idea, I just thot it to be a good one and was testing the waters. At this stage of the SGF's existance I could care less if no one chooses to post per my topics. I simply put 'em out, and if someone wishes to make a head on out of a fender bender, I'm cool with it.
With well over 100 views as of this morning (Hawaii time), and only Tom's input, it seemed as doomed as the originator's post.
Thanx to Rick's fine input, we got us a bunch of rubber neckers, so maybe it'll kick in some new life and indeed get a positive discussion going.

I certainly stand by my (and others) assertion that the SGF has become much less relevant the last year or more. Maybe all the good stuff has been hashed over enuf, but when something interesting does pop up and immediately sinks, while many worthless threads thrive, it certainly does invoke frustration.

Return to topic:
I understood the logistical and $ problems inherent to the idea, but there are plenty of members who could handle the monetary part, which leaves it up to the amount of interested parties that wanted to sit in the game.
I have some things (on the drawing board) and the shipping would be significantly less than for most, so I could handle the cash end to start it up for my own projects. Ain't nobody on this forum more broke than me, and yet I'm willing to pony up, so I figgered others might be as well.
To keep it local would be much less sexy, but reviews are what it's mostly about, so that might be a second best thot. I don't need to send my stuff around the world, I have plenty of playing friends nearby to get the word out.

Bill Creller · From: Saginaw, Michigan, USA (deceased)

HEY, I've got it! We need a "steel without pedals" convention!! Everybody bring your home-made, And your other lap steels. Everyone can try everything in the joint! Very Happy

Then we will have lots to talk about 'til the next convention!! Very Happy

Jeff, you need to go buy a power sander. It's a lot quicker than steel wool and 30 grit sand paper Very Happy

You can go from semi-flat to "just plain flat" in less than a minute!! Very Happy

Regards BILL

Gerald Ross · From: Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA

Here's the problem:

1. It costs a lot to ship these instruments around the country.

2. Damage, theft, loss and people "forgetting" to pass the instruments to the next reviewer.

3. Ditto on Jeff's posting above... some people treat instruments with kid gloves. Other people think that cigarette burns on the headstock of Telecaster look real cool.

Here's the answer - elaborating on Bill Creller's:
1. All the builders attend the 2007 HSGA Joliet convention this October and set up tables with their wares.

2. All the members of the SGF and the HSGA forum attend. Everyone will be able to try out the latest offerings as well as try out a fellow member's vintage steel that they've only read about or seen pictures of.

3. Everybody becomes friends, and everybody get's first hand experience with the instruments with none of the problems listed.
_________________
Gerald Ross
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'

A UkeTone Recording Artist

CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website

Howard Tate · From: Leesville, Louisiana, USA, R.I.P.

Maybe I'm selfish, but while anyone is more then welcome to play any of my guitars, the thought of having any of them out of my reach really bothers me. If one of them was gone, I'm sure that would be the one I was itching to play. It sure would be nice to play other folks guitars tho. Rolling Eyes

As I said, maybe I'm just selfish.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

While the local review/convention thing is cool for those who can make the date/place, it obviously will exclude many more whom would be into the original idea.

Since there seems to be a bit of interest from a few and some of the heavier hitters, let me expound on the P&P, while those who wish to promote the local show aspect can continue. All the best!

Costs can be incured by each sender, thus spreading it out evenly (USPS Express Mail - 12 lbs. = $50, 2 days w/insurance/tracking and $ back guaranty) and monitored extensively on the forum to keep everyone honest, careful and prompt, as well as maintain a log of it's post/pre travel itenerary, condition, etc. and keeping forumites appraised of each user's review, which is the main point.

I suggested Brad be the first reviewer, as he seemed interested in such, as with the Rondo, but maybe the $s is a hinderance, and to help in keeping it totally up front and promoted. Brad's interest and inclusion in some manner would be of great help, whether he reviews or not.
To be a success instead of a disaster, a complete vigil must be maintained to keep all participants on their toes.

I'll have more to add to the thot factory and hopefully others will too, to iron out any wrinkles and make this thing a go, if there is enuf interest.

I'll also gladly extend my hand to Rick Aiello and all others, if needed, to put any grumblings in the past and get along with enjoying the medium we have here and hopefully be inclusive, if willing and able, to this endevour.

Gerald Ross · From: Ann Arbor, Michigan, USA

Good luck with this project.

But IMHO, somebody's gonna end up crying.
_________________
Gerald Ross
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'

A UkeTone Recording Artist

CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Hawaiian Steel Guitar/Ukulele Website

Rick Alexander · From: Florida, USA, R.I.P.

Sounds like a blueprint for disaster.
There are multiple opportunities for something to go wrong, and inevitably something would.

Ron Whitfield · From: Kaaawa, Hawaii, USA

Too true, guy's, that's why it'd have to be greatly monitored on the forum, but we'll see if the interest can overcome these pitfalls.

Brad Bechtel · From: San Francisco, CA

I think the idea of a comparison is a very good one, but I think this type of comparison is going to have to be done locally rather than nationally or internationally.

Quite honestly, Ron, I don't have much of an interest in spending the amount of money needed to move these guitars around the world, just to be able to play a lap steel for a short period of time.

I'd rather spend my money on other things at this point in my life.

I could see a bunch of people getting together at someone's house and playing their lap steels, something similar to the SF Dobro Club here in the SF Bay Area, but with lap steels.

Probably the best opportunity to do this sort of comparison would be at the HSGA convention in Joliet, IL, or the International Steel Guitar Convention in St. Louis, MO.
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A web site devoted to acoustic & electric lap steel guitars

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