Newbie seeking guidance

John Pape · Post by **John Pape** » 8 May 2007 6:48 am

Hi All
I'm new here and looking to get my first PSG. I'm trying to make the decision between a used pro model such as an old school MSA or a new economy model.. Probably tending to something better than a Carter Starter; possibly a Stage One , a Blackjack or a BSG s-10. Don't want to spend a lot on something I've only played once so far(for about 45 minutes) Top end of budget around 1200 + shipping. Any feel as to how to go ? I've gotten the impression that I'd be unhappy with the Carter Starter after a short time and that I should avoid old Mavericks.
I do want to get started while I still have the fire of something new. I'm open on formats... am considering a S12 universal as well as S-10.. D-10 seems like would push cost up and best to wait on one until I've found out that I'm gonna stick with it.
Thanks in advance for any advice!

John

Bob Hoffnar · Post by **Bob Hoffnar** » 8 May 2007 7:08 am

John,
Where in NY are you ? It may be good to meet some steel players and sit behind a couple steels to see what suits you. The Carter Starter is a decent little guitar that just may suit your needs for the time being. Used steels if not set up right can be a real nightmare. If they are in good shape you may get lucky and have a steel that will last a lifetime. Try to find a live working steel player to help you out. The forum only goes so far.

John Pape · Post by **John Pape** » 8 May 2007 7:20 am

Hi Bob
I'm in Rochester, NY. The used pieces I've been considering have been set up by reputable dealers in preparation for sale. I've played a MSA classic s-12U that belongs to one of my coworkers (one of the used pieces I'm considering is identical except for color and a pickup upgrade). Checked around and doesn't appear that there are any instruments available in Rochester at the moment.
John

Jim Eaton · Post by **Jim Eaton** » 8 May 2007 7:31 am

I got to play the Jackson Blackjack at Perl-Jam here in LA a few weeks ago and I would have loved to have a guitar that felt and sounded as good as the Blackjack does when I started playing.
A very good value for the $. IMHO
JE:-)>

Andy Jones · Post by **Andy Jones** » 8 May 2007 2:23 pm

John,I did as you are planning to do.I bought a '74 MSA D-10 Classic,8X4,to learn on and I am very satified with this guitar.Mine is almost like new and in excellent condition.I can find no fault with it except it is very heavy.It stays in tune well and should last me the rest of my life(I'm 55).I bought it from Billy Carr in Seminary,MS.I plan to buy a newer S-10 when I learn to hold my own.I'll probably keep the MSA.
Andy

Stan Paxton · Post by **Stan Paxton** » 8 May 2007 2:38 pm

Well Welcome John, to the world of steel guitar. All these guys will give you good advise. And usually I would think, you probably can get a decent quality used instrument from a good reputable dealer, like several we have on the Forum. IMO

Jerry H. Moore · Post by **Jerry H. Moore** » 8 May 2007 5:16 pm

I started out with the Carter Starter and don't regret it at all. What it will let you do is get a taste of the Nashville tuning and has the 3X4 setup like other high end guitars for when you upgrade. You can find a used one for around $500 usually and can get your money back when you upgrade. I went from a Carter to an old Fender 1000 and I really should have stayed with the Carter or bought a guitar with the 3X4 setup. I just bought a SD-10 Sho-Bud and it's fantastic. I really worked hard to try and make the old Fender work and it was fun and it sounded cool but after getting the Sho-Bud I feel the Fender held me back. My advice is get a good guitar to begin with. The forum has helped me make decisions and have not failed me yet. I think with your budget you can get something nice. Good Luck

Donald Hall · Post by **Donald Hall** » 8 May 2007 5:28 pm

John:
I just went through your struggle. Bought a used Carter Starter six months ago, and I already want something better. Check out Al Brisco (www.steelguitarcanada.com) . Al has used PSG all the time, and he is just across the pond from Rochester.
DGH

Daniel Eaton · Post by **Daniel Eaton** » 8 May 2007 5:33 pm

John, a little over a year ago I was in the same spot.After contacting some of the folks on the internet,I chose to go with a used pro model. While looking for someone in the NH area that mite have a Carter Starter, I found a forum member with a d10 Sho-Bud with 8 pedals & 4 knees for $1200.00. I bought a used pro. I think I got lucky, except for a small stroke before I could pick it up but the gent saved it for me till I could get it. Maybe if I'd have opted for the less expensive Starter I wouldn't have had the stroke. As yet I can't play a lik but I wouldn't trade it for a starter.

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 8 May 2007 5:41 pm

$1200 might get you a decent used MSA. The $700 you might spend on a Carter Starter wouldn't be a bad investment either, as the used ones seem to sell pretty fast, and for within about $100 of a new one.

I would strongly recommend you ask a seasoned player about anything else you might intend to buy.

Lee Baucum · Post by **Lee Baucum** » 8 May 2007 5:54 pm

John - Do you have any funds set aside for an amp, volume pedal, cords, tuner, steel bar, picks, etc?

David Higginbotham · Post by **David Higginbotham** » 8 May 2007 6:08 pm

My advise would be a BSG S-10 if you want something more modern for a very reasonable price. BSG has only 2 knees for that price, but you can order the 2 extra knees at a later date. You won't need them for quite some time anyway. Plenty to learn with only 2 knees and 3 pedals. Other than that I would go with an older model MSA D-10, but they are heavy!
Dave

Ben Godard · Post by **Ben Godard** » 8 May 2007 6:33 pm

If you know that you will be playing for the long haul and you know you already have a passion for this instrument. Then I would suggest buying the best Single neck you can afford. You don't need a doubleneck yet. You may be overwhelmed with the C6th neck. Besides probrably 85% of the time or more a song is E9. Unless you particularly love C6th more than E9th, get a single neck and save yourself some money. I would not get a carter starter unless you are not sure you gonna stick with it. The carter starter only has the basic set-up. There are a few signature licks you are gonna want to immediately play and some of them would be diffucult without the right lever. Actually the basic set-up isn't bad with the exception of the G# knee lever. I feel lost without the G#raise lever. THe little unison lick you've heard so much is done on that knee lever.
One suggestion. Get an all-pull guitar. Don't start with a push-pull unless you have a mechanic on standby. They sound very good but are expensive and more rare, and they require way more skill to work on and tune.
That's just my 2 cent.
You are about to embark on a great adventure of learning steel guitar, best wishes and good luck.

John Pape · Post by **John Pape** » 9 May 2007 6:23 am

Thanks everybody>I have my eyes peeled

Hey Donald
I have been talking to Al Brisco before I posted... Might have something for me..

Hey Lee
Thanks for mentioning the stuff some folks might overlook... Fortunately I've played guitar for over 40 years..I ran an amp/keyboard repair shop for 15 so I have amps and a tuner; I have a vol pedal that could use a new pot and as for cables I work for Whirlwind(need I say more..)
So I guess a bar and some picks will get me going!
Thaks everyone for a warm welcome.. Hope I can do this!!

Ben Jones · Post by **Ben Jones** » 9 May 2007 8:34 am

There are a few signature licks you are gonna want to immediately play and some of them would be diffucult without the right lever.

I could be wrong but I beleive the carter starter has four knee levers one of which raises the G#.
The problem ,if there is one, with the carter starter is not the lack of levers or pedals or even not being able to change the copedant. HOw many first year players are gonna change from a standard set-up? and would it be advisable of they did at such an early stage? that depends I guess , but for the most part beginners have everything they need copedant wise with the starter. Thats said I'd still get a decent pro single neck with 3 and 4 before a starter.

Hope I can do this!!

oh you can and will, it wont be easy, but it WILL be fun. best of luck.

John Pape · Post by **John Pape** » 10 May 2007 6:10 am

Well I took the Plunge ordered a MSA extended e9 12 string from Al Brisco .. should be here early next week! Wish me luck.

Stan Paxton · Post by **Stan Paxton** » 10 May 2007 8:28 am

Well John, that was probably a good choice, and will definitely give you something to play with for a good long time; happy pickin' & when you get frustrated, just walk away from it for awhile, then come back & do it some more!

Ron Randall · Post by **Ron Randall** » 10 May 2007 8:29 pm

http://www.b0b.com/infoedu/future1.htm

This article helped me a lot when I was trying to decide.

Dennis Schell · Post by **Dennis Schell** » 13 May 2007 1:48 pm

John Pape wrote:Well I took the Plunge ordered a MSA extended e9 12 string from Al Brisco .. should be here early next week! Wish me luck.

Good luck! That's a fine axe and should keep you busy for a lifetime or two! How about a photo and mention of it's copedant when you get it?

Dennis

The Steel Guitar Forum

Newbie seeking guidance

Newbie seeking guidance

Starter

Please read this before you decide.