Got C6 on my Dobro finally!

Todd Weger · From: Safety Harbor, FLAUSA

I was swinging by Sam Ash, and thought I should finally stop and get strings to wire up my Regal in C6 tuning. I had to buy individual strings, which ran me about $10, but convenience was more important than price at this point.

The gauges I got were:

E = .016p
C = .018p
A = .023
G = .026
E = .032
C = .036

I was going to go with a .022 for the A string, but they didn't have any in the box, and I thought one notch heavier might be nice there anyway. My Regal ("Bearded") is about 25" scale or so, so these gauges seemed to be about right to me (at least in my foggy memory).

Strung it up, and it sounds great! Nice amount of tension, and seems pretty even across the neck. I tried tuning the C's to C# for A6 tuning, which worked fine, and then the bottom three strings to a B triad for B11, which also seemed to work fine.

Does anyone know if they make pre-packaged C6 sets for Dobro using the Phosphor Bronze strings? I suppose I could order singles from JustStrings.com, and keep 'em on hand.

Anyway, wish I'd have done this much sooner than I did. Now, my trio can really do the strolling thing WITH steel! Woo-hooo!

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Todd James Weger/RD/RTD
1956 Fender Stringmaster T-8 (C6, A6, B11); 1960 Fender Stringmaster D-8 (C6, B11/A6); Chandler RH-4 Koa semi-hollow lapsteel (open G); Regal resonator (open D or G)

HowardR · From: N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville

I haven't seen packaged sets of C6 for dobro. I always order separate phos/br from Just Strings.

Todd Weger · From: Safety Harbor, FLAUSA

Thanks Howard. Yeah, I checked 'em out, and it looks like I'd pay about the same ($10/set for six individual strings); or, I could do way better at just $3.09/set, if I went bulk and bought 12 of each.

I don't change strings very regularly, though I might at that price. Do these bulk strings stay pretty fresh? Is there a way to keep them fresher, longer, before being put on the instrument? Food storage baggies maybe?

Thanks.
TJW

Ed Baker · From: Connecticut, USA

I have a nice string tension Excel program if anybody wants a copy.

It can calculate all sorts of tensions for both pedal and non-pedal guitars at any scale length.

Drop me a line at ejb@theworld.com and I'll send it out.

HowardR · From: N.Y.C.-Fire Island-Asheville

Randy Reeves · From: LaCrosse, Wisconsin, USA

congrads on your C6 dobro.
I had open G on a lap steel, but the strings were wrong, as I had not enough tension. I went back to C6 last night and what a difference.
it is very important to get that right tension. my lap sings now.
C6 is really a nice tuning. enjoy.

Mark Eaton · Posted 27 Apr 2005 9:22 am

This is part of the same subject-but a little different take on this thread.

After playing very little dobro/lap steel for many years, I got back into it 2 years ago in my late 40's. There are threads elsewhere about the ability to learn things as you age.

I usually stick with open G on lap steel because I'm comfortable with it from playing the dobro. But I'm thinking it would be a good idea when I play in my church band to tune the lap to an "alternative" tuning like C6. It has a different "voice" so that if I play dobro on one song in G, then switch over to C6 on lap-it would provide for a much different effect than playing both instruments in the same tuning.

I know there is no shortcut to practice,practice,practice but that said-can a typical player with middle-of-the-road skills expect to understand the tuning in a short enough time to be able to play it in a band in front of people?

I guess the larger point is though there are alternatives to standard tuning on the regular guitar-there seems to be dozens of potential tunings in the steel guitar family.

As a basic example,in open G if you want to play a D chord and you have been playing for any length of time your left hand goes to the 7th fret without having to think about it. To play the same chord in C6 you play the top 3 strings on the 5th fret. To be able to make a transition like this and not having to go through the intellectual process of saying "5th fret" in your head-has this taken you guys a long time?

I'm always amazed how some steel players are so confident in different tunings. Any thoughts?

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Mark

Randy Reeves · From: LaCrosse, Wisconsin, USA

I feel your pain, so to speak.
Ive got E9 on pedal steel, C6 on one lap steel, open D on another, and DADGAD on my acoustic.
at first I thought I was in trouble, but now, once I hit a note I know where all the others are.
note: I am no wizard or talented pro. I just have to have those tunings to sate my whims.
so go ahead. it'll come to you pretty quickly.

Todd Weger · From: Safety Harbor, FLAUSA

Mark -- I get a bit like that at times, but I find what helps is learning intervals between strings, and their relationships as they pertain to chord extensions before actual notes. This helps me make the transition to other tunings quicker.

When I'm in A6, for example, I have a fifth on the top string, as opposed to C6, where I use a third on top. Everything is essentially the same, except I have to remember that there's a fifth on top, and that my open voice is in A, not C. From there, I an usually improvise fairly quickly once I get my bearings, because all my intervalic relationships, stringwise, are the same.

I have a harder time with B11, but that comes easier now, too.

The only other thing with playing Hawaiian on my reso is that, when I'm playing with the strap on -- no, not THAT kind!

-- plucking with my right hand around the 12-14th fret is definitely a challange!

TJW

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Todd James Weger/RD/RTD
1956 Fender Stringmaster T-8 (C6, A6, B11); 1960 Fender Stringmaster D-8 (C6, B11/A6); Chandler RH-4 Koa semi-hollow lapsteel (open G); Regal resonator (open D or G)

[This message was edited by Todd Weger on 27 April 2005 at 11:14 AM.]

[This message was edited by Todd Weger on 27 April 2005 at 11:15 AM.]

Harry Williams · From: Duncan, Vancouver Island, BC, Canada

I use C6 on both dobro and lapsteel - and it's the middle 6 strings on my universal pedal steel. Because I play other instruments, I like the learning efficiencies of having the same great tuning on different instruments. That said, the styles are different. The acoustic dobro lends itself to more notes and ornaments like pull-offs and hammer-ons. The lap steel has the sustain so I play fewer notes that say more (that's the idea anyway!), and the pedal steel is great for jazz chords. As for string gauges I use the heaviest I can find in my box of dusty, old strings - and they seem to sound just fine!

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[This message was edited by Harry Williams on 27 April 2005 at 01:15 PM.]

Gary Anwyl · From: Palo Alto, CA

Mark, I agree with what Randy and Todd said. If you work on learning the layout of the C6 fretboard you'll be able to comfortably play in that tuning.

I am also in my late 40's. I play a lot of dobro in High-G tuning. I tried learning C6 a few years ago and wasn't sucessful. However, recently I tried C6 again and made a lot of progress.

The difference is that this time I consciously tried to learn the layout of the fretboard. I figured out all the places where you can find a major triad and how to get to and from I, IV and V chords from there. I also worked out the patterns of scales harmonized in thirds and sixths.

Stacy Phillips had a good suggestion in his "Art of Hawaiian Guitar" book. If you're coming to C6 from a G tuning, it is good to look at the similarities between the two tunings. Figure out what string pairs in the two tunings have the same interval relationship. For example when playing a scale harmonized in sixths, the pattern of straight and reverse slants played on the 1st and 4th strings in C6 tuning is the same as the pattern played on the 2nd and 4th strings in G tuning. You wouldn't do this mental translation as you're playing in the C6 tuning, but this helps you orient yourself as you're learning the C6 tuning.

I created a couple of webpages that describe my approach to learning C6 tuning. Here's a page that talks about learning the major triad positions: Learning C6

Here's a page that talks about harmonized scales: Harmonized scales in C6

It's the way I approached learning C6 and I found it worked for me. I have a feeling the information is obvious to a lot of people on this forum.

[This message was edited by Gary Anwyl on 15 April 2006 at 07:04 PM.]

Steve Pierce · From: San Rafael, California, USA

If you need a good transition tuning from straight G tuning (GBDGBD low to high), try cranking the lower D string up to an E for a G6 tuning (GBEGBD low to high). It find it helpful for getting a couple different tonalities out of the same set of strings.

C6 on acoustic is fun though, but it's a pain when I need to have that 6th sound out of there. It usually means getting a different guage of strings on there.

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Steve Pierce

Mark Eaton · Posted 27 Apr 2005 9:12 pm

Thanks for all the comments guys, and Gary, thanks for your instructional materials. You are to be commended for a sterling effort!

I have to get the right gauges and maybe string up my old pre-war Dobro which is in a back-up roll these days, to a C6 practice guitar.

Keep those comments comin'!

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Mark

[This message was edited by Mark Eaton on 27 April 2005 at 10:13 PM.]

Michael Whitley · From: Oxford, Mississippi, USA

Thanks for the string gages, Todd. Like Harry, I play lap, resonator, and pedal (although a 10-string) and all are now in C6. I just finished swapping my Regal with a lap steel set. I like it, I like it. However - I need bronze!

Kevin Ruddell · From: Toledo Ohio USA

Will stringing up your Dobro to C6 using the 16 and 18 for your top 2 strings present any problems due to additional tension on the instrument's bridge and top ? I'm just asking because I don't know. I started out with a 13 and 17 for the high E and C and immediately went to a 14 and 18 cos' it sounded too thin . On my 22 and a half inch scale guitars I go with heavier, but I wasn't sure about the resonator

[This message was edited by Kevin Ruddell on 17 April 2006 at 02:08 PM.]

Mark Eaton · Posted 15 Apr 2006 3:48 pm

One of the virtues of the square neck is that it takes all kinds of tension from different gauge strings.

.016 on the first, and .018 on the second are the gauges you receive in a popular resonator guitar set for G tuning: D'Addario J-42's.

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Mark

basilh · From: United Kingdom

There is another way to get familiar with different tunings, if you play regular guitar you can relate the 3 basic steel guitar tunings to the different key positions on the regular guitar fretboard. i.e. on a regular guitar G at the third fret and its 4 and 5 chord pockets would outline the basics of a steel tuning with the root 'on top', the key of C at the third fret and its relative 4 and 5 relates to '5th on top', and the key of Eb at the third fret with its relative chords would be similar to 3rd 'on top'.
Root on top would be E and its variants, 5th on top would be A and its variants and 3rd on top would be C6 and similar.(obviously provided that the C 6th has an 'E' top note.
So, if you can think 'Guitar' chord positions, varied steel tunings should be no problem.

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Tom Taylor · From: San Antonio, Texas, USA

I just strung up my Dobro with C6 as well, having gotten a new Wechter/Scheerhorn for G tuning (and it's loud).
I noticed the use of the lighter gauge 36 for the low C. I'm using a 44 with no problems, and that Dobro really sings with that tuning.
In case you're interested, the complete set I'm using is 44-34-28-24-18-16. This an OMI Original Hound Dog Dobro, and the tension is not a problem at all - in fact, it makes for a bright, loud sound.

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OMI Original Hound Dog Dobro,
Remington Playboy 8 String

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