Non pedal popularity among pedal pushers

HowardR · Post by **HowardR** » 11 Dec 2005 2:25 pm

Within the last year or two, it seems to me that pedal steel players are taking more of an interest in non pedal steels and discovering, or re discovering lap steels, consoles, and dobros.

Anyone else agree?

MUSICO · Post by **MUSICO** » 11 Dec 2005 2:47 pm

I agree from what I see on Forum.

I agree because it´s happening to me.

Jeremy Williams
Barcelona Spain

c c johnson · Post by **c c johnson** » 11 Dec 2005 2:57 pm

They are much more fun to play; besides you play them instead of a mechanism playing you. CC

Jeff Au Hoy · Post by **Jeff Au Hoy** » 11 Dec 2005 3:06 pm

As a non peddler who "discovered" pedals this past year, I have to say that in comparison pedals are a pain in the butt to setup, dismantle and transport (my experience is limited to Fender 1000s). I think there's a certain satisfaction in being able to do it without pedals, but at the same time that's just a technical challenge. Music isn't automatically more beautiful for me just because it was played without pedals.

Howard Tate · Post by **Howard Tate** » 11 Dec 2005 3:20 pm

I see them as two different instruments, they sound different and I love both.

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Howard, 'Les Paul Recording, Zum SD12U, Carter D10 8/8, Vegas 400, Boss ME-5, Boss DM-3, DD-3, Fender Steel King, Understanding wife. http://www.Charmedmusic.com

Gerald Ross · Post by **Gerald Ross** » 11 Dec 2005 3:34 pm

Look at the average age of the people on this forum

.

Maybe peddlers are tired of carrying 200 plus pounds of gear to a gig and taking all that time to set up and tear down. Typically a peddler will have a double neck steel in a flight case with all it's rods, gears and pulleys, a volume pedal, a huge 75 lb amp and a pack-a-seat.

Non peddlers typically carry a tiny lap steel, a small amp and a pint of scotch.

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Gerald Ross
'Northwest Ann Arbor, Michigan's King Of The Hawaiian Steel Guitar'

CEO, CIO, CFO - UkeTone Records
Gerald's Fingerstyle Guitar Website
Board of Directors Hawaiian Steel Guitar Association

HowardR · Post by **HowardR** » 11 Dec 2005 3:37 pm

I brought this up because relatively recently, it seems that pedal steelers are taking more of an interest in bar slants, string pulls, and at least knowing how they can get a phrase or licks without using levers & pedals.

Tommy White showed up here recently on a Tricone thread. Seems like more steelers are interested in resophonics. Reece & Bobbe have been actively playing and posting with regard to non pedal. Of course since Buddy Emmons and Lloyd Green use non pedal techniques in their pedal steel playing, that influences players.

There were three sets of non pedal at the PSGA show this year....Jody, Bobbe Seymore, & Lonnie Bennett.

At the Dallas show last year, there were two sets with dobro and a non pedal class. This year there'll be some workshops.

I see more interest. That's a great thing.[This message was edited by HowardR on 11 December 2005 at 03:42 PM.]

Rick Aiello · Post by **Rick Aiello** » 11 Dec 2005 3:39 pm

and a pint of scotch

That would be a fifth of Myer's rum ... in my case

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Aiello's Cast Steel Guitars


My wife and I don't think alike. She donates money to the homeless and I donate money to the topless! ... R. Dangerfield

HowardR · Post by **HowardR** » 11 Dec 2005 3:43 pm

Rick, your BronzePan weighed more than some pedal steels...

<pre>dang it b0b....I'll make the hats around here!</pre>

[This message was edited by HowardR on 11 December 2005 at 03:44 PM.]

Rick Aiello · Post by **Rick Aiello** » 11 Dec 2005 3:47 pm

How much does a D10 weigh ... ??

My bronze 6 string Dustpan is 42 pounds ...

My aluminum 8 string Dustpans are around 15 lbs.

The Boobpans (double necks) are around 35 lbs ...

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Aiello's Cast Steel Guitars


My wife and I don't think alike. She donates money to the homeless and I donate money to the topless! ... R. Dangerfield

[This message was edited by Rick Aiello on 11 December 2005 at 04:06 PM.]

Bob Hickish · Post by **Bob Hickish** » 11 Dec 2005 9:26 pm

HowardR
have gone full circle ! I played Non ped !
to peds and back ! one reason for this
is ! when it come to pedals ! IMO - the word
Suck ! covered my ability to reach the level
set by real musicians , not to mention
a 20 year lay off and could not see going
back to - That word - Non ped is home
for me .
So far working out grate - plenty jobs .
BUT !
still working on getting past that word .

Hick

George Keoki Lake · Post by **George Keoki Lake** » 11 Dec 2005 10:06 pm

Gerald covered this topic perfectly. I recall talking with Billy Hew Len and asking why he gave up on pedals. His reasoning was the time it took to set-up, knock-down, plus the rust factor in the mechanism. Billy ended up playing (fabulously) his compact JB Frypan.

Pedals are great when played by musicians who fully understand the wide range of chordal possibilities. (ie...BILL STAFFORD, et al). I love GOOD pedal steel work however, my real listening preferance will always be the non-pedal...especially Hawaiian music.

richard burton · Post by **richard burton** » 12 Dec 2005 5:21 am

Pedals for me every time!!
I am hopeless at non-pedal, my bar slanting is way out of tune.
I sound like a cat being dragged by it's tail, under a door.

My PSG playing is only marginally better....

Stephen Gambrell · Post by **Stephen Gambrell** » 12 Dec 2005 5:34 am

I've played dobro for years, and decided to give the pedal machine a try a couple of years ago. It frustrates the &#^#%@* out of me that I can't instinctively find stuff on that big ol' pedal steel, that I can get to with my eyes closed on the dobro...

Erv Niehaus · Post by **Erv Niehaus** » 12 Dec 2005 7:24 am

I took up pedal steel for the ability to get full, 3 string chords. However, I still like to return to my "roots".

Erv

HowardR · Post by **HowardR** » 12 Dec 2005 7:44 am

Erv, that's what I'm talking about. The playing aspect. I've heard pedal steelers say that their playing has improved, or has become less mechanical sounding by playing and learning more on non pedal.

In turn, they are more aware of the fretboard and where/how to find voicings other than where they're used by mechanical means. Then they can also use the levers & pedals along with slanting to really expand their musical palette.....I think.

Bill McCloskey · Post by **Bill McCloskey** » 12 Dec 2005 7:53 am

I have a love for both, especially as I get more and more into focusing on Jazz. There is nothing like the sound of the Superslide and its great just to be able to pick it up and play it anywhere I want in the house.

However, as I explore the pedal steel keyboard more, I realize what an amazing beast it is for getting those beautiful jazz chords and - for lead work- the ability to reach any note in the scale on from one bar position.

Doug Beaumier · Post by **Doug Beaumier** » 12 Dec 2005 9:19 am

Howard, You’re absolutely right. Playing lap steel in recent years has changed the way I approach pedal steel… for the better. Instead of using pedals constantly, I feel more at ease with slides and slants now. In some songs I play an entire solo without touching the pedals. For certain styles this sounds better than the pedals would. It’s certainly smoother. And I have noticed that audiences respond to that type of a solo more. There’s something about the simplicity and the smooth sound of slides that people can relate to. I think it’s part visual and part audio.

Lap steel has forced me to think and rethink what notes are in the chords, where to get the voicings, what slants sound best, the root, 3rd, etc… this is all good and useful stuff for pedal steel too. I find myself playing lots of non-pedal licks now on PSG and this is good… it’s one more color for the palette.

A couple of years ago I recorded this rock/blues/slide demo on pedal steel for some of my students. 90% of it was played without the use of pedals. To hear the mp3 click here

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My Site - Instruction | My SteelTab
[This message was edited by Doug Beaumier on 12 December 2005 at 09:24 AM.]

Gary Morrison · Post by **Gary Morrison** » 12 Dec 2005 9:28 am

Here is my typical setup. Double your pleasure, double your fun!

[This message was edited by Gary Morrison on 12 December 2005 at 10:13 AM.]

HowardR · Post by **HowardR** » 12 Dec 2005 9:47 am

Gary, I think you dashed where you should have slashed!......

Nick Reed · Post by **Nick Reed** » 12 Dec 2005 10:10 am

Howard R,
I agree with you 100%. I've always had a Lap Steel or two setting around the house but last September my wife decided she wanted to learn non-pedal. So it's naturally made me take more interest.
Sunday we went to see her almost completed late 50's Fender D-8 Stringmaster which is being restored. It's looking mighty good with it's fresh new paint-job. Most of the metal has cleaned up very nice. Also Jerry has replaced some of the old fraded & worn-out wiring. About the only thing we're lacking now are two good original Fender legs. I want a couple that are not rusted. Once we find those, she'll have a brand new Fender Stringmaster. Needless to say she's anxious! NR[This message was edited by Nick Reed on 12 December 2005 at 10:16 AM.]

Gary Morrison · Post by **Gary Morrison** » 12 Dec 2005 10:14 am

Howard:
I must have sliced instead of diced. So I finally used the cheese slicer and figured it out!

Gene Jones · Post by **Gene Jones** » 12 Dec 2005 10:30 am

*[This message was edited by Gene Jones on 05 April 2006 at 04:49 AM.]

Dave White · Post by **Dave White** » 12 Dec 2005 11:10 am

Doug--I agree with you. I played a lap steel for a couple of years before I tried pedal steel, and I have approached it from that point of view. At the same time, the pedals and bars can sure come in handy, so I've been trying to incorporate both styles into PSG. I do think it is a visual experience as well, and people like watching the left hand sliding up and down the neck as opposed to just holding the bar in one place and mashing pedals and knee bars. As a newbie, I'm still discovering what works best for me, but the lap steel was a great influence--and I still play it, too.

Mark Eaton · Post by **Mark Eaton** » 12 Dec 2005 11:50 am

I don't play pedal.

That said, my next musical instrument purchase is probably going to be a 12-string SuperSlide, at some point after the 1st of the year.

I handle vocals, dobro, and some six-string lap in front of people in a couple of different band configurations.

I would love to play pedal, but I'm thinking that once I get used to the string spacing on the 12-string non-pedal, and get some sort of handle on the Reece Anderson tuning as discussed in the the thread started by Musico, that I will be able to put the instrument to work for our group in a shorter period of time than if I had to "woodshed" on the pedal steel.

Another year or so down the line, and with the wife's approval, maybe I can budget for a decent single neck pedal steel and take the flying leap into the world of pedals.

The other thing, by doing a lot of vocals, to be able to stand up and play and sing (with telescoping) legs seems to be a more natural thing than trying to chip in vocals on a song's chorus while sitting and doing the whole "it's like flying a helicopter" thing of the pedal steel guitar.

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Mark
[This message was edited by Mark Eaton on 12 December 2005 at 12:38 PM.]