No Country Allowed !!

Richard Gonzales · Post by **Richard Gonzales** » 24 Sep 2006 7:30 am

I am just curious how many of you would be playing steel guitar if there was no country or western swing to be played? I would be okay as I play very little country.
How about you???

Greg Cutshaw · Post by **Greg Cutshaw** » 24 Sep 2006 8:20 am

I would be playing guitar or piano. In the past I have learned a lot of the swing band tunes and some jazz but those tunes just don't stick with me on steel guitar and they are so difficult and unintuitive to play. On guitar it seems so easy to remember arrangements. On steel there are so many different grips and positions and pedal combinations that unless I have recently practiced a non-country tune that has a detailed arrangment, I would be hard pressed to play it for anyone.

Greg

Ed Altrichter · Post by **Ed Altrichter** » 24 Sep 2006 8:21 am

WHAT ??? No Country? No Western Swing ??? What would be the point of anything ?
What if there be no air to breathe ? No summer sunshine, no grass, no trees ???
No love, no passion, no one to care ?
Life would be cold, so dark, so bare.
I would be lost, with nothing to console !
I need my music. It sweetens the soul.

Mike Shefrin · Post by **Mike Shefrin** » 24 Sep 2006 8:38 am

Country music is what first attracted me to the steel guitar although now I also play alot of jazz and some classical pieces on the steel as well as country. I like alot of different music and try to play different styles both on the steel and the six string guitar.[This message was edited by Mike Shefrin on 30 September 2006 at 08:13 PM.]

Ron Frederiksen · Post by **Ron Frederiksen** » 24 Sep 2006 10:54 am

If there was no counyry music, there would'nt be any guitars.... Ron

"steelin is music to my ear"

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 24 Sep 2006 11:02 am

"If there was no counyry music, there would'nt be any guitars"

Hardly. Classical guitar predates "country" by centuries. There would also be plenty of blues, and folk styles that wouldn't really be considered "country" by "country" players.

Would I personally be playing if there was no country or western swing to be played? Sure. I play (well, I wouldn't go that far - I'm still learning and do not consider myself really competent) the *instrument*. The style isn't somehow contained in the instrument - in fact steel's versatility allows you to take it beyond country or western swing. Or never really go there to begin with, and *start* in another style. Educational materials are 99% country and most steel playing is in country, so it has that stigma attached to it. But it's irrelevant - play what you want. If you like the instrument itself but want to play nothing but Back Flag and Pennywise songs, have at it. Hmmm, actually that's kind of a cool idea....

D Schubert · Post by **D Schubert** » 24 Sep 2006 11:08 am

I am a long-time disciple of bluegrass and traditional country and western swing, and that's mostly what I play -- and all that I want to play. I usually find myself studying the music, rather than the instrument. I play a lot of instruments -- elec and acoustic guitar, pedal and non-pedal steel, mandolin, Dobro, etc. -- but don't venture very far outside of the pastures that I know. I guess that would make me the philosophical opposite of someone who plays one instrument extremely well, and is capable in all genres and all situations. Does that make me wide versus deep? Or, deep versus wide?

Twayn Williams · Post by **Twayn Williams** » 24 Sep 2006 12:02 pm

I don't play country. I find genre to be un-imporant. I play music I like and I rarely worry about stylistic constraints.

David Doggett · Post by **David Doggett** » 24 Sep 2006 12:14 pm

Well, when I don't have a country or roots rock band to play with, I play blues and jazz on pedal steel. But, this is a higly hypothetical question. If it weren't for country, I'm not sure there would be such a thing as pedal steel guitar. I realize there were console lap steels with pedals to change the tuning, and these were used for Hawaiian and big band jazz decades ago. But by the '50s that had faded from popularity. Country music kept steel guitar alive, and gave birth to the modern pedal steel guitar. It was country and country-rock that made me learn pedal steel in the '70s. If there were only rock, folk and blues, I probably would have stayed with slide guitar.[This message was edited by David Doggett on 24 September 2006 at 01:14 PM.]

Randy Reeves · Post by **Randy Reeves** » 24 Sep 2006 12:34 pm

no matter what instrument
I happen to play. my default
is the blues.
invariably, I end up there.

Klaus Caprani · Post by **Klaus Caprani** » 24 Sep 2006 1:27 pm

I would miss it, but I'm basically Rock'n'Roll

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Klaus Caprani

MCI RangeXpander S-10 3x4
www.klauscaprani.com

Andy Sandoval · Post by **Andy Sandoval** » 24 Sep 2006 1:46 pm

with nothing to console !

How's this for a console? I wouldn't even own this beauty if it weren't for Country or Western Swing. Rock, Blues, Surf, Jazz standards all sound great on steel.[This message was edited by Andy Sandoval on 24 September 2006 at 02:47 PM.]

Steve Hinson · Post by **Steve Hinson** » 24 Sep 2006 2:32 pm

no...

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Bobby Lee · Post by **Bobby Lee** » 24 Sep 2006 3:07 pm

The pedal steel was used in swing before it was used in country. Alvino Rey.

Ed Altrichter · Post by **Ed Altrichter** » 24 Sep 2006 3:35 pm

Were the pedals used to apply an integral part of the melody line at that time; before Bud Isaacs ?

chris ivey · Post by **chris ivey** » 24 Sep 2006 3:36 pm

what steve said!

Post by **Dave Mudgett** » 24 Sep 2006 3:44 pm

I like Steve H.'s philosophically minimalist answer, which I basically agree with, but just have to expand.

I'm addressing the issue of pedal steel specifically, since slide or lap steel is most commonly used - these days - in other areas of music besides country.

I like to play things other than country, so I guess by one interpretation of your question, the answer is a qualified yes - I do sometimes play with units that don't have any country component. But I wouldn't be "okay" about it if there was "no country allowed" at all in my playing.

Further, I doubt that I would have ever been motivated to pick up the pedal steel if it weren't for seeing the example of its use by the great country players. Sure, Alvino Ray started it, and maybe it would have continued a sophisticated evolution in that realm without the influence of country playing. But, to me, a nagging issue is that, even now, there are people in the jazz world who still don't even consider guitar a serious jazz solo instrument, much less pedal steel. Would the great historical pedal steel players have been able to make a living playing without country? I'm not so sure. So, I'm honestly pretty skeptical that many of us would have gone in this direction if there was "no country".

So, by another interpretation of your question - no. I don't think I would be playing pedal steel at all if there had been "no country allowed". I'd have just stuck to my guitar and banjo. Of course, if there was "no country allowed", I guess that would also outlaw bluegrass banjo, eh? {Yeah, I suppose that's another reason for some people to try to outlaw country

} But, my heavens - all this controlling would keep the brain police awfully busy - wouldn't it?

Of course, the idea of "no country allowed" is a false premise in my world. In my reality, country is "definitely allowed", although sometimes frowned upon. And I know that while I grew up in Massachusetts, it was even allowed there. Has something changed that I'm not aware of?

Steve Hinson · Post by **Steve Hinson** » 24 Sep 2006 4:03 pm

...I took up playing the steel guitar because of country music-I played guitar for several years and enjoyed playing country,blues,rock and roll,pop-anything I heard that caught my ear...but I wasn't gonna be happy until I got a steel guitar...and could play that E9 stuff that I was hearing on country radio.Nothing else about the steel interested me...I agree that if you took a poll,most steel players would say that they took up the instrument because of country music...I get busted on sessions all the time for playing"too pretty"or"too country"or whatever...I guess from listening to the stuff like"Tiny Dancer",the Linda Ronstadt stuff with Sneeky Pete and Buddy Emmons,"Sweet Baby James"with Red Rhodes...those guys were on those records to make them sound country...nah,without the pretty E9 stuff I wouldn't be interested.If the worst thing anybody ever said about me was that I was"too country"I'd be in pretty good shape...

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[This message was edited by Steve Hinson on 24 September 2006 at 05:05 PM.][This message was edited by Steve Hinson on 24 September 2006 at 05:06 PM.][This message was edited by Steve Hinson on 24 September 2006 at 07:01 PM.]

James Cann · Post by **James Cann** » 24 Sep 2006 4:16 pm

In my reality, country is "definitely allowed", although sometimes frowned upon. And I know that while I grew up in Massachusetts, it was even allowed there.

Amen, Dave. This Boston boy remembers the 60's (as you probably do, too). Country was indeed allowed back then, but boy, did we cringe when we heard it!

Calvin Walley · Post by **Calvin Walley** » 24 Sep 2006 4:31 pm

if your not going to play country on your steel... you might as well use it for a work bench

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Chip Fossa · Post by **Chip Fossa** » 24 Sep 2006 5:38 pm

Well Richard,

Real country, and "country-rock"
got me into steel. No question. Probably more "country-rock". You must know this by now. This topic has pretty much been beaten to death here on the SGF.

Yes, if not for "country" and folkie-style groups that started using more steel in their albums, I'm sure I would never have been influenced.

I sure wish I could re-experience the 1st time I really HEARD the steel. It was heaven.

Oh yeah, I was hearing it all along, I suppose, for years.

But then one day, I really HEARD it. It hit me like the proverbial 'ton of bricks'.

Without the great music that went along with the steel guitar, I'm sure I would never have pursued it.

Hope this gives you some insight.

Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 24 Sep 2006 6:29 pm

One of my Grand daughters is taking up the Baritone horn in school,she is 10 years old. Do you think she might play a Baritone in a country band some day? I will not disown her,but she doesn't like the steel guitar.

Joe

Chip Fossa · Post by **Chip Fossa** » 24 Sep 2006 6:47 pm

Joe, brother...

You have to intervene. The law allows this.

I have 3 nieces. They love the fact that when I come over for Xmas and Easter, I bring my axe, and we all sing songs and have a gala time.

But they don't know about the steel, yet.

Now, how do you know that they DO NOT LIKE the steel?

We may be able to help out each other here.

I would just love to get one of my nieces
going on the steel. They already are dabbling in piano, flute, accordian, and guitar.

[This message was edited by CHIP FOSSA on 24 September 2006 at 07:49 PM.]

Jim Sliff · Post by **Jim Sliff** » 24 Sep 2006 6:50 pm

"if your not going to play country on your steel... you might as well use it for a work bench"

Not only does that not address the thread, it's just a closed-minded "opinion". It's interesting that the players NOT rooted in country don't tell country musicians to turn their instruments into a workbench...most of us seem to have a level of respect for country musicians and what they play. Too bad that sometimes the reverse just isn't true.

And country players think it's the non-country folks fostering an "us vs them" attitude.

Hardly.

Greg Simmons · Post by **Greg Simmons** » 24 Sep 2006 7:00 pm

if your not going to play country on your steel... you might as well use it for a work bench

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