10 string lap steel

Stanford Lane · Post by **Stanford Lane** » 18 Nov 2005 7:12 pm

A question was recently posed to me by our piano picker. Is there any advantage to having a 10 or a 12 string lap steel over a D-8 lap steel? I voiced my thoughts that a S-10 or a S-12 would have the advantage of weighing less than a D-8. There would also be a cost savings in the electronics. I did a search and I found that there has been no real discussion on this comparison. Do any of you have any experience to bring to this tipic?

Ray Montee · Post by **Ray Montee** » 18 Nov 2005 7:16 pm

HOW MUCH PLAYING would you actually be doing on the two top most and bottom most strings?

THAT is the Question. WHAT is the answer?

Stanford Lane · Post by **Stanford Lane** » 18 Nov 2005 8:19 pm

I have my National tuned to E7 and A6. I play C&W, Hawaiian and contemporary Christian. So, with that in mind, I play alot on the top strings on E7 and not much on the bottom two strings on the A6.

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 18 Nov 2005 10:22 pm

It totally depends on your music.
I can see having a double tuning in one. the right notes for lower strings warm and mellow.
and the top brighter and agressive.

Each section having a slightly different take on the tuning.

For example a warm A6 ( I 6) below,
and a brighter E7 ( V 7) on top.
I, IV, V within 2 frets.

And play from the 6th note as root for VII minor.

Of course some interesting middle range transition notes could be re-tuned for differing situtations too.

I built a s-10 portable battery powered non pedaL steel for playing at trad festivals and the like. Basically I could play on most anything, because I had great range.

If you think of it as one extended tuning then you get one big rtange of the tuning.
But if you think of it as two tunings that harmonically and tonally fit to your types of music, then you can get quite a bit out of a s12 like this.
If/when I get a Super Slide, it will be a twelve
[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 18 November 2005 at 10:27 PM.]

Donald Ruetenik · Post by **Donald Ruetenik** » 19 Nov 2005 9:59 am

David, I built a S10 a while back and your ideas are interesting. Could you post your tuning, please?

Stanford Lane · Post by **Stanford Lane** » 19 Nov 2005 10:08 am

Navid,
Thanks for your advice. Would you mind sharing your tuning on your 12 string with me. I imagine that when you think about it, there is not alot of difference between tuning a Quad-6's and T-8 and a D-12. All three have 24 strings.

One reason that this topic is preoccupying my thoughts is that I am considering playing my C-6 neck on my pedal steel as a non-pedal. Any thoughts on that?

Stanford Lane · Post by **Stanford Lane** » 19 Nov 2005 5:46 pm

I did some further research on the forum. I found the threads on the E-harp. This info. has really caused me to consider a 10-string steel. Man what a challenge this tuning would be.

Could anyone direct me to sites or persons who would have instructional material and tag for the E-harp tuning?

Charlie Fullerton · Post by **Charlie Fullerton** » 19 Nov 2005 7:34 pm

I've been playing various things for over forty years, including steel with pedals, AND WITHOUT. If I were working with it, I would buy a triple 8 (A6th, E6th, B11th -- that would be subject to some minor changes). The only other option I would consider would an S-10 pedal machine -- it would give the same tunings, and a few more.
It would be Herb Remington's A6th.

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 19 Nov 2005 8:32 pm

Stanford, here is one I tried for s10.

low to high
............... A C# E F# A C# E G# B D

( A6) ........A C# E F#
( F#m7) ...............F# A C# E
( A maj 7 )..................A C# E G#
(C#m7)............................C# E G# B
(E7 )................................. E G# B D

for 12
G A C# E F# A C# E G# B D E (F#)
G7 b5.(no 3rd )............G#m7b5 w F#

Basically you find the transition point between tunings,
and add notes to for the chord you're looking for.

A well thought out 10 or 12 string lapsteel can be quite versatile. especially if you think,
gee I change 2 notes here and here,
Whoah that's TOTALLY different.

I have a mini version on a short scale 6 string traveling mini slide guitar.

D F# A C# E G
D maj7
F#m7
A6 / A7
part of C# dim
Wish I had the B on top

It's early... I hope I have no typos...
DD
[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 19 November 2005 at 08:45 PM.][This message was edited by David L. Donald on 22 November 2005 at 07:23 AM.]

Stanford Lane · Post by **Stanford Lane** » 22 Nov 2005 7:03 am

Thank you David for your help and advice. Do you have any experience with a National E-harp or an Elpiphone E-harp? Are these instruments equal to or superior to say a west Coast Lap steel?

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 22 Nov 2005 7:21 am

No clue!

I have heard of them, but not much more.

Just thinking like a chord maven.
If you got the chords, you got the licks.
If you can get the logical chords in close proximity,
then more licks are in close proximity too.

Take a look at some of the cool chords you get
by adding one more note over the top note of those listed above,
or dropping the top for the next note up etc.

YOu can start on any note and speel above it,
and sometimes also below it.
Like the top E7 , drop the 7 and play the E6 with 6 on bottom.

I would want both
a Superslide and a Harmos
[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 22 November 2005 at 07:27 AM.]

Wayne Cox · Post by **Wayne Cox** » 22 Nov 2005 8:27 am

I have to agree with DAVID. I have owned, and do own, a variety of non-pedal steels (six,eight,ten,and twelve string models),and have played them all on the job. It was only acouple of years ago that I realized that I could do more with a S-10 or S-12 than I could with a T-8. Of course,you have to have a versatile tuning that incorporates many chord possibilities, then practice,practice,practice!
~~W.C.~~

Bob Tuttle · Post by **Bob Tuttle** » 22 Nov 2005 12:37 pm

Wayne, what tuning are you using on your 10 string and 12 string lap steels? The 12 string tuning that Reece uses looks pretty versatile.

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 22 Nov 2005 11:27 pm

Yeah it has similar themes as mine above.

D...F....A....C....E....G....A....C....E...G....B....D

Dm7 (add9)............................................ IIm
. Fmaj6...................................................IV
....Fmaj7.................................................IV
....F9......................................................IV
..........Am7.............................................VIm
................C6 ( Cmaj7, C9).......................I
......................Em7 or E sus4....................IIIm
............................G7sus4 and G69...........V7
.........................................
.............Bm7b5.. a stretch but it's there......VII 1/2 dim
B D F A
I would like the V to be a dom 7 with a higher F

I hadn't looked at it before, no time,
but I am not surprised Reece has a very cool tuning.[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 22 November 2005 at 11:29 PM.]