Robert Randolf! is it just me or what!?

Skip Mertz · Post by **Skip Mertz** » 10 Feb 2005 10:40 pm

Dont think I can take much more of this. I've watched him a cpl times now hoping he would do something at least a bit like pedal steel guitar (He has more than enough pedals and strings) He also has enough stomp boxes for a cpl bands ( and his stuff still sounds the same, like C$%P) He knows where his breads buttered I'm sure but this kinda musicianship is NOT helping promote pedal steel in any way.

David Rupert · Post by **David Rupert** » 11 Feb 2005 12:56 am

Yeah, it's "just you."

Personally, I like RR...very much. More power to him!!

Open your closed-mind, Skip.

I'm so sick of this "if it ain't country...it ain't #%@t," mentality.

Sad, very sad.

------------------
David "DJ" Rupert
(Pedal Steel Guitarist & Horse Whisperer)

1995 Mullen D-10
Peavey N/V 400 Amp.
Goodrich Volume Pedal
Boss Effects Pedal Board

"Music. Without it, life itself...would be impossible."

Peace.

www.johnbarnold.com/rupert

Skip Mertz · Post by **Skip Mertz** » 11 Feb 2005 1:49 am

David , I'm not talking about "if it aint country", I'm talking about pedal steel and what he's not doing for the instument. If he played his and got a decent overdriven blues sound like Roy Buchanan as I do or other blues or rock players , or showed at least Some taste and diversity , I'd have alot of repect for what he's doing. He might as well play slide guitar with too much fuzzbox on it. Thanks for your input, interesting.

Bob Carlucci · Post by **Bob Carlucci** » 11 Feb 2005 5:47 am

I'm with you Skip.. RR is LOADED with talent.. NO doubt!.. However I have never heard him do anything that sounds remotely like a PEDAL steel.Perhaps on his albums he shows more of what he is capable of.On TV peformances its always the same..BUT,you and I can't comment on that which we have not heard.

Shrill fuzzy tone and incredibly fast rock/blues licks. Like an overdistorted telecaster played at warp speed. That what we hear on his TV performances so far. However, MANY guys here have heard him play a more conventional style using his pedals,and they say he is just at talented at that style as he is on his manic rock style.

I think his TV performances are geared more to his fan base and not to a bunch of aging,balding,"conventional" pedal steel guitarists..
I'll bet on conventional pedal style he would blow 90% of us "steelers" out of the water ability wise. He just chooses to play what made him famous! If I were in RR's shoes, I woulds do EXACTLY what he is doing... He is playing to his "base"... Hey it worked for President Bush in nov....right??

You go with what GOT you there!.... bob[This message was edited by Bob Carlucci on 11 February 2005 at 05:49 AM.]

Dustin Rigsby · Post by **Dustin Rigsby** » 11 Feb 2005 5:56 am

That is the way the sacred style is played folks....it's just different,that's all. I had the blessing of seeing the Amazing Grace Praise Band with Del Ray Grace on steel. He never touched a pedal,but he STILL BLEW ME AWAY ! He was also mighty interested in the E9 pedal style as well. The Sacred Style has only been brought to public knowledge in the past few years,but,it has been played that way since the middle of the last century. Change is good,and the grass is green on BOTH SIDES of the fence. Did you cry because
Eric Clapton didn't play it like Chet ?

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D.S. Rigsby
Wilcox SD10 3&5
http://www.touchinglittlelives.org

Jim Peters · Post by **Jim Peters** » 11 Feb 2005 6:02 am

Saw RR on Conan last night doing Purple Haze. Great band, great performance, lotsa fun,but doesn't trip my pedal steel trigger. He is a fun guy to watch. JP

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 11 Feb 2005 6:07 am

I'm with you Skip. I also think that Randolph is very talented and excellent at what he does. But at the same time I think that what he does is a bit limited in nature and think that he would be better if he broadened his repetoire to include harmonic oriented steel guitar using the guitar's full potential with knee levers and pedals. I don't want to put him down too much because I'm sure that personally he is a great guy. I just think that the steel's potential if far beyond what he is using it for. I do enjoy his playing.[This message was edited by Kevin Hatton on 11 February 2005 at 06:08 AM.][This message was edited by Kevin Hatton on 11 February 2005 at 06:09 AM.]

Robert Porri · Post by **Robert Porri** » 11 Feb 2005 6:38 am

I don't think I've contributed to any of the Robert Randolph threads before. I've only seen a few clips of him on the internet and a few songs in the Clapton "Crossroads" DVD. I greatly enjoyed what I heard and saw. I was not wildly knocked off my feet, but I only saw a little of what he could do. He seems to be an awesome showman and a very good young musician. I've only been playing PSG for a year, but have been playing guitar for 40 years and to some degree know the styles he is drawing from. I enjoy playing and listening to all styles of music. I've bought about 1 CD a month (of Pedal Steel) in the last year. I don't have a Robert Randolph CD yet, but I look forward to buying one soon. I guess the point I'd like to make is that I think there is plenty of room in this world for all sorts of styles of Pedal Steel playing. Not all styles are going to be for everyone. What's more, there are going to be all levels of abillities within those styles. I guess expressing opinions is just that. Sometimes though, I just don't get it. You don't have to like someone's style, playing, songs, use of effects etc. to realize they ARE putting PSG out to the public. It seems obvious that PSG is an instrument that (in my opinion) is greatly under estimated and under appreciated by the general public, largely because it has been seen as fitting into only a few styles by most people. In the past year, I've been exposed to much of what this incredible instrument is capable of. I'm dabbling in a lot of different styles myself, and although I am a total hack, every once in awhile, even at my level, a sound comes out of this thing that surprises me. Anybody can say whatever they want, but, it is also obvious (to me) that someone like Robert Randolph IS having an impact on the awareness of PSG with the public. Once "in", nomatter what style gets someone "in", they will be more open to the instrument in general in other styles of music. I only see Robert Randolph's influence as a positive one for PSG.

Bob P.[This message was edited by Robert Porri on 11 February 2005 at 06:43 AM.]

Jerry Overstreet · Post by **Jerry Overstreet** » 11 Feb 2005 6:41 am

The great thing about most steel players is that we have very fervent feelings about the instrument we have chosen. That's all good.
Maybe the reason things get so heated sometimes is that we care so much about the instrument and our heroes that have influenced us.

However, we say we want wider acceptance throughout the music world for the steel as a legitimate instrument....yet when someone comes along with something different, it causes an uproar! With all due respect to the dissenters, you can't have it both ways.

This should be about a style of music rather than the instrument that style is played on. For the most part, the gripe here about RR is the style of music he plays.

One wouldn't expect the guitar or the piano or the violin to be restricted to one style of music, would they? If it was a style of music one didn't like, they'd simply choose not to listen. And one has every right to not like it and to say so.

I have the utmost respect for the steel guitar community represented here...just a great bunch of people, but it's really nobody's business but Robert's what music he plays and what instrument he chooses to play it on. The fact that he may not be seen using all the pedals, levers and strings and that his tuning is different is irrelevant.

I don't know about his expertise in the traditional style, but it doesn't matter. The things that we have seen him do just don't lend themselves to that style anyway.
I don't see the reason for debate on whether he can or not.

No offense meant to anyone here, and sorry for using up so much of your thread Skip. These are just the thoughts and opinions I have to share on the RR debate. JO [This message was edited by Jerry Overstreet on 11 February 2005 at 06:45 AM.]

David L. Donald · Post by **David L. Donald** » 11 Feb 2005 6:44 am

Simple enough he has found a great market
and is working it like a pro.

If it' ain't your style of steel TOUGH luck he's working in the big time,
and a ton of kids are digging it...

And there AIN'T NO OTHER steel player doing that.
And don't say PF, with Dire Straits, because he is just a guest virtuoso sideman. And isn't out front all year long.

He clearly can do more,
but his audience isn't advanced enough, yet, to dig that.

You don't poop where your eat,
when riding in the big top show.
In 10 years the cat will be doing his signature tunes still,
but will have stretched out a whole lot.

So yeah, it's you.[This message was edited by David L. Donald on 11 February 2005 at 06:46 AM.]

Jack Abraham · Post by **Jack Abraham** » 11 Feb 2005 6:47 am

Just curious if anyone saw RR last night on Austin City Limits? There were three other gentlemen playing steels/lap steels with him - some interesting stuff.

Klaus Caprani · Post by **Klaus Caprani** » 11 Feb 2005 7:18 am

I always admired when guitarists were able to create pedal-steel sounds on standart guitars. Here is apparantly a guy who's able to create standart guitar sounds on a pedal steel

I like RR. But alright. It ain't country (and it doesn't need to be IMHO

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Klaus Caprani

MCI RangeXpander S-10 3x4
www.klauscaprani.com

Drew Howard · Post by **Drew Howard** » 11 Feb 2005 7:42 am

<sigh>

Times change, and the players with them, Skip. Next time change the channel.

Drew

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Gazornktron T-16 w/ FranistatSUX2000 mod

Len Amaral · Post by **Len Amaral** » 11 Feb 2005 7:48 am

Maybe RR could do 1 song in his concert that features the steel in a different or more traditional style for contrast?

If one song flops with his market audience, then stop doing it and no harm done.

If we all drove a Rolls Royce, the guy driving a Honda Civic would get noticed.

J J Harmon · Post by **J J Harmon** » 11 Feb 2005 7:49 am

This is kind of like two of my cube mates. One is former Methodist playing organ at a Moravian Church and the other is former Moravian attending a contemporary Baptist Church. And no they are just the opposite Dem vs Rep.

Keith Cordell · Post by **Keith Cordell** » 11 Feb 2005 7:51 am

It might pay some of the dissenters to consider the tradition that RR comes out of; He is not a country player, and likely has no interest in it. He is a lap steel player who adopted pedals as an additional tool to play sacred steel, a style that bears little resemblance to what most of us have experienced with the instrument. I don't hear anyone slamming David Lindley, though most of what he plays is only marginally steel oriented; Harry Manx and the India players like Debashish or vishwa Mohan Bhatt, who only use one string at a time with the slide, and incorporate drones. RR is the first pedal steeler to take the instrument to a completely different place in quite awhile. Granted, he does live in the "flash zone" much of the time, but that is what his audience demands from him, and his respect for his forebears is unparalleled. He has not only made a name for himself, but players like Aubrey Ghent, Darick Coleman and many others have benefitted immensely from RR's exposing the instrument to a new crowd.

Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 11 Feb 2005 7:58 am

Jerry I have always thought that a concert violinest looks down on a country fiddle player.Are some country steel players looking down at steel players that play a different style? I read into it that it's the old country music players that complain about someone playing a different style. Joe[This message was edited by Joe Miraglia on 11 February 2005 at 08:04 AM.]

Skip Mertz · Post by **Skip Mertz** » 11 Feb 2005 8:06 am

Just an aside here. I'm not bashing RR really for him doing what he does. In fact I bought a Gospel steel Cd a cpl yrs ago and really like some of the things that were done. I personally dont listen to much country music. I prefer to play pop tunes,Eagles, show tunes and am working on some light jazz and even play Malequena on the steel. What I think is grating, as it would be with any instrument using SOOO much distortion that it covers up alot of mistakes and doesnt show me what that player can do. For me its about tone and feeling.

Steinar Gregertsen · Post by **Steinar Gregertsen** » 11 Feb 2005 8:17 am

I don't know where this idea that distortion covers up mistakes comes from, in my experience it requires an even better control over picking and especially string damping. It's not any easier at all.

Steinar

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www.gregertsen.com

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 11 Feb 2005 8:32 am

If you don't like it, don't listen to it!

Is that too hard for some people to grasp?

Terry Edwards · Post by **Terry Edwards** » 11 Feb 2005 8:36 am

Would we feel better if Robert took the pedals off and just called it a slide guitar.

I wonder if there was this much controversy when the first guitarist decided not to use his fingers to fret the instrument but instead, drag a glass pill bottle or a butter knife handle across the strings.

John Lennon didn't worry about mis-playing his instrument when he intentionally used feedback for the first time on "I Feel Fine".

Rock guitarists in the 80's (Eddie VanHalen) used their right hand to tap on the fret board.

Buddy Emmons used a country and Hawaiian instrument in Jazz.

Bob Dylan showed up at a folk festival sporting a Stratocaster.

Earl Scruggs employed a device on his tuners to raise the pitch on his banjo strings.

The Beatles and George Martin pioneered multitrack recording techniques to make records that were much more than just a recording of a band's performance.

Ray Charles didn't sing a popular American anthem the way it was supposed to be sung.

Robert Randolf plays a pedal steel and chooses to utized the pedals sparingly and play the instrument in his own style.

"Innovation" is just something that some musicians and artists are driven to do. I for one am thankful that some choose to challenge the boundaries and experiment with music. It inevitably results in change - sometimes progress and sometimes not. It does keep music moving and some folks are not comfortable with this. This is where controversy comes in. Progressive vs. tradition. There's room for it all and all of it is available on CDs and Satellite Radio. Make your choices and be happy.

Terry
[This message was edited by Terry Edwards on 11 February 2005 at 08:36 AM.]

Jim Ives · Post by **Jim Ives** » 11 Feb 2005 8:39 am

Robert Randolph got on the cover of Guitar Player magazine last summer, with a whole article dedicated to him and the steel guitar. I haven't seen or heard of many steel players to do that latlely. Therefore he is promoting the pedal steel. And, he plays it like he fels it, which is what more of us should be doing.
-Jim

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Mullen D-10 -or- Zum D-10
Lexicon MPX 100
Fulltone Full-Drive II
Evans FET 500 -or-
Peavey Nashville 1000
Vox wah-wah pedal
My dog Toby sittin' on the floor listening

Webb Kline · Post by **Webb Kline** » 11 Feb 2005 8:41 am

Anymore, it's hard to go to a country concert and here the steeler have a chance to play anything above the level of what most of us could do in a year or two of playing. That's how suppressed the steel has gotten in country music.

But, I hardly ever hear anyone complaining about the fact that so and so didn't play great with Cowboy John last night. As long as they play with the tone we are expecting to hear and as long as they are playing our kind of music, it matters not to us how bored to death some of them are playing the exact same thing every night and not being allowed to cut loose and show off.

If Robert can break us out of this moratoruim on the steel guitar that seems to have been forced on us by the record industry, then he could wind up being our hero.

There's one thing about it, that boy is a long ways from being bored on stage. I know some pickers who are sidemen for the pros who envy him. Like one of them told me, "At least he gets to play."

Jim Phelps · Post by **Jim Phelps** » 11 Feb 2005 8:49 am

Good post, Terry, but the one who developed multitrack recording was Les Paul.