about ready to give up

Calvin Walley · Post by **Calvin Walley** » 10 Nov 2003 5:05 pm

i am just about ready to give up on learning the pedal steel . no matter how much i pratice the note just will not sound like any of the file's that i have down loaded from the web. i have checked , checked and rechecked to make sure that my steel is in tune that doesn't help . i can pratice till my arms fall off but i cant get that crying sound. trying to play by the tabs that i find on the web is just a waste of time , i have downloaded the tab for "togather again" from the web and a sound file of the same song i don't belive that the tab can be made to sound like it should sound...practice alone can't be the answer...
sign me frustrated in Colorado [This message was edited by Calvin Walley on 10 November 2003 at 08:17 PM.]

John Bresler R.I.P. · Post by **John Bresler R.I.P.** » 10 Nov 2003 5:18 pm

Don't give up, it'll come. I'm not sure where Colorado City is, but Dick Meis is a good Colorado contact. He lives in the Denver area and his web site is www.steelguitarstore.com. He is a professional steel player, great instructor, a really nice person and he could probably help you in the learning process.

Attend the Denver steel jams when you can, also. Dick Meis sponsors them and many of the steel players from Colorado perform there.

Chuck Lettes is another contact for you. He also lives in the Denver area. Most of these guys will give you lots of advice and show you what you probably need to get the country steel sound you are searching for.

It just takes lots of time and practice.

Bill Ford · Post by **Bill Ford** » 10 Nov 2003 5:19 pm

Calvin,
If you can find a steel player in your area,have him/her play a tab for you and then you play it and maybe see what you are doing wrong...Don't give up yet,besides "Together Again" is not the tune to start with,it has some tricky phrasing in it....How long have you been playing????

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Bill Ford

Eric West · Post by **Eric West** » 10 Nov 2003 5:28 pm

Dont give up.

If you can hear the difference in what you're playing and what you want it to sound like, you are admitting that you know what you want to sound like, and all that's separating you from it is watching somebody else do it. Tab is a real tricky thing to read, and is not 100% right all the time.

As above it's ESSENTIAL to take even a couple lessons from a LIVE human being, or at least find out where one is playing and go up and buttonhole him on a break. If he won't take the time to show you a couple simple things, then he's not worthy to sit behind one.

With the Steel more than any other instrument, it's "Monkey See Monkey Do."

The first few lessons I took from a HOF member were things that had nothing to do with the "crying sound". The only "crying sound" for a few months came from me as I hitch hiked around the beltway back from the lessons...

It's worth it.

Girls LOVE it!

EJL[This message was edited by Eric West on 10 November 2003 at 05:30 PM.]

Calvin Walley · Post by **Calvin Walley** » 10 Nov 2003 8:10 pm

thanks folks ... i live in colorado city its about 20 miles south of pueblo and about 100 miles south of denver. i just started playing 5 months ago . i got the book the easist steel country songs . about the only thing in it that i can do justice to is " amazing grace" everything else i am getting from the internet. in jan or feb i am moving to myrtle beach south carolina . i truly enjoy playing with the steel and at this point i know that i am not going to be anywhere near good on it . but i would at least expect to be able to think that i was making progress... all you folks on the forum have been great at putting up with my questions [This message was edited by Calvin Walley on 10 November 2003 at 08:13 PM.]

Jody Sanders · Post by **Jody Sanders** » 10 Nov 2003 9:18 pm

Hi Calvin, As has been said, don't give up. This is a strange inst. Five months is not considered a long time when learning pedal steel. Give yourself at least a year with some pro help. Dick Meis or Chuck Lettes would be great help for you. Attend all the shows you can and any of the players will help you. I have been teaching many years and few students "see the light" until about a year. Hang in there. Come to the Texas Show in March and I will help you . Best regards, Jody.

Scott Henderson · Post by **Scott Henderson** » 10 Nov 2003 9:48 pm

hey buddy,
hang in there... play it from your heart. Don't worry about trying to imitate a tab just keep playing and let the feel of the guitar come out ...and believe me it will just keep after it. Give it time and believe in yourself..it's there hang on !!!

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Steelin' away in the ozarks and life,
Scott
www.scottyhenderson.com

Brett Day · Post by **Brett Day** » 10 Nov 2003 10:17 pm

Calvin, I am a steel guitarist who has cerebral palsy in my left hand and I've learned that the pedal steel is one of the most demanding instruments to play. Do the best you can on steel. It takes a lot of practice to play the steel. A lot of steel players will tell you that practicing for a few hours every day is very important. Don't give up on steel. Do your best. Brett Day, Emmons S-10, Morrell lapsteel

Brett Day · Post by **Brett Day** » 10 Nov 2003 10:19 pm

And always play from the heart. Brett Day, Emmons S-10, Morrell lapsteel

David Cobb · Post by **David Cobb** » 10 Nov 2003 10:49 pm

Calvin, if I had a nickel for every time that little voice in my head asked me "Who are you kidding, you're never gonna get this" I coulda bought the White House.
Maybe you've heard that voice too.
Don't listen to it.
There's obviously something deep inside of you that you want to express thru a pedal steel, it would be a shame to hold in.
You may get the feeling that the guitar is playing you rather than the other way around, but that can change.
I'm a relative newbie myself and as Slick Willie would say, "I feel your pain."
If you would email me your address, I have some stuff to send you that might be helpful.

John Floyd · Post by **John Floyd** » 11 Nov 2003 1:06 am

Get with Chuck Lettes, he's a great teacher.
I've seen his seminars at Saluda SC and he can Flatten out the Steep Learning curve you have ahead of you.

When you move to Myrtle Beach, There are quite a few Steelers in that area. The Saluda Shows are Legendary, 4 times a year and You can meet all kinds of steelers and Attend Seminars by Chuck and Jeff Newman. Saluda is about a 3 hour drive from Myrtle Beach.

Brett Day just gave you some good advice, Always play from the heart.

Also, knowing where to go to get the right information is half the battle and you've made a good first start by coming to this forum.

John

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<a href='http://www.smileycentral.com/?partner=ZSzeb008' target='_blank'><img src='http://smileys.smileycentral.com/cat/4/4_7_3.gif' border=0></a><a target='_blank' href='http://www.mymailsignature.com'>
<img src='http://www.mymailsignature.com/fwpdata/ ... CFAsig.png' border=0></a>[This message was edited by John Floyd on 11 November 2003 at 01:21 AM.]

Winnie Winston · Post by **Winnie Winston** » 11 Nov 2003 2:08 am

First question: Have you played any instrument before steel?
Having an experience with another instrument is a good thing to have.
Second: The web is great. This forum is great. But I can't imagine learing to play steel with only tab and mp3 tracks. You MUST get to see a live player.
Also, trying to play a thing like "Together Again" as a early point will be very frustrating.
When I was learning I had a few things:
1. Neil Flanz "talk you through" record of fills and turnarounds.
2. A few good country records (Conway Twitty, Kitty Wells, Loretta Lynn, etc.) all which had steel but not always right out front. I played along with them a lot. The steel is not about "intros and licfks" it is about filling behind a singer and making it sound beautiful.
3. A country music park within 50 miles where I could see good players.
4. A few honky-tonk bars with bands which had steel players. Most weren't very good, but they were better than me!

Keep working on it.

Winnie

Olivier Dufays · Post by **Olivier Dufays** » 11 Nov 2003 2:43 am

Hello Calvin,

I'm new to the pedal steel guitar and new here (see "beginner saying Hello !" topic).
I'm like you, in the same situation, I'm looking for this "crying sound" that only the pedal steel (with a good player !) can produce.
But as I play guitar, I know that "long is the road and hard is the way".

I've just seen a sample video on http://www.steelguitar.net/ (New video series ... ) and that's what I'm looking for.
I live in France and it's not easy to find a teatcher, so I have to practice (alone) a lot to reach a high level.
And so do you !!
It will take lots of time to play with feeling, but that's the price to pay !

I you, in the "pedal steel guitar country" you give up, what about me ?!?!

So don't give up and play, learn, play, see, play, ...
If it was easy, everybody would play pedal steel guitar !

Best regards
olivier

Chris Forbes · Post by **Chris Forbes** » 11 Nov 2003 3:24 am

Calvin, when you get to South Carolina, look up Dean Black. Fiiiiiiiiiine picker!!! maybe he could give you some pointers/lessons.

George Kimery · Post by **George Kimery** » 11 Nov 2003 4:43 am

Calvin, the pedal steel is a very slow learning curve instrument. That is why there are so few steel players. Most people give up too soon. I made a commitment when I started to practice 2 to 3 hours EVERY day for a year, then decide at that point if I wanted to continue. This was in 1968 when there was nothing available to learn by except listening to records. Today, with all the video instruction and other courses available, it is much easier to get off on the right foot. As others have said, nothing is like personal instruction. You don't want to learn bad habits that will be hard to break later. It sounds like you are pretty well where you should be after only playing 5 months. The fact that you can play a song, I think is very encouraging at this point. Your are right about tab being difficult, especially if you don't have it on a CD or tape so you can listen to the phrasing. At your stage in learning the steel, it may be just impossible to do without hearing what it is supposed to sound like. I don't think that you realized that the pedal steel is one of the most difficult instruments in the world to play and that you have expectations that are just too high on conquering it fast. We have all been where you are at and know exactly how frustrated you feel. Think ahead 5 or 10 years that you will be playing well. Stop now, and look back in 5 or 10 years and you will think if you had stuck with it, you would be playing good now. It all depends on how bad you want to play the steel as to how much commitment, practice, and patience you have. Make no mistake, it is a long, slow road, but a lot of nice scenery along the way. Enjoy the ride but don't get your expectations of learning quickly too high.

Bill Stafford · Post by **Bill Stafford** » 11 Nov 2003 5:09 am

I have been "giving up" for over sixty years.
Just practice doing a smooth C scale on strings three and five starting on the third fret with pedals down and run through the scale to the fifteenth fret-backwards and forward. You will start hearing "tunes" develop as you change the meter of the scale throughout the exercise. Anyway, just keep having to "give up" and you will discover a lot of new things to do, and you wll realize "wow, that was simple". Doesn't get "simple" without lots of practice though.
Tabs are tough to lean the feeling with, but they do show you the mechanics. Being able to play smooth scales, will make people want to listen to you play. there are a lot of tabs with the various scales. Get the mechanics down and then throw the tab away and do it your way...

Bill Stafford

C Dixon · Post by **C Dixon** » 11 Nov 2003 5:50 am

mega dittos Bill,

Only one difference between you and I. I am still practicing. Dear friend, you long since made it. Few players have the touch and finness' you have achieved.

To Calvin, I suspect just about all have experienced what you are going thru. Except of course greats like Jerry Byrd or Buddy Emmons. Somehow I believe the first time they ever played it, pure gold came out of their steels.

But for most of the rest of us, frustration is the name of the game. And for most of us, the nice part is, the frustrations become less and less each day. That when the joy comes in.

May Jesus bless you in your quests,

carl

Earl Yarbro · Post by **Earl Yarbro** » 11 Nov 2003 5:53 am

Calvin, sounds to me like you're about to get it. You know what you are looking for. Try a little longer and remember, we all can't be Tom Brumley, but what a great goal to shoot for. Hang in there Cal.

Earl Yarbro

CrowBear Schmitt · Post by **CrowBear Schmitt** » 11 Nov 2003 6:41 am

when i'm about to give up is when it's time to keep on goin'
Perseverance Calvin, Perseverance
you'll see.....it's worth it

JAMES BANKS · Post by **JAMES BANKS** » 11 Nov 2003 6:41 am

Calvin, don't give up. I have been hammering away at steel really hard for 10 years. I had the priveledge (thanks to a wonderful wife) to spend 3 days with Jeff Newman at his Top Gun school. I came away wondering why that stuff did not seem so easy before. Jeff says steel is a time machine, you spend lots of time with it and some day when you sit down, things just start to happen. He has a sign in his cabin that says "education is hanging around til you catch on." Some time spent with a good teacher can give you a new outlook. I can play things now I could not get close to before last summer. As someone posted already, work on the simple scales over and over again. Pick the steps one at a time, try pick and slide to the next step, etc, you will start to hear things from your guitar you hear on recordings. Good luck

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Charles Curtis · Post by **Charles Curtis** » 11 Nov 2003 7:16 am

Try "milking those pedals" and focus on the sound you want; keep at it. I like the videos by Jay Dee Maness and Tommy White with this type of direction etc. and I'm sure there are others.

Don Ricketson · Post by **Don Ricketson** » 11 Nov 2003 7:34 am

Calvin, I have a friend that lives in Pueblo West that I know would be glad to help you. He's not an inbstructor, but just a super good guy and player that could give you some good pointers. His name is Donnie Duncan. Email me and I'll give you his telephone number. He's not on the internet...Don.

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Mullen D10-8/5
Sho-Bud S10-3/4
Evans Amps
"Making The Stars Shine"

Bill Llewellyn · Post by **Bill Llewellyn** » 11 Nov 2003 7:46 am

I agree... a few instructional videos (in addition to some personal lessons, which are crucial) would be great. Do be careful to pick beginner's videos, though. Jeff Newman http://www.jeffran.com and Joe Wright http://www.pedalsteel.com have some available. I also have JayDee's and Tommy White's tapes and they are both fabulous; note that JayDee's material is kind of for an intermediate player and Tommy's is for the established player, which certainly intimidated me, at least! (After demonstrating one lick, Tommy lookes at the camera with a wry smile and says, "good luck!")

Also, Winnie Winston has a very good instructional book available. See http://www.scottysmusic.com/miscinst.htm

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Bill, steelin' since '99 | Steel page | My music | Steelers' birthdays | Over 50?

[This message was edited by Bill Llewellyn on 11 November 2003 at 07:47 AM.]

Lawrence Sullivan · Post by **Lawrence Sullivan** » 11 Nov 2003 7:48 am

Calvin, I am 63 yrs young and just starting myself, we went to the St Louis Convention and I got the bug and I have a couple suggestions
1 Don't compare your playing to the pros, imagine how many years, just add the hours for fifty years, of their lives have been spent practicing
2
Get a good starting video, such as Jeff Newmans, then maybe you won't learn bad habits that you have to break and start learning all over

3 Pick out a simple tune, learn it just using the frets, then experiment with the pedals, etc till you see how they fit in
The pros invented these so they knew what they were after when they worked them up, we have to learn it

4 Read this forum religiously, there is a wealth of information here and all the members are great to help out with your questions
I was fortunate enough, one member, Bill Mayville kinda "took me under his wing", has been emailing me lots of stuff useful to a beginer, maybe someone experienced who has the time will do the same for you

5 On the light side, we can always set these things up with a crank on the end, put a belt in it like the player pianos, and get a monkey and set up on a busy corner

Good luck, maybe we will be Steelin yet

Larry

Tom Althoff · Post by **Tom Althoff** » 11 Nov 2003 10:47 am

Don't give up Calvin!

I taught myself how to play bass through videos. I'm sloppy and need improvement but it gave me immediate gratification from the first time I tried it.

The pedal steel is another animal altogether. I agree with John Bressler.. Try a Dick Meis video. I have been playing for less time than you...less than 1 month. I've purchased 2 instructional videos (so far). One was so bad I returned it. The other was Dick Meis'. His production quality is high. At one point there are something like 5 camera angles on screen at one time. You can watch a close up of his left hand, right hand, feet/knees and full body shot. He takes you from unpacking the guitar and setting it up to knocking it down again and storing it. Nearly as good as having a human being show you live. At some point I know I cannot rely only on the kindnees of those PSG'ers here who have answered my e-mails, sent me tapes, tabs hints etc. The generous guys on this forum will give you the shirt off their backs! (The gals are just as generous but prefer keeping their shirts on thank you very much!) But nothing beats sitting along side someone and accepting his critism and watching him closely...interrupting him whenever you want. Spend some money on a live instructor. Take at least 4 lessons with him/her.

Once I've spent some time with mine I'll pay someone somewhere (NYC maybe?) to slap me in the back of the head and yell "Once more WITH FEELING THIS TIME!" until I get it right.

By the way...I think there is a law against giving up pedal steel after only 5 months.

The "I give up" formula I use is
Take:
Average age the greats got 1st PSG (9-15)
Subtract:
How old they were when they were "good" (25)

25-15 = 10.

So you have to give yourself 10 years before you can be qualified to judge if you can't do it. Personally I've got 15 years aside before retirment. By the end of those 15 years I'll either be playing bridge or the PSG and I hate bridge.

Good luck to you Calvin!