US clubs that feature bands where are they?

Douglas Hudson · Post by **Douglas Hudson** » 13 Jul 2002 8:27 am

I have been watching posts from forumites talking about the loss of 5 and 6 niter clubs that hire bands. Surely there are some out there in the US. This is almost disheartening to see this era of country music go by the wayside. Even more disheartening is to see a band break up due to lack of jobs. Where are the new stars going to come from? I am sure there will be some, but lacking stage experience I am sure. Any and all commments on this subject will be greatly appreciated

Donny Hinson · Post by **Donny Hinson** » 13 Jul 2002 9:10 am

There are still jobs in this area (greater Baltimore), but they're not nearly as many, now. Where you used to drive less than 25 miles to keep working, most bands that work steady (3 or more jobs/week) have to travel 100-150 miles for one or two-nighters. For the kind of pay they're offering now, it hardly seems worth it.

If you want to work steady in this area (but not travel a lot), then you'd better be doing it for the love of just playing...and not for making money! Just 25 years ago, there were 30 to 40 clubs that had music 2 or 3 nights a week (that were only a half-hours' drive away). Now, there might be 5 or 6.

Kevin Hatton · Post by **Kevin Hatton** » 13 Jul 2002 10:06 am

The musicians only have themselves to blame. Most of the country bands I see out there are ill equipped, unrehearsed, badly dressed and play like crap. The good ones with real talent stick out like a sore thumb and never lack for work.

John Steele · Post by **John Steele** » 13 Jul 2002 11:23 am

This afternoon I stopped into a club I work ocassionally for lunch. Someone had told me about this band that was there last night and the great piano player they had, so I had to check it out.
What did I find ? A three-piece band working for the same wage as the 5 piece I work with, with most of the band generated from a backup tape. There was no piano player in the band at all. It was a tape. I could hardly believe it.
I have to respectfully disagree, Kevin. This has infinitely more to do with the appalling stupidity of the general public than anything to do with the musicians.
Why in the world would I put more time and energy into rehearsing, dressing, etc, to work for substandard wages when the patrons are just as happy with a tape or a Karaoke machine ?
-John

Joe Smith · Post by **Joe Smith** » 13 Jul 2002 12:57 pm

I guess I'm one of the lucky ones. I have 15 dates booked over the next 3 months. Mostly clubs. At my age(65)I don't want to work any more than this.

Chad Smith · Post by **Chad Smith** » 13 Jul 2002 1:23 pm

The musicians only have themselves to blame. Most of the country bands I see out there are ill equipped, unrehearsed, badly dressed and play like crap. The good ones with real talent stick out like a sore thumb and never lack for work.

Kevin, I have to respectfully disagree with you on this one. I moved cross-country last year and have found the same conditions that are described in the other posts on both sides of the country, although the problems are different here than there. On the East coast, my band played an average of 80 shows per year for the last 6 years. We also averaged over 100 miles (one way) to get to each venue, and generally got $75 a person. If it weren't for my love of country music and of performing, I could have saved 2 vehicles and silenced an angry wife by playing in the basement! Here in Arizona, the scene is even worse. I got to town and looked for a band to join, and when I discovered that none were hiring I found some seasoned musicians that were willing to put something together. I'd like to address your post point by point:

Our band has invested over $10k in state of the art PA equipment, including a SHURE in-ear monitor system and full (high, mid, sub) Mackie powered FOH speaker system.
We rehearsed for 2 months, and then our drummer decided that he wanted to join a touring band. After locating another suitable drummer, we have rehearsed twice weekly for the past 6 months while waiting for an opening so we'll be tight when we get the shot.
We dress very professionally.
We are all seasoned professionals, all with lead and harmony vocals and all proficient musicians. In fact, my band back east couldn't hold a candle to this group for either overall musical ability or vocal ability.
The bands that are working here are working because of who they are or who they know. Talent is not a prerequisite for working in this town!
When we try to book the group most club owners have stated that either they have gone to a DJ or Karaoke, or they are happy with the current band and don't want to change. We're at the point where $40/person would be a blessing, just to get the opportunity to perform again.

In case you're wondering what the make-up of the band is... we range from 34 to 48 yrs old and play primarily new country with some classic country (at my insistence) thrown in.

I'm the "baby" of the group and love REAL Country Music, but it worries me that the opportunities for live performance and for "carrying the torch" are diminishing rapidly. By the way, Tucson is a huge country music market with three 50,000+ watt country stations, one of which plays a lot of classics. Makes no sense at all why there are no opportunities for country bands here.

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Chad Smith

Fender B&G Bender Tele
Hot Rod Deluxe
Temporarily "Steel-less in Tucson"

Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 13 Jul 2002 3:02 pm

Kevin--If I'm off on a weekend, I would like to hear your group--what is their name? Our band, Willow Creek, plays in Western New York and Northern Pennsylvania and--so far--hasn't had any problems getting GOOD JOBS. Joe

Joe Miraglia · Post by **Joe Miraglia** » 13 Jul 2002 3:24 pm

Chad--It looks like you have a fine looking group. You shouldn't have any trouble finding work--Good Luck. The band I work with is 6 piece ranging from 25 to 62 (that's me). We play at least once every weekend,through the summer.Pay is ok better them some are getting, lucky I guess. Joe

Reggie Duncan · Post by **Reggie Duncan** » 13 Jul 2002 7:43 pm

Well, I have said it before. I play 98 nights per year, in the same club, a Christian Supper Club in Louisiana. Great complimentary musicians, mostly country gospel, some southern gospel. Both with plenty steel. Most of the guys have been with us nearly 10 years! I drive 50 miles one way. We got a call last week from the CCMA (Christian Country Music Association)in Nashville, and have been invited to play on a showcase for them in Nashville later this year! We are pretty excited!

Frank Parish · Post by **Frank Parish** » 13 Jul 2002 11:29 pm

I don't disagree with Kevin. It may that your personal band is well dressed and has great equiupment and all the rest but that's not the case with the majority of the club bands. I can't speak for all of the club bands obviously but not a single one of the bands I see here in Nashville are dressed well at all. It's tennis shoes and jeans with holes in them and they drink and even eat on stage. I'm sure it's not the case with session players here that play clubs but I'm talking about the average club bands. The bands that dress up and rehearse and are willing to spend some money on their equipment will always do better and work. In this town it's jump in there, go for what you know and rehearsals are out the window. The bands that are going to tour with an artist have to rehearse but the club bands just go out and play and they may or may not know the tunes. Arrangements are null and void too.

Chad Smith · Post by **Chad Smith** » 14 Jul 2002 4:57 am

Joe,

Thanks, all we need is that one break to show our stuff, and I hope we'll be off and running after that.

Frank,

I see your point, and I guess I was a little too quick to generalize the situation based on my limited experiences in 2 markets. I have also seen the same type of bands onstage that you describe, and it drives me crazy. I've always maintained a no eating / no drinking (alcohol) policy with all bandmembers...after all, you wouldn't do that if you were in a touring band. Lost a few good players over the last 10 years due to that, but also got compliments and work because we were very professional onstage.

Steve Stallings · Post by **Steve Stallings** » 14 Jul 2002 7:03 am

Douglas,
Reading your post is confusing. You are referencing Terry Downs post as your source for stating that "bands are losing jobs because of the loss of 5 or 6 niter clubs"??? I only bring this up because that is not what Terry is saying at all. He is saying that his band can't play 5-6 nites a week and this is what the clubs are wanting. At least that is the way I am reading it.

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Steve Stallings
Bremond, Texas

Douglas Hudson · Post by **Douglas Hudson** » 14 Jul 2002 12:17 pm

Maybe I did read the post wrong, but on the other hand I still am hearing many stories of the loss of 5 and 6 niters. Anyway I am glad that many of you have consistently found work. This is not saying that i havent been able to find work. What I have been worried about is getting back out and touring again and not being able to because of the loss of clubs.
To the dress issue I do agree that many bands out there do not dress with uniformity, ( I think uniformity is a thing of the past), or do they not dress nicely. I admit that I am working with some younger players and what they see are many stars dressing in jeans and tennis shoes on stage and they are wondering why they cant do that. I know that appearance is a very important thing and every band should dress nicely.
As far as some poorly equiped bands out there, not every one can sink the 20 grand into a system as we have. I can understand that. If a band is that bad, the owners of the club should not have hired them. Here is a quote I was told by a club owner recently and I believe this is true. He said "every musician thinks he is in the best band around" I quickly laughed and agreed with him. Of course this was after I had told him that this is the best group I have ever performed with.
I do have to say in the last several months here in my area of south east kansas I have heard many many talented groups play. I hear people saying this or that band is terrible, when I do get to hear them I am surprised to hear that the referenced band is actually very good and has a sound of its own. There are many cover bands out there doing a great job of "covering" the music out today.

Any way if I was reading the post wrong I am sorry. I still think it is terrible for this one band to break up. They definatly have put together a sound to be proud of.

Jim Florence · Post by **Jim Florence** » 14 Jul 2002 7:59 pm

Let me get my 2 cents in. All you guys have some good points, However I'm 70, and I can remember when all beer joints had a live band. I've played with some of the best, and some of the worst. Remember the days when the lead singer would get too drunk to continue after the first set? and I'm thinking of some of those who later became Big stars. I'll restrain myself from mentioning any names. But in some ways I miss those days. Mothers against drunk drivers {MADD} are mainly responsible for the change{and I can't blame them} but the fact remains that at most venues the police are waiting for someone to emerge from the
building and get into the car, they have an automatic conviction, and many states now have laws where the bartender can be charged with a crime for having served the drink to the driver. We have lived through the glorious days of country music, and they are going, going, almost gone. The pedal steel guitar needs another Sleepwalk, or Steel Guitar Rag, most people don't even know what the instrument is.
Jim[This message was edited by Jim Florence on 14 July 2002 at 09:03 PM.]

Bobby Bensley · Post by **Bobby Bensley** » 15 Jul 2002 12:09 am

Here is contact info for a couple of venues in Northeastern Colorado that are still booking bands by the week

Sundance Steak House and Saloon 970.484.1600
This is a big club that seats 600 easily and likely a lot more. It is located in Ft. Collins Colorado and is a Country Music only venue.

White Buffalo 970.593.1661
Another very large club seating several hundred. Primarily Country though they do bring in some Blues and rocks bands on occasion. They also tend to book a fair share of Heritage acts for one nighters. This club is in Loveland Colorado

Here are some other clubs that are great for filling out that Coloraod, New Mexico, Oklahoma, Arizona, Texas loop.

Grizzly Rose 303.295.1330
I believe this one is mostly one nighters these days and is a pretty high profile house. All the names come through it at least once a year and a lot of acts have been discovered on the stage of Denver Colorado' Grizzly Rose.

Mishawaka 970.482.4420
A great venue in the Rockies just west of Ft. Collins Colorado it is a wonderful place to gig. Nestled along side the scenic Poudre Rive this Lodge Pole Pine outdoor amphitheater is one of my favorite gig locations. I have been fortunate to play this venue several times and it is always a great time.

Duke of Windsor 970.686.5775
Located in Windsor Colorado just east of I-25 and Loveland Colorado The Duke is a great house with exceptional management. Mostly a Classic Rock club that books bands for 2-3 nights at a time. It is a farm town with a large influx of college kids from CSU in Ft. Collins at times.

I produced a 3 day 42 act charity festival there last August and will attest that owners Rick and Kathy Best are two of the best venue operators I have ever had the privilege to work with.

Archer's Backstreet 970.223.1195
This venue is booked by the VP of Marketing of my company CMAP Music International. Seating about 200 this Ft. Collins Colorado Club has become one of the hottest destinations for rock bands in the state.

Soiled Dove 303.299.0100
Denver’s Soiled Dove is one of the premier stages in the City. Featuring one night engagements of everything from Hard Rock and Punk to Solo Singer Songwriters. Built like an indoor amphitheater with a great house sound system this club seats 400 and is located across the street from Coors Field in the entertainment rich Lo-Do section of the city. Booked by a fine lady ( Sharon Rawls) this is one of the top clubs in Denver.

Other venues in the Northern Colorado area of note include.

Estes Park
Lonigans 970.586.6186

Evergreen
Little Bear 303.674.9991

Timnath
Colorado Feed and Grain 970.493.7811

For a fairly comprehensive listing of venues in Northern Colorado visit <a href=http://www.scenemagazine.info/venues.htm>Scene Magazine</a>

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Bobby Bensley -JavaMusic A&R

[This message was edited by Bobby Bensley on 15 July 2002 at 01:23 AM.][This message was edited by Bobby Bensley on 15 July 2002 at 01:26 AM.]

Tony Farr · Post by **Tony Farr** » 15 Jul 2002 3:47 am

Bobby, would any of those clubs in Ft.Collins,Co, be owned by a guy named George Kent. I've known him since he was about 10 years old, and heard he owned a club there in Ft. Collins.

Leroy Riggs · Post by **Leroy Riggs** » 15 Jul 2002 4:20 am

Bobby,

In Denver, you can add Ac'es on north Federal, a well know club that supports bands with 3-nighters, Club Corners and Rocking West on W. 44th, Fat Fenders on old Hampden and Sports Inn in Sheridan. There are probably a few others but they are dropping like flies.

It's interesting that the bands that are doing the most work stay very close to traditional country. Top 40 bands have a hard time drawing. I am with a top 40 band now and we are getting very few gigs.

Someone mentioned eariler that they dressed professionally. This can't be spoken loudly enough. The clubs want bands who dress nice.

Douglas Hudson · Post by **Douglas Hudson** » 15 Jul 2002 11:59 am

This is great information folks. This is the kind of stuff many people are looking for. Thanks for your posts.