Fender 40 watt Tube Amp.

Rick Collins · From: Claremont , CA USA

I'm considering the Fender Vibrolux Reverb amp. for Fender Dual Eight Pro. and Fender Stringmaster.

The amp is a 40 watt tube, with two 10" Jensen speakers.

What's your opinion on this amp?

Many thanks in advance, Rick

David Doggett · Posted 13 Jan 2005 3:30 pm

This is one of the most common and most sought-after tube amps in the 6-stringer vintage amp market, and that runs the price up higher than the larger (and originally more expensive) Pros and Twins.

The black-face ones go for $1500 to over $2000 on EBay. 6-stringers love these because their maximum volume with the "crunch" and touch sensitive distortion they love is just right for small clubs. For playing with a lap steel and no volume pedal, this could be okay, if you like some distortion. For pedal steel they suck, because of the distortion at low volume.

The silver face ones go for $600 to over a thousand. They are less desirable for 6-stringers, because of the higher volume required to get distortion. These can be good for low to moderate volume steel with a volume pedal. Not bad for a small, lightweight, tube practice amp. However, their 10" speakers are very bright and piercing for steel - probably too much so for most steelers tastes. There is room in the cab. for a 12" speaker, but be sure it is 4 ohm to maintain what little volume you have. Putting one of these chassis in a custom-made cab. with a lightweight 4 ohm 15" speaker would make a killer low-volume gig and practice amp. I have tried one of these at home, running a speaker cord to my 4 ohm 15" Emminence speaker - absolutely gorgeous. Some day, when money permits, I will get one of these and put it in a custom-made 15" combo cab. It would probably blow away a NV 112 in tone and volume, and not be much heavier. It would makes the Peavey Delta Blues sound like a toy. Unfortunately the Delta Lite 15" speaker only comes in 8 ohms, and most 15" speakers are heavy-duty and heavy-weight, which sort of defeats the purpose. If you decide to go this 15" cab. route, look for a SF Vibrolux with a really beat up stock cab. and a correspondingly low price-tag.

The more recent Custom Vibrolux goes for $400 to $600 on the used market. I haven't tried one, but it probably has the crappy pc-board sound of other recent Fender tube amps. However, for a practice or low-volume amp, one might sound pretty good with a 15" speaker.

Joe E · From: Houston Texas

Dave, are you saying that amps with PC boards are crappy sounding, or are you saying (and I hope you are) that the current amps being produced by fender (which currently use PCB's) sound crappy?

There is absoulutely no evidence that PTP wiring acutally sounds better than PCB. The components a MFC uses on PCB may be a different story.

Thanks,

Joe

David Doggett · Posted 17 Jan 2005 8:06 pm

Joe, I was a doubter once myself. I don't know if it is the PCB printed circuits themselves, or their design, or other components in these amps. I have had two Custom Vibrasonic Reverbs from the '90s, and in spite of having the same tubes, they did not have the warm sound of my silver-face Pro Reverb, Dual, Twin, and Super Twin (has a retro black face, but inside is a late model SF with the ultralinear transformer). I play all of them through one or two 15" speakers. The PCB amps especially did not sound great at top volume, and they didn't seem to have as much volume, in spite of similar ratings.

Although the SFs were made after the CBS takeover of Fender, and are frequently lumped with the later PCB amps by 6-stringers, the silver-faces were point-to-point wired amps with that classic Fender tube tone. The main difference between the SFs and the black-faces is that the SFs had more clean headroom, which actually makes them much better for steel. The last of the SFs in the '70s had the ultralinear transformer and had almost twice the clean volume as the same model BF, yet still had the lush, sparkling Fender tube sound from low volume to high.

6-stringers prefer the BFs because they are a little warmer at low volumes, and have the crunch and early breakup that is great for 6-string, but bad for pedal steel. Believe me, I had a BF Super Reverb when I started on steel in the '70s. The BFs were so bad for steel that when Peavey started coming out with the high wattage solid state amps made for steel in the '70s, most steelers bypassed the then-new SF Fenders (they had just had it with those pesky, staticy tube amps) and gladly flocked to the ss amps, in spite of their sterile sound, and harsh clipping at high volume. I really wanted a new NV400, but could only afford a used BF Super Reverb - which now would be worth 10 times what a used NV400 goes for - ha! Now that the ss amps have even more power and less weight, most steelers still prefer them. They are also low maintenance and more reliable than tube amps.

But since I started playing again a couple years ago, I have tried many ss and tube amps. The SF Fenders sound best to me for pedal steel, and there are tons of them around cheap. A blues/rock guitar player in one of my bands keeps his SF Vibrolux in my basement practice room. If I bypass the internal 10s and hook up one of my 15" cabs, it sounds just like the bigger SF Fenders, only not as much volume. Also, there is no EQ for the mids. That makes them a little less versatile, but you can still pretty easily get that great SF Fender sound.

Fender is now beginning to make some of the Custom reissues with PTP wiring. A guitarist in another band I play with got the new Tweed Twin. It sounds very good. But it is too bright for me. Some steelers might like it. I prefer the sound of 6L6 power tubes myself.

[This message was edited by David Doggett on 17 January 2005 at 08:13 PM.]

Joe E · From: Houston Texas

Thanks for the reply. I was actually being a little sarcastic and I appoligies. Talking with Soldano and with Paul Rivera, I truely believe theres is absolutely no difference in sound of a PCB and a PTP circuit. But what I have found is this. The components they load on the boards, especially caps, have a huge effect on sound. These components these days are surface mount style and are much inferior to the old component style caps found in fender amps.

My current amp I am using was made by Paul Rivera, and has a partial PCB in it. It allows the quallity and tone to be very consitant from amp to amp. But loaded on those PCB are very high quality parts, that cost 10 times the price of the surface mount parts on the new Fender amps.

I absolutely agree the new fender amps don't sound nearly as good as the older ones. I too have a BF Pro, a very early 68 (silverface) super reverb, and have owned a slew of other fenders. They all sound far superior to the new Fender amps. We tend to think what is different about these amps is the PCB vs PTP. That really just means a wire. It is the junk they put on it that makes the difference.

Thanks for listening,

Joe

Dan Tyack · From: Olympia, WA USA

I just traded some excess equipment for one of the 90s '63 vibrolus reissue' Fenders, and I think it's a great sounding amp. So far I have used it for lap and pedal steel, live and in the studio, and I think it's a keeper. This particular one sounds better than any 60s or 70s BF or SF vibrolux I have ever played. The speakers are nothing to write home about, but it sounds killer with my THD 2X12" cab (with a K120 and a Celestion). These have been going on eBay for between $650 and $900.

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www.tyack.com

Dan Tyack · From: Olympia, WA USA

Whoops, correction. Mine is a '63 Vibroverb reissue, not at Vibrolux Reverb. Its got a PC board ot two in the circuit, plus a solid state rectifier. Still sounds great.

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www.tyack.com

Roger Kelly · From: Bristol,Tennessee

Joe E ....you hit the nail on the Head, in my opinion!

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