black box

Steve Alcott · Post by **Steve Alcott** » 31 May 2004 2:23 pm

Anybody in NY area have a Sarno black box?I'd like to check it out before I drop that kind of money.

Mark Herrick · Post by **Mark Herrick** » 1 Jun 2004 11:04 am

Funny, I was thinking the exact same thing out here in LA...(que the Twilight Zone music)...

I noticed in a thread a couple of months ago that Brad was offering a 30 day trial period. I didn't see that mentioned on the website, but maybe he still is.

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 1 Jun 2004 11:27 am

Yes, he still is.

Brad Sarno

Larry Bell · Post by **Larry Bell** » 1 Jun 2004 7:49 pm

And I'll bet nobody's taken him up on it.

Clay Vandenburg · Post by **Clay Vandenburg** » 4 Jun 2004 4:59 pm

I recieved my black box about two weeks ago, and thought that I would give it a try, since I could send it back if I didn't like it,and had reservations about ordering it in the beginning. But, I think I'll just keep it. It's great, and makes my Carter, Zum & Mullen sound better than before. I would recommend it to all steelers, once you use it, you'll never go back, so go with the Black. Brad has a good product here folks.

Clay

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 5 Jun 2004 8:34 am

Thanks Clay. I'm glad you like it. I couldn't agree more! I think it really does help to bring out the best in a guitar. I'm hooked on using it now.

Thanks Larry, but to to be fair, out of these first 50 Black Boxes, I have had 3 returns. Ironically, they were for different reasons ranging from too mellow to too unnoticable to too bright. Go figure

It's not going to be for everyone so that's why I offer the "no questions asked" 30 day return policy. Actually, I may ask why, but it won't effect the returnability.

We are temporarily out of stock of Black Boxes. The next run will likely include the international power supply options so stay posted.

Brad Sarno

James Quackenbush · Post by **James Quackenbush** » 5 Jun 2004 10:29 am

I really have to commend Brad for making such a great product that seem's to work for the majority of players, and not to mention a 30 day trial offer !!!.....This is unheard of in the music business.... Too bad other manufacturers didn't feel that strongly about their products ...I applaud you Brad ......Sincerely, Jim

Mark Herrick · Post by **Mark Herrick** » 5 Jun 2004 11:01 am

Clay,

What is your setup? (amp, effects, etc.)
What is the signal path? (guitar-BlackBox-vol. ped.-?)
What pickups are in each of your guitars?

Also, and I know this is subjective, can you describe the change you noticed with the Mullen? How did it sound "better?"

Thanks!

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[This message was edited by Mark Herrick on 05 June 2004 at 12:03 PM.]

Jon Light · Post by **Jon Light** » 5 Jun 2004 11:35 am

We are temporarily out of stock of Black Boxes.

Sweet, Brad! (I mean, the sold out part of that).

[This message was edited by Jon Light on 05 June 2004 at 12:40 PM.]

Ron Randall · Post by **Ron Randall** » 5 Jun 2004 4:37 pm

I like it
I love it
I want some more of it!

I shall not attempt to describe tone. Kinda like trying to describe taste.
The effect is subtle and I like it.
Great product Brad.

Ron

Clay Vandenburg · Post by **Clay Vandenburg** » 7 Jun 2004 3:16 pm

Hi Mark

My setup is as follows:

from my steel straight into the Black box, then into my Goodrich 7A, out of the 7A into my RV3, from there I go into my Hilton volume pedal, then into a Nashville 400 Or my 1000.
I only use the 7A to tweak the sound a little based on the song the band lays out, But you can get along without the 7A and be just fine. My Mullen has George Ls, E66,and makes it much much warmer, and the bottoms string are much more clearer and defined and is wounderful when I switch over to the C6 side of my Uni. The upper strings respond much clearer as well, especially strings 3 & 4.
I have tried many different ways of hooking it up, but this seems to work the best. My Carter and Zum has the same effect with the Black Box but each one has a different pickup so I now for a fact that it works well with any pickup.
Bottom line is a much clearer, and warmer and defined sound.
Can't go wrong with a Black Box, Hilton volume pedal and a peavey amp, the three combinations are great.
Hope this helps you. If need anymore idea's reply back.

Clay

Randy Beavers · Post by **Randy Beavers** » 8 Jun 2004 3:50 am

Ditto all the above comments. And when that little blue light is glowing, sweet...

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Randy
http://hometown.aol.com/pulltightb/home.html

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 8 Jun 2004 5:49 am

Clay, may I suggest that you try placing the RV-3 after the volume pedal instead? That way the use of the volume pedal won't interfere with the natural decay of the reverb.

Thanks again y'all for the positive feedback on the Black Box.

Brad Sarno

Clay Vandenburg · Post by **Clay Vandenburg** » 8 Jun 2004 3:54 pm

Thanks Brad, I'll give it a try.

Clay

Jackie Anderson · Post by **Jackie Anderson** » 11 Jun 2004 6:19 am

Brad, are you still using the second version of the tone setting, or have you made further tweaks? I have hesitated to have you update my "Mk I" with the original circuit because I like it so much as is! Have you made any with a variable tone setting, or would that lower the "Q" too much?

Brad Sarno · Post by **Brad Sarno** » 11 Jun 2004 8:28 am

Jack, yours is one of the first six that shipped out. Yours and a few others with the first circuit version have a subtle fixed eq in there that gives a little bass rise. That also gave an apparent slight dip in the low mids. I found that some people liked it and others didnt' care for that particular coloration. So the design was changed by completely eliminating the EQ section thus simplifying the circuit. Yours and a few of the early models had a higher input impedance as well (1 meg), and again some people liked it and others found it a bit too bright on the way top end. So that value also came down to around 500k, just like a pot-type volume pedal which is what pickups are generally used to seeing as a load.

So really, the Box has become more simplified and I'm happier with that setup. Others seem to agree. It's now much more neutral and all EQ and tone shaping is left up the user with their amps or whatever gear they use for tone control. The Black Box has become a very simple, clean, tube-buffer that focuses on providing the sonic benefits of the pickup/tube interaction instead of also providing EQ voicing. Although the design is simple, it's still made up of some very intentionally selected and expensive components (resistors, capacitors, etc.) that help to maximize the quality of sound.

I have made a couple of test units with variable controls on them, but they were just for field testing. The results of the testing with those units helped me arrive at the latest design, especially the new input impedance. At this point, the design has been made so clean and simple, that there's really not much use for a knob to control anything. I like keeping all pots and switches out of the unit so that there are no moving parts to go bad over time. I want these things to be working fine in a hundred years. Other than replacing the tube when it wears out, I don't see any reason why the Black Boxes shouldn't be around for my great-great grandchildren to use with their steel guitars

Brad Sarno
http://home.earthlink.net/~bradsarno/blackbox.html