Boss Tone to again be manufactured.

Keith Hilton · From: 248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721

Over the years everyone has had nothing but good things to say about the little Boss Tone boxes. Of course the Boss Tone boxes are no longer manufactured. What if these boxes were again available, would you buy one? Considering money value in the late 60's and 70's what would you pay for one now? I am certain the appeal was the fingertip control of the off/on switch, volume and attack controls. Besides working good, finger tip control was 1/2 of the appeal. The Boss Tone's design had two transistors and two silicon diodes. Many later designs used OP Amps. Which do you prefer, discrete transistors or OP Amp for a distortion device? Next question: Do you prefer silicon or germanium diodes? If you use an OP Amp, do you like the diodes in the feedback loop or in the output? There were designs that used both transistors and Op Amps--example Boss Super Overdrive SD-1. Here is something else interesting; The Ibaneze Tube Screamer TS 9 did not have any tubes as the name implied.

Bobby Lee · From: Cloverdale, California, USA

I think they sound like crap. Boosting a signal and then clipping it with a diode is not the way to make a musical tone, in my opinion.

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Bobby Lee - email: quasar@b0b.com - gigs - CDs
Sierra Session 12 (E9), Williams 400X (Emaj9, D6), Sierra Olympic 12 (F Diatonic), Sierra Laptop 8 (D13), Fender Stringmaster (E13, A6), Roland Handsonic

Dave Robbins · From: Cottontown, Tnn. USA (deceased)

"A Bee in a Jar!"

Bobby Lee,

Dave

Keith Hilton · From: 248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721

Yes Bobby, that is exactly what they do. That's what I want, honest opinions. Just keep in mind I did not say I liked them, nor did I say I liked distortion. The clipping diodes are the way many of the distortion devices are made. Are there any distortion signal shapes or methods that do appeal to your ear Bobby?

David Wright · From: Pilot Point ,Tx USA.

Your not being very nice bOb....

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Donny Hinson · From: Glen Burnie, Md. U.S.A.

Tyler Macy · From: San Diego, CA, USA

Voodoo lab made a bosstone reproduction, called the "bosstone" oddly enough. It, however, was in stompbox form

They currently have an "improved" version on the market. It supposedly is the same as the bosstone, but with added tone controls. It is called the "superfuzz". I have one for tele and I really like it. However, I don't really use it as a fuzz; I keep the attack way down and use it as a mild overdrive to simulate an old tweed amp breaking up a little.

Buck Dilly · From: Branchville, NJ, USA * R.I.P.

I recently bought a used one which was in poor condition, and I would have bought a new one were it available. I think that a floor unit is more usable. Can anyone out there repair this one- it needs 2 pots and a switch.

John Lacey · From: Black Diamond, Alberta, Canada

Keith, I don't know about diodes etc. but one improvement would be the taper of the volume knob. The old one comes on much too quickly going from nothing to overkill. I know that some guys to retrofits, so it can be done, and I would like to have it less "buzzy" and more overdriven. Estimated price? Between $150-200 USD.

Kevin Hatton · From: Buffalo, N.Y.

Boss Tones always sounded like crap. Thin and cheezy. There are so many better units out there for good prices.

Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

If you could just build an old MXR Ditortion+ into that box, you would have a winner! I had an older model, brand new in the box for over 20 years. It spent most of it's life in the box! Too fuzzy for me. The MXR had a sweet sustain and violin quality. I have never had a distortion unit before or since that had that sound! I would like to find another one.

Gino Iorfida · From: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, USA

MXR Dist + and the DOD 250 Overdrive were pretty much the same unit (which the DOD is being mfd. again!!!)... the only real difference is that hte MXR used Germanium diodes, while the DOD used silicone diodes. This caused the tone of these units to be drastically different... while the MXR was warm, the DOD soundind kinda thin and cheezy.

I think the availabiliity (or should i say LACK OF AVAILABILITY) of Germ. diodes would be a major limiting factor as to how big the product would sell

Dave Robbins · From: Cottontown, Tnn. USA (deceased)

Kevin,
"Exactly!"

Why anyone would even be interested seriously in one today is beyond my understanding. They are "way" outdated and like Kevin said are "thin and cheesey." They were prone to breakage, too, especially in the area of the knobs.

The only real use there ever was for them back when I remember them being used, was to get a "simulated" string sound where you cranked the distortion level way up and then cranked up all the reverb you could get and played one note at a time. Weldon and the guys at the Opry "years" ago used to play three part harmonies with them to get that sort of "string sound live" that was kind'a hip at the time. But nobody I know of ever took them for a "serious" distortion unit. Back in those days, the amps available at the time gave all the "dirt" you needed! Man, everybody was trying to get their sound "cleaned-up!"

As for the "rock" sound there were much better units available than the Boss Tone, even back then.

When I first started playing the Opry eveyone had them "red" SHO-BUD"s, including me! You weren't considered "cool" if you didn't have one of them "Boss Tones" hanging out of the end of your 'Bud. I think it was more of a statis symbol. I think that "Sho-Bud" was even involved in them for awhile. Still, nobody took them for a "serious distortion unit". Why should they? "COUNTRY" was "cool" back then.

If a distorted sound is what a person wants today, "get with the program" and move up to the present. There are much better units and ways to get "dirt" than to use one of those little cheap things.

When I get my ol'SHO-BUD back together, I'm going to take it back to the Opry and play it again, just for old times sake, and my ol' Boss Tone (yes, I still have it) will be hanging out of the end. But use it? Not even at gun point! LOL

Boss Tone? Get real...sheesh!

Dave

Jim Smith · From: Midlothian, TX, USA

Del Rangel · From: Clayton, NC

Maybe the sound is thin and cheezy, but some of us may like thin and cheezy at times--and the 70s and 80s thing is coming back-round. Maybe its time for this to resurface. Now if Keith would combine this with his digital sustain we would be going somewhere. Oh yeah, germanium diodes if possible.

Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

It seems the rage is still over the TS9 and TS808 by Ibanez. Never even played one, I wonder how they compare? Were they more of a preamp or a distortion unit? I must admit I have have never played one and am a bit curious! Maybe Keith could build something like that for us, too!

[This message was edited by Ken Fox on 01 January 2003 at 01:58 PM.]

Chris DeBarge · From: Boston, Mass

Ken, those are overdrives (different versions of the "tube screamer" model). Can't get fuzztone out of them, just a nice warm slightly overdriven boost.

Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

Appreciate that, I suspected as much. Never got a chance to try one out. I believe the originals are out of my price range, due to the use of them by Stevie Ray Vaughn! Oh well, I may never get to try one! At least I'll have 1/2 of his setup soon, I am building my fourth Vibroverb Clone (sold the three others I built). I plan to keep this one for myself.
Any way, sorry for drifting away from the subject Keith! Maybe there is a need for something like the Bosstone, with a little more of a modern sound to it.

Keith Hilton · From: 248 Laurel Road Ozark, Missouri 65721

I don't see any basic difference in using transistors versus an Op Amp if the signal is overdriven then clipped with diodes. There is a difference depending if you use silicon diodes or germainium diodes. Silicon diodes cause hard clipping and you might associate germainium diodes with soft clipping. Ken,like the Boss Tone, the following devices used the clipping diodes Bobby hates so much: MXR Distortion +, ProCo Rat Distortion,Ibanez Tube Screamer TS-9, Boss Super Overdrive SD-1,Marshall Blues Breaker,Marshall Drive Master, Marshall Shred Master, and the famous Fuzz Face used by Jimi Hendrix. I guess a few people must of liked the sound of the clipping diodes because that's what Jimi Hendrix,Steve Ray Vaughn and lots of others used on million selling records. Gino, I don't know why you are having problems finding germainium diodes, I'm not? I am aware of many other methods besides diode clipping. I do know when you bring up distortion it is a raw open nerve and everyone has an opinion. I just hope no one accuses someone of being a Communist because they happen to like some type of distortion.

[This message was edited by Keith Hilton on 01 January 2003 at 05:43 PM.]

Steve Hinson · From: Hendersonville Tn USA

Does anybody know what kind of fuzz Sneeky Pete used with the Flying Burrito Bros.?

Dave Robbins · From: Cottontown, Tnn. USA (deceased)

Steve,

according to an interview with "Sneaky" by Joe Goldmark in the "May '79" issue of "Steel Guitarist" magazine, he had this to say about his "fuzz" sound.

quote: "I also use a fuzz tone, which I designed myself. It makes real mellow sounding fuzz, and it also clips the notes by a circuit that I devised. It gives a kind of synthesizer sound sometimes." end of quote.

Dave

Gino Iorfida · From: Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, USA

Germ. diodes> WIth them being out of production, we would be looking at NOS diodes... not a bad thing, but depending on hwo long down the road we'd be looking at them, may be another story... but by that same token, aren't all semiconductors in the same 'danger' of extinction whether it be 2 days, 2 months, 2 years or 2 decades down the road.

I think the Bosstone gets SOOOO much fuzzz and sustain is because (I verified thsi with one I have laying around here), that you are getting a LOT of fuzz from the transistors themselves clipping.. the diodes pretty much seal the deal however. -- actually, if you take the diodes out of a bosstone, you have a silicon transistor FuzzFace (or Big Muff, or FuzzTone, or any other garden variety fuzz).

I actuaally see the need for BOTH the overdrive/distortion and fuzz type pedals. Where an 'overdrive' etc may sound GREAT for chords/multinote passages, they dont ahve that sustain for days singing that a fuzz can give.... likewise, hitting more than one note at a time through a fuzz you lose all separation between notes.

What would be REAL cool.....to be able to have a pedal with arocker like a volume/wha pedal etc, that in one position you can be clean with sustain, advance a bit and now youa re into 'overdrive' territory, advance a bit further, and you start approaching 'distortion', and at full tile you are at the can-o-bees fuzzzz effect... now THAT I could see people paying for--

Ken Fox · From: Nashville GA USA

I am sure you have seen these articles, but I thought other might find them an interesting primer on overdrive/distortion unit of the past! Looks like you have done your homework, Keith! These articles bear out what you have said.
http://www.geofex.com/effxfaq/distn101.htm

From another site (analogman.com) I found the following comments:
"The yellow SD-1(Boss) has the same basic design as a Tube screamer but with asymmetrical clipping. I can leave the clipping as-is (Boss style asymmetrical clipping) if you wish, but I normally change it to the Ibanez (symmetrical) style on my standard SD-1/808 mod. Ibanez told me that Roland (Boss) has a patent on asymmetrical clipping, which gives it a bit more volume, harmonics, and crunch. With Ibanez style clipping, it sounds very much like a TS-808, but still has a touch more edge and drive available. With Boss style, it gets yet a bit more volume, edge, and harmonics. The Brown option is standard on the SD-1 as it really helps to smooth out the sound."

Perhaps this explains why my Boss SD-1 is so unappealing to me. It is a grinding distortion, I can never get out of it what I like and it reminds me of the distortion from the old Bosstone! I have to run a compressor with it to tame it down a bit. It seems to me the old MXR+ was very smooth, but it has been 20 years since I used one, but maybe my memory is not so good as I think!

http://www.geofex.com/Article_Folders/TStech/tsxfram.htm

[This message was edited by Ken Fox on 01 January 2003 at 09:16 PM.]

[This message was edited by Ken Fox on 01 January 2003 at 09:18 PM.]

Chris DeBarge · From: Boston, Mass

Keith, many amps use diode clipping as well, including the million-selling Marshall JCM900 heads (well, maybe not millions, but you get my drift). I'm not sure, but I think the JCM800's may use it too. And also Jack Bruce had a diode installed in the controls of his Gibson bass. Different sound indeed, but it worked for him. So diodes can be controlled.

I happen to love old fuzzboxes, if just for the kitsch factor, the Maestro being my favorite. If I only knew what they were going to be worth when I had them as a teenager.

Steve Hinson · From: Hendersonville Tn USA

Thanks,Dave...I didn't remember reading that,but I did...forgot all about it!I've got those magazines around here somewhere...

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