Recording Equipment

James M Banks · Post by **James M Banks** » 2 Jan 2001 9:56 am

Anyone have suggestions for reasonably priced recording equipment. Myself and a few others would like to casually record some things, but don't want to invest a great deal of money in it. I would prefer something that I could connect to my PC for editing and mastering.

Any info is appreciated.

James

LARRY COLE · Post by **LARRY COLE** » 2 Jan 2001 4:11 pm

You can get a new ADAT for about $900, and if you want more tracks later they will link together and you can get the ADAT interface for PC and edit it on your puter.

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LC. WILLIAMS U12, SHO-BUD PRO1,CARVIN TL60

David Weaver · Post by **David Weaver** » 3 Jan 2001 9:26 am

I am NOT an expert, but I will maybe get the conversation going. You say "you and your friends"...which seems to imply multiple input which would seem to mean you need a mixer.

From the mixer, you can record in one or two channels on whatever you have...tape, CD recorder, whatever. Mixing this way doesn't give much room for "mastering", but recording a lot of channels starts to run into money. You said you didn't want to pay too much.

If you come out of the mixer and want to go to a computer, then it would require a program that takes analog to digital, or an intermediate device that converts the signal. I don't know much about that.

I have a rack mounted system with a Alesis mixer, an amplifier, a CD player, a CD burner, and a Tascam duel cassette player, recorder.

I can't do much "mastering" since I don't have multiple track recording, but it works great for what I want. I can play back CD's with an A-B stop to repeat, I have pitch control on the CD's and the cassette (No, not all CD's are true pitch)and I can record myself playing with rhythm tracks or others such as guitar or synth.

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Sho-Bud Pro II Custom, Sierra Artist S-10, Fessenden S-10, Session 2000

Glenn Austin · Post by **Glenn Austin** » 3 Jan 2001 10:22 am

Hello James.I am a sound engineer and a steel player based in Montreal at Listen Audio Productions. What you need is a Digidesign Digi001. Available for mac and pc,It has an 8in/8 out interface,2 onboard mic pre's,Digital ins & outs. I believe that it does require a fairly fast computer,500Mhz and up,and 128M of RAM.It will record up to 8 tracks simultaneously,and play back 24 tracks max. It also has built in plug in EFX which sound good.But the best thing about this setup is that you can record,edit,mix and master all in this program.Most studios use Digidesign systems,myself included.This system costs around $1000 Canadian. You can check out their site at WWW.Digidesign.com. If you have a CD burner you can go from a song idea to the finished product all without leaving the digital domain.I sound like a salesman, but I think it's a good deal.

James M Banks · Post by **James M Banks** » 3 Jan 2001 1:01 pm

Thanks for the info so far. You guys have it pretty much right. I am looking for something fairly simple, maybe 6 or 8 tracks, and I would like to do all editing on the pc and then just burn a copy to cd. David, I was thinking about just using a mixer like you suggested, but I think I'd rather spend the extra dough and get something that a has a few more bells & whistles. The product that Glenn mentioned seems in the ballpark for what I want. I figured about $800 - $1000 would be an acceptable price range.

I am pretty new to this whole recording business, so if it sounds like I don't know what I'm talking about, it's probably because I don't. I appreciate the input so far and welcome any additional comments or suggestions.

James

seldomfed · Post by **seldomfed** » 4 Jan 2001 4:03 pm

See post from Chris Walke in this forum re: the Yamaha AW 4416. A little over your budget perhaps - but it and it's ilk are an alternative you should consider. (Yamaha, Roland, Tascam all have similar units of varying cost and feature sets).

Chris writes, "For those that don't know about this piece, it's a 16-track hard disk recorder. You can get the optional cd burner right there onboard. Has 8 virtual tracks on every track, 2 multi-EFX processors on board, a compressor/limiter/gate/expander for every channel, 4-band eq for every channel (each band is frequency sweepable and Q adjustable), 8 aux sends, 2 banks of sample pads (8 pads for each bank), 2 mic pres, 8 1/4 inch inputs (expandable to 24 inputs), automated mixing. Everything you need, and a few things you don't. Very cool unit. "

Back to me - These types of units offer lots of capability for people who may not want to dedicate their computer to multi-track recording. Personally I hate mixing with a mouse. Editing - fine - mixing - no.

I'm a recording engineer as well - and use a PC DAW (SAWPro) integrated with ADAT and a Mackie board. I had my computer custom built to handle digital audio recording. It has it's benefits for editing esp. - however lately I'm thinking I would love to just simplify my life and get a Mackie D8B and one of their hardware recorders. Or a Yamaha O2R. Then just use the computer for mastering and MIDI.

Call sweetwater.com and talk to a sales guy about alternatives - it may help. There are literally 100's of choices - and we'll all tell you our preferences.

cheers,
chris

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Chris Kennison
Ft. Collins, Colorado
"We can't afford to let Nature Run Wild" - govt. offical - Alaska

Glenn Austin · Post by **Glenn Austin** » 5 Jan 2001 9:57 am

Mixing with a mouse is a pain,but this system requires no outboard gear, no patchbay,no console,no tape to buy and not too much cabling.
you would need 6 extra preamps to record 8 mics simultaneously. Sweetwater has good service and deals too. They sell digidesign as well,and explain how the products work on their site.I would stay away from these 8 & 16 track things from tascam & roland,they seem like gadgets to me.

seldomfed · Post by **seldomfed** » 5 Jan 2001 12:32 pm

Hi Glenn,
I don't think they are gadgets really. Depends on your goals for recording and your definition of 'gadget'. If home recording equipment is in the gadget category - then the Dig001 is a gadget too. Reference their web site - "Digi 001 is the first completely self-contained, fully featured hardware interface for all aspects of home studio recording"

I prefer to think of them as tools for specific purposes. The tool selection depends depends on your goals and budget and skill. Many of us (me) started on these 'gadgets' (4-track porta studios 15+years ago) and learned the ropes in a fairly effective and low risk way. Also, there have been many, many projects recorded and mixed on these boxes by many artists and pros that sound quite good. So I think it's a good alternative.

Given the original paraphrased goals (sorry James)
1) do casual recording
2) 6-8 mic channels (assume simultaneously)
3) <$1000 -
4) editing
5) connect to a PC (for editing and CD burning)

I think the Tascam, Roland, Akai, Yamaha multi-trackers are alternatives. The Digidesign Digi001 is an alternative as well. But as you said you need 4-6 more pre's to meet the goal of 6-8 mic channels simultaneously - so that may blow the budget.

With the total computer based recording solution on the typical home PC - there are a number of issues to deal with. Disc space, should have two discs - ideally SCSI, don't record on your boot drive, BIOS setup, physical location and space suitable for recording 2-4 people, is it dedicated to recording or is it used for email, games, finances etc., OS upgrades, patches needed, disc fragmentation etc., can't record remotely (ie. at a rehearsal unless it's where the computer is). PC's (MACs) excell at editing and automation - they don't always provide the best recording function.

With the total multi-track hardware (box) solution there are issues too. Can it connect to a PC easily, storage capacity is finite if it's a HD type. Editing is sometimes not as full-featured as a PC. Remember, most of these are just special , single purpose computers with a human interface.

Assuming the PC you have James has a sound card and a CD burner - I still think working with a portable hardware type recorder will be easy to start with, get similar quality and meet most of the goals. Record your tracks - Then, transfer the 2-track mix to your PC. Use the method provided with the hardware multi-tracker (ZIP, JAZZ, optical IO etc.) or just mix the tunes to cassette or record direct to the stereo input on a standard multimedia PC, use a copy of SoundForge LE (or some inexpensive two track editing software) to record and edit on the PC (which may have come with the PC or CD Burner, edit the recordings, burn on a CD burner in the PC. Practice, learn quick, move on.

One last thought. It may be good to learn how to record first, and edit second. An old studio addage that we use is "you can't polish a turd" - in other words, get it right the first time. Multitrack editing is great for fixing flubs, pitch correction, re-mixing, etc. - but if you learn how to record good clean tracks, good solid tunes, magic performances - you'll spend a lot less time editing, pitch correcting, combining 'best takes'. It makes it real.
(you don't think Brittany Spears and Madonna sing on pitch do you)

Glenn - sorry for the long post, James - hope it's helpful and we have not confused you more.

ttfn,
Chris

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Chris Kennison
Ft. Collins, Colorado
"We can't afford to let Nature Run Wild" - govt. offical - Alaska

Robert Parent · Post by **Robert Parent** » 6 Jan 2001 5:25 am

Check out Roland's VS1680 or the newer VS1880. These units are pretty much self contained but a great deal in my opinion. I have been down the same road with racks of outboard equipment, PC systems and the like. About two years ago I dumped most everything and bought a VS1680 best decision I every made in the search for recording equipment. I still use my PC for final 'mastering' but the VS does everything else.

Steve Stallings · Post by **Steve Stallings** » 6 Jan 2001 6:24 am

Inexpensive recording equipment is in the eye of the beholder. Perhaps the least expensive situation is the currently FREE version of pro-tools that digidesign is giving away. Do a search for digidesign and you should find it.

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Steve Stallings
Bremond, Texas
Carter D10/Evans

James M Banks · Post by **James M Banks** » 16 Jan 2001 11:38 am

Thanks to all of you who have given suggestions about equipment. This past weekend a friend invited me to a meeting with a record producer in Nashville and we were able to tour the studio. Afterward, we met with the studio and road guitarist for Clay Walker. After asking a lot of questions, I came to the conclusion that spending a little extra on recording equipment up front would save a lot of headache in the long run. So yesterday I purchased a Korg D16 Hard Disk Recorder. It may be a little overkill right now, but it has the ability to grow with my needs over time.

Thanks again to each of you who offered suggestions, preferences, and opinions.

James<FONT SIZE=1 COLOR="#8e236b"><p align=CENTER>[This message was edited by James M Banks on 16 January 2001 at 12:46 PM.]</p></FONT>

Chris Schlotzhauer · Post by **Chris Schlotzhauer** » 16 Jan 2001 12:43 pm

One thing I would add about the Digi 001 is you need a dedicated computer, hopefully built and configured by a company that builds computers for the audio industry. You can have this done with ProTools software loaded, the computer, and Digi001 interface for about 3K.