C6th - advice neeed

[Detlef Webert]

Dear forum mates,
after 30+ year on E9th I'm looking for a way to get info C6th. I know the strings and pedal actions but do not find an appropriate way how to start.
I subscribed for PF C6th essentials and toolbox but I'm actually lost as soon trying to workout the chords or a chord progression of any song.

Would like to hear and get your feedback, how you've stepped into C6th and how you made progress.

Kind Regards,

[Dave Diehl]

You'll be suprised how close the E9th and C6th is to one another. When working with the C6th, don't block out your E9th moves.

[scott murray]

Buddy Emmons does a good job comparing the C6 to E9 in his Basic C6 course, he also gets you started playing some songs.

as with E9, I recommend finding all the positions up the neck for a particular chord.

[Roger Rettig]

I'm fairly late to the 'C6th Party' myself. I've had a d-10 for a long time but just dabbled, learning what the pedals do.

I'd echo Scott's advice. 'Learn where the chords are and all the inversions. Open, you have a C major, a C6 and an Am. If you use the 9th string as the root (the F), there's an F maj9.

Hit pedal 5 and you have a D9 (see the relationship? That's the 2/9th chord at the same fret as the 1 and the 6 minor). Pedal 6 gives you an F and F7 in the open position.

5 and 6 together? Instant diminished! Pedal seven gives a maj7 and a major9 I would add that 90% of it is on pedals 5,6 & 7, along with lowering the 3rd string on a KL and maybe raising both Cs to C# on the opposite lever.

Find all the C chords - open, 3rd fret and 5th fret (w P6), and so on throughout all the chord groups. Once you have the geography straight, it becomes easier..

I would think that Paul Franklin's course would be ideal; there's no one more accomplished on either neck. I learned a lot from Buddy Emmons' C6 book. It's available from Steel Guitars of North Country (Jim Palenscar).

[Kevin Fix]

I play some C6 myself, not a lot, but I explore and use it as much as possible. I take songs that I normally do in E9th and convert them to play on the C6 neck. I am fascinated with the tone and the tuning. I have not used any tab. I play it by ear.

[George Kimery]

I went from E9 to a U12, which is both an E9 and B6 tuning combined. When I got a D-10 it didn't make any sense that the back neck was tuned to C6 instead of B6. I would have to learn to play on different fret positions from one neck to the other, plus I would not be able to play in C on the first fret. I buy universal string sets and tune all ten strings the same as the top 10 strings U-12 tuning. Works for me.

[Detlef Webert]

Roger, you're probably right,
perhaps I should do the homework first and working out all the positions of the different keys along the frets before doing something else.
It will be a "dry" and exhausting exercise.

[John Swain]

You can search and check out my "Short Tabs" of many standards and learn pedals and locations for many voicings.

[Dale Rottacker]

Roger, you're probably right,
perhaps I should do the homework first and working out all the positions of the different keys along the frets before doing something else.
It will be a "dry" and exhausting exercise.

Roger is a wise man.

I took about 45 years before MAKING an effort to play more than the Nightlife Intro and Girl From Ipanema. I've been at it maybe a year and a half now, and because I'm "Special" still can't tell you or know what I'm playing most of the time. That said, I think my ear is getting better aquatinted with the different chords and where they are positionally as I'm finding more difficult passages quicker every day.

I've also been using iReal Pro which lets you change the key of a song and also puts it in the Nashville Number System. So now I've actually been re-arranging some songs to my own liking which is forcing me to become more familiar with the chords and where they are just from the repetition. I really want to delve more into the "Numbers" of everything as I only have to remember once, as I don't think knowing the name is as important as knowing how it relates to the 1 chord as a number. The fewer squirrels I'm chasing in my head the better for me.

[Roger Rettig]

Dale wrote:

"Roger is a wise man."

Ha! If I possess any wisdom, it's the knowledge that I've barely scratched the surface.

It's funny, that - when I was twenty-one, I knew everything. I wonder what happened.

I've watched Dale progress quickly due to a combination of the occasional tip from experienced players like Risk Schmidt and with a lot of just sitting at his guitar and trying things out. That familiarity with the 'new' territory that is C6 will come surprisingly quickly.

As for myself, someone suggested once that, if you want to make headway on the back neck, then discipline yourself to play ONLY C6 every time you sit down to the guitar. Whatever tune is in your head, find it - however haltingly it might come - on the back neck. Resist the temptation to jump to E9 because you '...know where all the chords are there..'

Detief: It doesn't take long, believe me, to assimilate the new positions. 'E maj/E6/C#m' is at the 4th fret. After that, the relationships between the various options (up five frets for C with P6, etc) will soon became as familiar as the E neck is now.

There's no substitute for hours of just sitting at your guitar and woodshedding; neither Paul's course or Buddy's C6 book can accomplish that for you.

Good hunting!

[Detlef Webert]

Hello mates,
my first thoughts were, when playing a Cmaj chord finding it again on the 7th fret using the 9th string
and then in 3rd fret using the 8th string but it looks like that's not quite right.
I have to have a closer look to workout a different approach.

Thanks for far!

[scott murray]

you've got C(6) open and at fret 12, C(7#9) at fret 3 with pedal 8, C(6) at fret 5 with pedal 7, C(maj9) at fret 7, and C(9) at fret 10 with pedal 5.

[Pete Burak]

Get with a fluent 6th player and get a lesson.
With just a few easy tips, I think most players will find the 6th tuning is super fun, and intuitive, and instantly easier to sound great on than E9th.
Lesson 1: You don't even need to touch the pedals or lever(s) to sound good playing pretty much any Western Swing song!
Start with songs like Hey Good Lookin', and San Antone Rose.

[Detlef Webert]

...and all the extentions with the different pedals...F#m7b6, C5b5, Cmadd9, A7#9, G6/9,Bb9#11.....
makes a mess in remembering all there differences.
Confusing for me.

[Pete Burak]

Forget about making it confusing.
Put on your favorite Swing tune and play along.
No pedals, no levers...
Once you know where to put the bar in order to play the right open chords, it's virtually impossible to play a wrong note!

[Dale Rottacker]

Hello mates,
my first thoughts were, when playing a Cmaj chord finding it again on the 7th fret using the 9th string
and then in 3rd fret using the 8th string but it looks like that's not quite right.
I have to have a closer look to workout a different approach.

Thanks for far!

I started by playing out of the M7 positions... so that 964 grip at the 7th fret is CM7 and one fret back of where you'd find Cmaj on the E9th fret... same with all of those Cmaj types in relation to E9th positions ... the 8th string with 765 on the 3rd fret gives you a Cm open and C6th 7654 open or on the 12th fret

Sorry if I confused you

[colin mcintosh]

I have a uni 12 string, E9/B6. And I was astounded at how easy the 6th tuning is when it's tuned to B.
All the chords are in the same position as E9th.
The scales are the same too for the most part with one of two exceptions.
Imagine playing E9 scales without using pedals or levers, just pencilling the notes with the tip of the bar. Welcome to B6.
I would tune your C6 down a semitone.

[Bob Hoffnar]

Get with a fluent 6th player and get a lesson.
With just a few easy tips, I think most players will find the 6th tuning is super fun, and intuitive, and instantly easier to sound great on than E9th.
Lesson 1: You don't even need to touch the pedals or lever(s) to sound good playing pretty much any Western Swing song!
Start with songs like Hey Good Lookin', and San Antone Rose.

Yes ! Play along to Hank Williams tunes and get a feel for how the tuning originally developed. Then You ad the pedals to make things more easy instead of more complicated.

[Bob Hoffnar]

Have a look at this

https://steelguitarforum.com/Forum8/HTML/000716.html

[Alan Struthers]

Thanks, Bob Hoffnar! That was really an eye-opener to this noobie C6 player.

[Richard Alderson]

Dear Detlef - My biggest single suggestion for making c6th easier to learn on a double neck guitar is tune the c6th neck down one half step into B6th. Why does this make learning easier? Because now your E9th neck with the E's lowered is the same as your B6th neck, fret for fret. Like one big guitar with 20 strings as all the frets line up now on both necks. Intuitively you will now see two necks in front of you that are equal and have c6th and f6th and g6th (your one - four - five chords) AT THE SAME FRET (1st - 6th - 8th - 13th). Makes almost no difference in reading tablature you quickly get used to adding one fret to everything, and no difference at all if you are using musical notation. Believe me, the whole process will easier if you tune c6th down one half step to b6th.

PS - In basic positions, your strings are mainly 8th through 2nd with this tuning, and don't touch string 9 for a while, but 10 is okay. The first pedals to learn before anything else are just the 5 and 6 pedals and some scales.