New 5 x 5 E9 w/Sacred elements

[Alan Stephens]

I'm having Chuck with Desert Rose build my first pedal steel and I could use some input. I have been playing six string electric guitar for over 50 years...mostly rock, blue and praise band work. I think I'd like to add a touch of strummable sacred without losing E9. Here is where I am starting.

Moving on to the next step.

Using P0 allows for open chords, or maybe leave the low D unchanged for dominate 7ths.
Using P0 and PA allows for open minor 6th chords.
Not sure what to do with P4. Some sacred tunings use a G to Gb pedal. But that would have to be next to P0. Or are there better ideas?

If the day pedal set up is used, P0, PA and P4 could be adjacent. Or with the Emmons set up P4 and a knee lever could be swapped.

Any help would be great.

[James Polk]

Hey there! Fellow six stringer with a recent dive into psg here. I would agree with the G# to G on p4 next to p0. That gets you fully open 'strummable' major and minor chords right next to each other. Thats your most common need I'd say and if your brain works like mine does then there's a lot you can do with that.

I would definitely spend a lot of time learning your grips though! With normal Emmons setup, you've got I, IV, V7, ii, and vi all at the same fret with different pedals/knees and the same grip. You can get every chord you need within 2 frets of each other if you've got the right pulls matched. That's why the 3x4 setup is so universal. It just makes sense.

Best of luck with your build!


FWIW, you may also look into universal tunings. It's a bit more grip/brain work, but gives you access to normal e9 as well as b6 which is basically all of western swing just tuned down a half step. If you're dead set on a 10 string, I think there are some pretty usable 'universal 10 string' cop's if you search the forum.

[K Maul]

I suggest possibly putting G#,B on strings 10&9 and using RKR to either lower 8 or raise 9 to D. That plus raising F#_G# on RKL may give you what you need. If RKL isn’t too stiff you could even lower 10 to G#_E. I’ve had success on some guitars using that setup for rock/blues applications.

[Zoots Houston]

I suggest possibly putting G#,B on strings 10&9 and using RKR to either lower 8 or raise 9 to D. That plus raising F#_G# on RKL may give you what you need. If RKL isn’t too stiff you could even lower 10 to G#_E. I’ve had success on some guitars using that setup for rock/blues applications.

I haven’t switched my copedent yet, but I did tune 10 & 9 down to G# & B to mess around and I like it a lot. Using the E to D# lever you get a B6 tuning that’s very similar to the most popular C6 or A6 lap steel tunings. The bottom 7 strings are just a half step down from A C E G A C E (low to high).

[Alan Stephens]

I think I'll drop the sacred idea for now and just do E9 in a 5 x 5.

Any help on pedals P0 and P5 and/or knee levers changes.

[Fred Treece]

I think I'll drop the sacred idea for now and just do E9 in a 5 x 5.

Any help on pedals P0 and P5 and/or knee levers changes.

Your main chart is pretty much my 12-string Ext E9 copedent. The only difference is that P0 and LKV are reversed on mine, with a split to C on P0 and PA. I suppose you could do a similar split with your setup also, with PA and vertical.

This is a fairly complex setup for a beginner. Not quite as much as a Uni, but you could stay busy for a lifetime on it. You might think about going with 12 strings. It opens up a few more possibilities with the changes you have in mind here, and adds more guitaristic range.

[Alan Stephens]

So how about...

[b0b]

Do you play E9th already, or is this your first pedal steel?

[Alan Stephens]

I've been playing a Gibson EH-630 with the middle 8 strings in E9. With three pedals(Emmons A, B and E->F).

[b0b]

Here's an idea with more strumming options:



I'd lower the whole thing a full step to D9, but that's just me.

[Alan Stephens]

Thanks B0b,

Do you have some time to expand on your idea...LKV, P0 and P5...strummable?

[b0b]

Sure. Pedal C + P5 give you a big DMaj7 on the low 5 strings. LKV makes it a full, fat D on the lower 8 strings.

Pedal 1 is simply an Em chord. It's also a good A7 combined with pedal A and RKR - with a very strong low 3rd (C#).

[Alan Stephens]

Thanks Bob...makes sense. I think I'm going to set it up more straight E9 with five pedals. The two additional pedals should give me years of tinkering possibilities.

[b0b]

The two additional pedals should give me years of tinkering possibilities.

Order it with 3 changes on each, so you'll have enough parts to experiment with 3 pulls.

[Alan Stephens]

Good idea...thanks Bob.