New player tips

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 8:05 am

Hey there! I just purchased my first pedal steel, a '72 sho bud the professional d10 R&B guitar. Its an 8x2 as it sits currently. Was wondering if anyone had suggestions on which pulls I needed to have set up to make the best of my situation/which to incorporate into my playing first. I'd like to add knees as I progress and as I can find the parts. I imagine I'll lean a bit more on the c6 side as I come from a jazz background and thats the harmony that comes naturally to my ear.

Also if anyone knows where I can get spare parts for an R&B that would be great! Looks like psg parts is out of stock on most of what I'd need.

Thanks you guys!

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 14 Apr 2021 8:40 am

Welcome aboard.

What is the copedent of the Sho-Bud? It might already be setup with very useable C6 pulls... and folks here will be able to give you better advice if they can figure out what isn't on the guitar at the moment.

For example, here is a popular one from Buddy Emmons. How does yours compare? Obviously, you don't have 4 knee levers... but how much of the rest do you have?

https://b0b.com/wp/copedents/c6th/

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James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 8:45 am

I'm not actually entirely sure! It came to me as a project and I'm restoring it at the moment. Got the c6 side nearly finished but I had 2 stuck screws on the e9 side.

As far as I can tell the e9 side is the standard 3 pedals with the right knee lowering 4 and 8 and the left knee lowering 2 and raising 8 maybe.

c6 side looks like the right knee lowers 3 only. 5 pedals should theoretically be the standard changes.

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 8:47 am

Corrected the string lowers I just wrote. Looking at the guitar upside down. Still on the right neck, just opposite numbers.

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 8:48 am

This listing is the guitar I've got. Has some photos of the underside. https://reverb.com/item/39739147-sho-bu ... edal-steel

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 8:50 am

Looks like it's fairly close to the Jack Stoner, just without the other knee. So the Jimmy Day

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 14 Apr 2021 9:11 am

That Jimmy Day should work fine.

But are you sure that knee lever is actually moving string 8 rather than, say, lowering string 3?

You might be reporting the string numbers incorrectly. The thinnest treble string is string 1 (not 10). If you're trying to do this with it upside down in the case it's easy to get confused.

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 9:14 am

I think lowering string 3 would be correct. I was looking upside down at the photo I had on hand.

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 14 Apr 2021 9:24 am

Ah, things are making more sense with the corrected string numbers.

On E9, one knee lever is lowering strings 4 and 8.

And the other lever lowers string 2 and raises string 8.

These are the most important changes to have on your guitar. It's very playable as it stands.

If you were to add another knee lever it would raise strings 8 and 4. So you would be able to raise both E strings rather than what you have now where you're only raising one.
That would leave the other lever to just lower string 2. It could also lower string 9.
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James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 9:29 am

Being that I have the whole thing apart already, is there a setup or specific change that would be more advantageous over what I've got already? I don't know that I could make the pedals do things on the opposite neck but barrel/rod position is easy to move.

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 14 Apr 2021 9:44 am

You'll get a lot of different opinions here, but if you aren't in the process of putting on another knee lever now, and you don't have any extra parts to use... so you only have two knee levers to work with pulling a total of 4 strings, I would keep it as we've laid it out here. You have all of the most essential changes:

Jimmy Day copedent for C6.

And on E9, one lever lowers both E strings (4 and 8 ).

And the other lever lowers string 2 and raises one E string (string 8 ).

If you had the parts, you could also have that same lever raise string 4, so that both E strings were being raised. But...you can roll with what you have for now.

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 9:45 am

Lovely!

Thanks for the help!

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 9:55 am

Upon closer inspection, that left knee left lever is lowering one string and raising two. So three changes total. Not sure exactly which strings or by how much. But definitely not what I thought initially. Maybe 8, 4, and 2?

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 14 Apr 2021 9:59 am

Raising strings 4 and 8 (the two E strings)... along with lowering string 2 would make sense.

This is what I was suggesting for your next upgrade, but looks like you aleady have the parts to make it a 'go.'

Our Cap'n B0b wrote an article about basic E9 theory, and had this copendent, a 3x3 that has all the most essential changes. Since you only have 2 knee levers, yours combines the function of two of those levers onto one -- but you still have all the basic changes mentioned here:

https://www.b0b.com/infoedu/e9theory.htm

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James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 14 Apr 2021 10:09 am

That write up is a gold mine! Hadn't stumbled on that one yet. Makes sense that it would be combined like that on a guitar where adding changes is easy but adding levers isn't! Any chance you know of a similar gospel for c6 tuning?

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 14 Apr 2021 2:06 pm

James Polk wrote:Any chance you know of a similar gospel for c6 tuning?

Larry Bell wrote a nice little summary of C6 chord theory on this (ancient) thread:

https://steelguitarforum.com/Forum5/HTML/005489.html
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James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 15 Apr 2021 4:32 am

That was super helpful! I also stumbled across this thread which links a bunch of others as well as has some diagrams right in.

https://bb.steelguitarforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=180350

James Polk · Post by **James Polk** » 15 Apr 2021 5:16 am

Alright new slight problem. Iâ€™ve fully reassembled the guitar after itâ€™s cleaning. I put it back together as close as I could from pictures. Everything seems to work as it should except that trying to tune any of the pedals has been terribly confusing. I understand how it SHOULD work, but I think I probably need to adjust barrel positions a bit before I try tuning the barrels. Is there any guide that explains barrel setup? Or do I just need to sink my teeth into it to figure it out.

Marc Jenkins · Post by **Marc Jenkins** » 15 Apr 2021 7:53 am

Do a forum search for Ricky Davis barrel and you should find plenty of excellent info on the r&b setup and tuning. Good luck!

Tucker Jackson · Post by **Tucker Jackson** » 15 Apr 2021 9:24 am

What Marc said. And you can PM Ricky if you get really stuck.

I don't know much, but I agree that you will likely have to adjust barrel postion before trying to tune. You need to have a tiny bit of slack in the pull-train when it's in neutral. Each changer finger needs start out in line with the others (fully against the stop) before you can start trying to tune the pedals... as in, don't want a string that's already being partially pulled by a too-tight barrel when you're trying to tune up the open note.