String bender options for lap?

[Marc Stone]

Looking to add some type of palm bender to my old Fender 8. Guitar has already been refinished and other work done, so I'm not afraid to mod it. I also have an extra control plate so no prob to mod that either.
Unfortunately there is not a lot of room behind the bridge to mount anything. I asked Certano, he said not enough room, although his footprint looks very small, wondering if it would if I cut the back end of the control plate.
Also could add a block of wood to lengthen it to accommodate an Asher/Hipshot bender, if I could find one.

Any thoughts on any of the various bender systems appreciated. I may just get an inexpensive 8 w enough room behind the bridge and mess w that.

Thx!

[Michael Stephens]

Hi - I had a Duesenberg multi-bender put onto an older Melobar Rattler, that works quite well. It took my local luthier a bit of creativity to line everything up (height-wise), but it ended up just fine. I bend the 2nd and third strings on an open D tuning, giving me a IV chord if I bend both.

[Kevin Parsons]

2" clear of the bridge is the absolute minimum depth needed to fit the Certano, the mounting plate is smaller than this, but the rocker sections that do the work will foul on the bridge if they don't have the 2" to move in. The contact point on the rollers that take the string ends are 3/8" off the guitar face, you would need the bridge to be a little taller than this to get some downward pressure there. Afraid I don't have any experience of other palm benders, but the Certano is nicely made and works well.

[Tony Boadle]

How about making your own? I've built and fitted a fair few, check the attached pics. Most parts off the shelf at the hardware store, just an hour or two to cut and shape some aluminum bar. That's two cut-down spoon handles by the way....my wife was not impressed!

[Louie Warren]

2" clear of the bridge is the absolute minimum depth needed to fit the Certano, the mounting plate is smaller than this, but the rocker sections that do the work will foul on the bridge if they don't have the 2" to move in. The contact point on the rollers that take the string ends are 3/8" off the guitar face, you would need the bridge to be a little taller than this to get some downward pressure there. Afraid I don't have any experience of other palm benders, but the Certano is nicely made and works well.

Just got a Certano to install on my Peavey PowerSlide. I have yet to take the time to see if it will work. The 2" is from where the strings rest on the bridge, correct? Either way, I need to drill holes in the bridge/tailpiece plate to install. I have an old National Dynamic and a D8 console, but I don't think they'd work either. Failing being able to install on the Peavey, I may have to build one, or purchase one with the proper clearance. Thanx.

[Kevin Parsons]

Yes, 2 inches clear of the back edge of the bridge. I've never had a Powerslide to try it out on, but looking at photos, the space behind the bridge might be OK but it doesn't seem to have the bridge height needed for the Certano. Also, the two " unbending " strings either side of it, might be in the way of the CT mounting plate, this seems to have been designed for guitars that have a wraparound type bridge or a string through the body design, leaving a clear area for it to be fitted.
I don't know what the Powerslide is made of, but assuming it's OK for drilling and will hold a screw under stress ( best to check first ) I think the simple approach would be to remove the whole bridge section, and replace it with some U channel aluminum. Get the right height to suit the job, drill to fix down, drill the back wall to take four ball ends and clear a way for the two other strings going back to the CT. Nothing you couldn't cover up at a later date by putting the original plate back on.

[Louie Warren]

Yes, 2 inches clear of the back edge of the bridge. I've never had a Powerslide to try it out on, but looking at photos, the space behind the bridge might be OK but it doesn't seem to have the bridge height needed for the Certano. Also, the two " unbending " strings either side of it, might be in the way of the CT mounting plate, this seems to have been designed for guitars that have a wraparound type bridge or a string through the body design, leaving a clear area for it to be fitted.
I don't know what the Powerslide is made of, but assuming it's OK for drilling and will hold a screw under stress ( best to check first ) I think the simple approach would be to remove the whole bridge section, and replace it with some U channel aluminum. Get the right height to suit the job, drill to fix down, drill the back wall to take four ball ends and clear a way for the two other strings going back to the CT. Nothing you couldn't cover up at a later date by putting the original plate back on.

Thank you! I will definitely do some checking on what I can do to install the Certano and post the results back here!

[James Inkster]

How about making your own? I've built and fitted a fair few, check the attached pics. Most parts off the shelf at the hardware store

Tony, I'm really impressed!
I'm building a lap steel right now and was planning to try to build some kind of bender for it eventually.
Would you be able to share any details about what these hardware store parts are?
Did you need to tap the threads?

Any more details/photos would be greatly appreciated!

[James Inkster]

... I was able to zoom in on my computer and I think i've got the gist of it.
Is the idea that the front bolts bottom out on the bridge itself?

[David Becker]

Tony,
A plus-one from me on more info if you are willing to share. I'm not building a steel, but I've modified a Rondo SX-2 a fair amount, and am considering adding a bender. There is plenty of room for one.
And a question: did you also make the bridge with the rounded top? Seems like it will be important to have a rounded bridge or rollers for the strings that are to be bent.
Thanks!

David

[Robert Millar]

I'm quite interested in fabricating a Certano design for my next laptseel , I've made a few Shad Peters designs and while they work pretty well , they are larger and more cumbersome. From what I gather visually they Certano model has bronze flanged cap bushings that the 2nd and 3rd strings roll under is that right? the ball ends sit on pins pressed into the finger blocks. Aside from milling the aluminum square blocks I'd require the bronze sleeve bearings with large enough flange to get the required string height and cap width to support the string as the levers are depressed, wondering what other mechanical challenges I'm missing ?

[Bill McCloskey]

I had a Duesenberg with the Benders. Couldn't stand it. First, I broke strings like crazy and the bender made changing them a pain in the butt. Plus it was always in the way. I sold it. Be careful what you wish for.

[Robert Millar]

I'm of the mind I can't live without them , the benders , the options for a six string lap anyway , needing the extra chordal and voicing options with a C6 tuning , they do get in the way , but I feel limited without them , haven't been breaking strings at all, esp with the roller bridge .

[Jim Pitman]

My 2 cents:
I'd like to see a lap steel with two left Knee levers. Your right knee would be captivated by a strap.
To me, this makes much more sense than having to employ your picking hand.
I hope to make one while I'm still vertical.

[Robert Millar]

I agree , having to contort my wrist to get both levers depressed while picking isn't natural , that's the reason to try the Certano design, but if that could be even easier deployed then by all means...

[Bill Hatcher]

My 2 cents:
I'd like to see a lap steel with two left Knee levers. Your right knee would be captivated by a strap.
To me, this makes much more sense than having to employ your picking hand.
I hope to make one while I'm still vertical.

i made a lap with a right knee lever. i just put a big T nut over on the left bottom side of the guitar and bolted in a nice size 4" bolt. when knee right is engaged the left knee made contact with the bolt hanging down and gave something to lever against. i need to make another one sometime. i like the palm levers and yes you will have to make some technique adjustments....but isnt that part of the fun?

[Ian Rae]

Keep going, fellas!

At some point one of you will invent the pedal steel

[Joe Cook]

Keep going, fellas!

At some point one of you will invent the pedal steel [/rquote]
!
Rimshot!

[Don Barnhill]

Keep going, fellas!

At some point one of you will invent the pedal steel

Very funny!

[Jim Pitman]

Yes very funny but ..... there's something to be said for showing up with a lightweight instrument you take out of a small case and start playing within minutes rather than after the typical half hour of setup and still be able to alter the the intervals between a couple strings while playing.

[Joe Elk]

And!!!!!!! the weight!!!!!!!!!
Joe Elk Central Ohio

[Ian Rae]

Yes very funny but ..... there's something to be said for showing up with a lightweight instrument you take out of a small case and start playing within minutes rather than after the typical half hour of setup and still be able to alter the the intervals between a couple strings while playing.

Of course, Jim - just kiddin' around!

[Joe Kaufman]

Bill, your kneel lever setup worked very slick. Much better than the palm levers on a hip shot which is the other option I have tried. I think the idea to wrap one leg and have two levers would be OK but one vertical bar (or bolt) on each side of your leg would work just as well and be a lot quicker to put on and off your lap.

[Joe Kaufman]

Pics of Bill’s old project:

[Robert Millar]

Bill Hatchers design looks intriguing , forgive my mechanical ignorance but what's going on here? Afaik the only mechanical work at play with palm levers is a basic fulcrum device , how does Bill's design actually change the string tension/pitch and which strings per se? Thanks !